to be really p***ed off with my landlord? (Sorry if it's long)

[bluesheep]

First of all, I know that legally the landlord has done nothing wrong, so my issue isn't really about what he has done exactly, I just want to know if anyone else would be as pissed off as I am.

We have lived in a privately rented flat since September, and this week we got a letter from the letting agents that the landlord wants the flat back, so we have until the 5th of March to get out. We only signed a 6-month tenancy so obviously he is doing nothing legally wrong.

However someone at the letting agency told us (on the quiet) that the landlord had admitted he only ever wanted someone in for 6 months and always intended to kick the tenants out after the tenancy expired.

This is the reason I'm pissed off. We would have never even gone for this property if we'd have known we'd have to pack up again in 6 months. Now I have to move for the third time in 12 months, and I'm just so sick of it. If it were just me and DP it wouldn't be so bad, but we have two DDs (aged 2 and 5 months) and it just makes it all so much more difficult.

On top of this I got a phonecall yesterday saying the landlord wanted to come and check the electrics at some point today (Wednesday), and was this convenient. I said it wasn't, as I wanted to be there when he arrived and I had plans all Wednesday. I was told this was fine. Then this morning at 9.30am I got another phonecall saying the landlord would be there at 10am. I reminded them that it wasn't convenient for me, but I was told basically that it was tough luck, he had his own key and he'd come in whether I liked it or not.

So I waited for the landlord to arrive. And waited. At midday he turns up, with his apprentice. What I thought was going to be an electrical check was actually a test for the apprentice - landlord just walked into each room and asked apprentice what he should be looking for. I was so annoyed - why should I have opened my home for a training exercise?

Sorry for the rant. I shall now go back to scouring rightmove and try not to take my anger out on the kids

firstly i would and have been annoyed in this situation, i moved in to a privetly rented house in july and 2 months later was told that the landlord only wanted short term tenants and that he wanted to do some renovation work and we'd have to move out in january (this month) luckly after talking to the land lord directly and by documenting what was said when we moved in and reading our contract we've just signed another 18 month contract. so yes you have every right to be annoyed, if the letting agency knew this at the time of your moving in, they are the ones in the wrong and you need to complain to the big boss person in writing.

secondly check your contract regarding notice for inspections etc, you will find that you should have around 2 weeks notice of any inspections or work being done to the property and then your landlord is allowed to enter the property with out you being there (only if stated in the 2 week notice which should be given to you in writing)

so i would say the letting agency is in the wrong here and tbh, i wouldnt want to stay with the agency or in the flat after this.

Thanks addictedtomn, I wasn't aware that they needed to give me two weeks notice for inspections - they told me yesterday that I needed to let a gas-man do a gas safety check as we were moving out, and he'll be here tomorrow.

I'm trying not to get upset by this, there's no point as we've got to go whether we like it or not, but it's really hard. We had to move when DD2 was only 5 weeks old and it was so difficult, so the thought of doing it again is just crushing.

However, I'm determined to think positive - perhaps the next place will be nicer than this one (even if it's just less damp that will be nice!) and we might even be able to stay for a whole year!

argh I hate this, especially lately there have been alot of people renting out hosues rather than having them repossessed so after 6 months they want to move back in (often without telling people this when they move in). I saw a couple who were doing this one th news a while back and felt an immediate dislike for them (yes unreasonable I know!)

We always ask in the agency who the landlord is how many houses they own etc, in my experience proffessional landlord who own lots of houses tend to be looking for longer term tenants - it means you are looking for a house with beige carpets and magnolia walls!. If you see a hosue that looks perfectly done out for a family then as a rule it has been and they will want it back!.

Things like this make me wish it was easier to save - we are supposed to be saving for a deposit on a house, but with paying rent bills etc etc at the same time we have save d grand total of about £2.50 - ah well.

You think that's bad? We signed a 9 month contract on our last place and one week after we moved in, we got a letter saying sorry, the original landlord wanted the place back so the lettings agent needed us out in the next six months! We were furious - they'd told us we could renew the tenancy after the 9 months so we'd seen it as a permanent place.

Nothing you can do, I think, but I agree it sucks. Btw, they have to give you 24hrs notice in writing if they want to come in, so if they phoned you, tell them to piss off.

check your contract there will be a notice period, i may be wrong for you it may only be 24hours by phonecall (highly doubtfull) but for me its 2 weeks in writing and our previous house was 2 weeks in writing.

i hope you do find a nicer place and get to stay for a whole year.

as far as moving out goes write up an action plan, what needs to be packed by when e.g. books first as not essentials so they will be packed 2-3 weeks befroe moving (but put a date) kids toys 1 week before moving with 1 box for day before etc etc. and stick to it. get lots of help and ferry your children out to friends and family there is nothing more stressfull than moving and having children there when your doing getting up set because their bed has been taken apart and put in the back of the van is not even worth thinking about.

i hope it works out for you

As you local friendly property manager (run my own property management company) maybe I can chuck in my tuppence (does anybody use that word anymore) worth.

{edit this is more like £50 worth, pull up a chair and get some tea. Sorry it is so long}

visits / inspections : Landlords have to give reasonable notice of any visit. You are quite within your rights to refuse. The contract can state it has to be 24 hours / a week / a month and that you have to agree. Bollocks. You do not. The Protection from Eviciton Act 1977 states that you be permitted quiet enjoyment and you are quite within your rights to deny access for whatever reason any time. Do not let your letting agent / landlord bully you.

I have had many a row with a landlord over him wanting to go in "but it says in my contract I can". Tough, Statute over-rides Contract so you can put what you like in the contract but if law states otherwise, well law wins.

If the landlord comes in without your permission when you are absent well you have grounds to write a very strongly worded letter of complaint to the letting agent and the landlord. It is trespass. Pure and simple.

six months tenancy: I do not know why landlords do this. It costs them money in letting agency set up fees / they can have a void period when they have no rent / and if rent drops before next tenancy they then lose out as well.

I do not deal in six month tenancies. I do a twelve month tenancy with a break clause at 6 months so that should the landlord or tenant want to leave, they can but that is invariably not used and everything ticks along for at least a year.

Can you talk to your landlord and see if you can stay? Why wouuld he want you to leave just to get new tenants in? That is madness.

littledragon If you have a nine month fixed tenancy, he can serve you Notice but it is worthless. YOu have that place for nine months. He cannot start legal proceedings to get you you before the end of that period.

I hate bullying landlords and agents.

As you might have guessed.

As you were

Happy to do stuff on email if people need me.

fernie3 - that's exactly what I think the sod has done. He's obviously wanted someone else to pay his mortgage while he was in a bit of strife, now he wants it back because he's back on the uppers. All very well and good for him, but cheers for screwing us over in the process.

littlereddragon - This will be the second time we've been done over. Previously we moved into a flat, then after 2 weeks landlady had an offer to buy so wanted us out. We accomodated her request, looked for somewhere else, found somewhere perfect, and asked landlady for deposit back on day of moving so we could give it to new landlord. In this time the sale had been postposed, so landlady refused, putting us right up shit creek as we had paid the fees to the new letting agents and those were non-refundable! Added to this she entered on at least two occasions without any consent (once we only knew as she had moved things, once I was in bed ill when she and an estate agent walked in!). So you'll understand I'm a bit anti-landlord in general!

addictedtomn Thankyou, I hope so too!

BigBadMummy Thanks for all your advice, wish I'd known I was allowed to refuse them entry. They really annoyed me this morning - I even had to remind them to shut my stairgate as they kept going up and downstairs and leaving it open. As the landlord wants to move back in himself I'm guessing there is no room for negotiation, but I'll definitely be begging your advice again if the bugger tries anything else! Always good to have someone with the correct knowledge in your corner!

Bigbadmummy, so good to have your advice (sorry OP - hijacking a bit but I bet you feel the same!)

I've had to explain to a few landlords that they can't come in whenever they like - the worst was a lady who simply got really upset and said it was her house ... took me + lettings agent a week or two to calm her down and we ended up moving out because it was so tense with her.

Re. tenancy/being asked to leave - I thought it makes a difference whether you pay in weeks or months? But yes, basically, we didn't have to go, but since they would have been stripping out the rest of the rooms and constantly needing to cut of electrics and water, it would have been (literally) living in a building site, so we cut our losses. Would have liked the finders' fee back though, that stung!

No problem LittleRedDragon - it's good to have advice from someone in the know!

ALthough I can sympathise with you in having to move when you don't want to- I don't understand why you signed a 6 month contract in this position and didn't stipulate a 12 month one- we are renting at the moment and I am also a landlord and these things are negotiable- you can generally find out what the likely intentions of the landlord are up front to a degree...

I do sympathise on the allowing the landlord in- ours seem to have decided that leaving us a message and then coming round anyway without a response is fine. That said I have had tenants who can never find a convenient time - even when its to do something they have requested

albinosquireel The lettings agency we are with only ever dish out 6 month contracts, and because we were already with them they agreed to not charge us fees for moving (which saved us around £200). I would have much preferred a 12 month contract but for some reason our agency just don't do 'em.

YANBU, the way you've been treated is really crap

name and shame the unscrupulous letting agency

I find it best to deal with professional landlords only, ideally directly

ALWAYS find out about the landlord's situation and do a search on when the property was bought and for how much to confirm details are accurate.

Well, I'm not sure I can say the name of the agents directly, but lets just say it sounds quite like 'Farmer Smell'

Hi,

Firstly, it is bad luck that you're having to move after just 6mths. But as you say, it was only a 6mth lease that you signed so the landlord is well within their right.

I'd echo what someone else (sorry, can't find the post now!) said about trying to find a landlord with several properties, rather than just the one. Seems like a good idea.

I'd also agree that the law is in favour of the tenant and you would have been completely within your right (in every sense) to refuse entry to your home. However. Just a thought... The landlord does have your deposit and if you make things awkward for him, he can choose be a right prat...

I had a friend who lived in her flat for seven years. I know her well and she's very house proud. During the seven years, the only damage to the (fully furnished) property was a ripped curtain, which she told the landlord about immediately. His response was that "these things happen" and not to worry about it. Before moving out, my friend cleaned the place thoroughly. She'd always paid her rent in full and on time. Model tenant. When she moved, she waited and waited for word about her deposit. Several phone calls later, the landlord informed her that he was keeping her money, as he'd had to replace the curtains (apparently buying the most expensive ones he could find), and all the cutlery. (When questioned about the cutlery, friend was told that there was apparently one teaspoon missing.) In addition to this, landlord claimed that he had to employ cleaners to get the place ready to re-rent. Friend didn't have a leg to stand on really. So while you do have rights and are perfectly entitled to stand up for yourself, just please bear in mind that this guy has a lot of your money, which he can choose to withhold, if he feels like being a prat.

whiteroses thankfully the law has changed since your friend started their tenancy. To avoid situations just like that: arsehold landlords.

All deposits now have to be held by the Tenancy Deposit Scheme to protect them from unscrupulous landlords.

Any disputes go to them and they decide so the landlord would have prove with the inventory and check out report that the damage was caused by the tenants.

No inventory or check out report? No chance?

Landlord inventory and check out rather than by an independent company? Slim chance of the landlord winning.

In your friend's case I would strongly suggest the tenant sue the landlord through the small claims court. The landlord cannot replace things just like that. THe age of the item has to be taken into account and then a pro rata amount charged. Anything else is "betterment" and illegal.

I get really pissed off when landlords try and do this.

And I am finding myself on my soap box on an almost daily basis now.

whiteroses (and apologies to bigbadmummy who knows her stuff better ... just realized this hadn't been said yet): I'd always take pictures of a place I rented at the start and end of tenancy. That way there's a record with a date on it so you can prove whether or not the place was how the landlord claims it was.

Very useful if they start blaming you for 'the chip in the kitchen tile' that was actually there when you moved in!

Hi BigBadMummy,

I see you're in England. I think things must be different down there. (Fairer.) I'm in Scotland. Never heard of the Tenancy Deposit Scheme.

My friend did consider the small claims court but said the curtain was ripped (in fairness, it was a small tear and she lived with it herself for long enough) and although she hadn't noticed a missing teaspoon, said she couldn't be 100% sure it was there. As for the cleaning, again, she had no proof that she left the place in a good condition. In the end, she decided she couldn't afford to risk having to pay fees, if the ruling didn't go her way. I told her that the landlord was taking the mickey, that the curtains were old and shabby when she moved in, and what had happened was only standard wear and tear and he was lucky there wasn't worse to contend with. (I mean, to have a tenant for seven years, and to only need to replace a pair of curtains and a teaspoon - pretty lucky landlord!) As for the teaspoon, I also pointed out that there was no need for him to have bought a whole new set of cutlery. And with the cleaning... The fact that it was his wife's cleaning firm seemed rather suspect to me... Still!

When I rented, I made sure that I was present when they checked the premises before I handed over my keys. And I took photos of EVERYTHING, just as I had when I moved in, making sure that everything was noted. Maybe a bit OTT but the sad fact is that you can't trust anyone.

Cross post, LittleRedDragon - great minds think alike!

Seems to me that your problem is with an unscrupulous agent not the LL re being given notice.

I would be suprised if the LL really did just admit that he only ever wanted short term tenants. Far more likely that he told the agent that is what he was after and the agents didn't mention this to you because all they were focussed on was their commission.

whiteroses I am sorry I jumped to conclusions and assumed you were in England. Forgot this forum went wider than that.

WIsh all tenants were like your friends. I would have happy landlords then!!!