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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

just had a run in with dd's preschool

50 replies

biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 10:38

hi ,
my dd started Montessori school in sept 09 , 9am - 12.30pm , i live in Ireland & therefore a new scheme has just started up here last week , this scheme entitles children of dd's age to free 3 hours a day sessions of pre-school , yesterday i asked her teacher if i could send dd in 9.30am -12.30 & therefore avail of the free childcare scheme , her teacher agreed to this yesterday but this morning has said no , she now is demanding 22.50 euro extra a week & told me that if i don't comply with this i can take dd elsewhere , this seems very unfair to me tbh as dd has health issue's to be considered & changing schools at this very late stage will effect her , i have rang my local county councillor who is involved in this new scheme to seek further information as to what i can do , but i am really upset now & am worried if i take action dd will suffer because of it ,
WWYD - pay the extra fees or fight for your child's entitlements ?
oh & her pre-school has signed a contract to say they will give parents an option of the 3 free hours per day ,

OP posts:
Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 12:14

poop would love to bring you with me to pick up dd you are much better with all this than i am .

OP posts:
pooexplosions · 13/01/2010 12:27

If you're in Meath/Louth/Nth Dublin I most certainly will come along if you like!

diddl · 13/01/2010 12:31

Why should it be free if the hours are 9-12.30?

pooexplosions · 13/01/2010 12:35

Because the rules of the scheme that they willingly signed up to state that they are required to give parents the 3 hours and only the three hours without demanding extra payment for extra time. Its really quite simple.
If they insist that all children must attend from 9 ti 12.30 they have 2 options

  1. give the half hour for free or
  2. withdraw from the scheme. It isn't compulsory.

What they cannot do is insist the OPs child attends for 3.5 hours and charge her for the half hour.

Not sure how much clearer I can be on the rules here.

lou031205 · 13/01/2010 12:38

Look, you used to be paying 51 euros for 3x3½ hours (10.5 hrs), so 4.85 per hour.

Now, your DD takes 5x3½ hrs (17.5 hrs, but 15 are covered by the grant, so there are 2½ hours left, which they want to charge you 22.5 euros, so 9 euros per hour.

Whether they are within their rights to charge you for the extra half an hour (in Hampshire, they must offer flexibility in return for the 15 hours funding, and are not allowed to charge for extras such as snack, but are allowed to charge for extra time, which your 30 mins per day would be), or should let you do a shortened day, the fact remains that they are now charging you double what they charged before Christmas.

If nothing else, I would want to know why the rate has suddenly doubled.

diddl · 13/01/2010 12:39

OK,wasn´t sure of the rules & regs!

I had the idea that Montessori is "structured" & that in that case children not attending the full session would be disruptive.

In that case of course, they shouldn´t have signed up.

pooexplosions · 13/01/2010 12:41

Lou, the rate is immaterial as the OP shouldn't have to pay anything at all.

Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 12:44

poopex `yes in north Dublin , could pick you up - i could even throw in a coffee . lol

*diddl - the 3 hours per day should be free which is what i want for dd , not 3.5 hours , as most of the time dd arrives there late after i have dropped my other dc to school , both start school at the same time & there's a 7 mile distance between both their schools .

OP posts:
Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 12:53

her teacher has just told me that she needs to speak to her friend who just happens to be the chairwoman of the schemes committee (i can forget about getting this sorted now so ) & she will get back to me , all this was said with a lovely dirty look in my direction ...

OP posts:
FabIsGoingToBeFabIn2010 · 13/01/2010 12:56

I am really not getting the issue.

Your child goes for 3 1/2 hours and you now get 3 hours free. They want to charge you for the extra half hour and you don't want to use the half hour. Is that it?

lou031205 · 13/01/2010 12:57

"Note: Services must ensure that parents are informed that their agreement to additional hours or to any optional charge is not compulsory and that agreement is not a condition of initial or continued enrolment and appropriate programme based activities are provided to children not participating in an optional activity where this takes place during the required period of pre-school provision" ECCE T&C's

pooexplosions, I wasn't disagreeing, just saying that I would want an explanation of why the rate was doubling also

Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 13:00

fab to cut a long story short yes , the extra half hour is more of a hindrance to me than a help tbh , as explained above ,
lou thanks

OP posts:
FabIsGoingToBeFabIn2010 · 13/01/2010 13:04

You haven't said anything nice about this nursery or staff so why leave her there? Were you using the 3 1/2 hours when you had to pay?

Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 13:06

poopex thanks for all your help explaining this scheme
all of my family who's children are now on this scheme are not paying any fee's at all now .

OP posts:
Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 13:09

yes i was paying for the 3 1/2 hours but dd mostly arrived late anyway in the mornings to which they understood because my other child's school is 7 miles away , so the 3 hours would suit me better , & the scheme covers those 3 hours iykwim .

OP posts:
pooexplosions · 13/01/2010 13:10

Fab, the issue is really simple. They have to provide 3 hours for free without requiring her to pay for the extra half hour that she doesn't want.
We aren't in the UK, and we don't have many services for pre-school children, the OP is entitled to something and they are trying to cheat her. Simple.

Biggirls, i am really {angry] on your behalf. If you want to name and shame them I will call them and tear them a new one of you like? And don't be worrying about your womans "chairperson friend", I'll sort her out as well!

SleighGirl · 13/01/2010 13:15

This is exactly the same as the NEG funded sessions in the England/Wales, the extra half an hour they can charge for but it is optional. If they refuse to let you only do the 3 hours then they are breaking the contract.

As a former pre-school treasurer I can honesty say we needed people to take the extra half an hour and pay for it just to break even because the NEG funding really didn't cover the actual costs of providing the service even though we were a charity!

Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 13:17

fab - dd's teacher is lovely & dd loves her , but unless hide & seek & hop scotch have been added to the Montessori curriculum then i haven't seen much evidence of arts & crafts or hand control in holding a pencil etc , i am teaching dd how to write her name etc myself , i leave her there because the only thing i cant do for dd is socialise her , she is a very clingy child & wont normally let me out of her sight , (waits outside the bathroom door even when i go to the loo) since starting school she has really come out of her shell to which i am delighted

OP posts:
Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 13:25

poopex - lol your my new best mate
sleighgirl dd's school is certainly not a charity run school , if it was i would be happier knowing the extra fee's were for a good cause ,

OP posts:
SleighGirl · 13/01/2010 13:40

I would write to them stating that your understanding of the rules is that if they offer the funded sessions that you cannot be charged for them and they can't force you to take your dd there for 9am!

Casserole · 13/01/2010 13:46

OP you are obviously in the right here, but might this be a good moment to stop and think about whether it's an opportunity to make some changes?

  1. You don't have faith in what they're doing with her there
  2. Relationships with the class teacher have clearly deteriorated over this,
  3. They're not flexible, and are trying to act illegally,
  4. It's SEVEN MILES between there and your other children's school, making your mornings much harder than they should be!

I know you say she loves it, has come out of herself loads, etc. Realistically she will do that elsewhere too.

You're totally withint your rights to fight this it seems. I'm just not sure why you'd want to.

Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 13/01/2010 14:00

casserole- yes you right , I'm just saddened by the way the owner (not dd's teacher thankfully) has changed her mind since i enrolled dd with them last September , i really think they are being unreasonable to advertise that they are going to support the new scheme fully & then once our children are enrolled & the scheme starts up they change their minds & add on extra charges . i have rang two other Montessori school that again are a 10 Min's driving distance & they are all fully booked up as all children that are availing of the scheme have to be signed up by Friday this week , so it looks like i either pay the extra charges or remove dd , ill pay the extra fee's if that's the case.

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Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 16/01/2010 10:32

an update - after a really crap week of arguing the toss with dd's preschool i have removed dd & gotten her into what seems like a much better school , her new school is on an acre of land & has a petting farm & paddling pool & dd will get to do an hour long dance class once a week & the scheme will cover almost all of this we only have to pay 10 euro a week , i have also heard that 4 more children from dd's old preschool are leaving as they have also been having trouble with the owner , two of these mothers rang me last night to ask the phone number of dd's new school , so with any luck dd will start her new school on Monday with two of her pals from her old school .

OP posts:
Casserole · 17/01/2010 20:31

Ah BGDC I'm really pleased to hear that, I'm sure she'll thrive there

Original poster
biggirlsdontcry · 17/01/2010 20:45

thanks casserole - its going to be like her first day of pre-school all over again , I'm more nervous than she is , she cant wait to go there tomorrow , i feel terribly guilty though , feel as though i am throwing her in at the deep end

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