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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think that if a couple split up both should stay nearby for the dcs,,,,,

58 replies

MrsNarcissist · 02/01/2010 15:07

My cousin recently left her dp, he was never abusive to the children although perhaps financially controlling with her and they had a fair few problems. He offered her the house and he'd find somewhere else to live. She had lived in the town for 18 years and 11 or 12 of which were with him so her entire adult life and the life of all of her dcs, 11, 6 and 1 were in this particular town. She left him and went to live in her hometown over 300 miles away. She has only been back about ten times and her mother, who she doesn't get on with, and sister live there. So she uprooted her children from their home and father in an impulsive moment, and they are left to see him only in school holidays.

Am I unreasonable to think that if you have children, except in cases of abuse, that you must remain in some sort of area so that they can see both parents?

OP posts:
Baileysismyfriend · 02/01/2010 15:43

Ummm I dont know if you are BU but I know I wouldnt move far away from DH if we split and he wouldnt either.

I think having your mum/dad in your life is more than spending a week with them during half term, its going to School plays, parents evenings, having their friends over for tea, all which can't be done when the two parents live so far away from each other.

I have friends who have made sure they stayed geographically close to their ExH for these reasons and it works very well for them and their DC.

GypsyMoth · 02/01/2010 15:45

er,why isnt the father making some sort of effort to get proper acess? its down to him to keep the relationship with his kids going.

assuming she didnt move out of jurisdiction,then she has broken no laws. why didnt the father file for a prohibited steps order?

Pikelit · 02/01/2010 15:50

I can't see how filing for whatever a "prohibited steps order" is would assist in maintaining a the good relationship between parent and children. People do sometimes move away and for perfectly good reasons.

purpleduck · 02/01/2010 16:09

Oh hbfac! Whew! Thought you'd lost it there

MrsNarcissist · 02/01/2010 16:16

She'd only visited her hometown 10 times in 18 years. I think she moved away as she is impulsive and didn't want to face people, which I think is not good enough.

OP posts:
Pikelit · 02/01/2010 16:21

You don't know though, do you? Unless you are reliably telepathic. Which is why I always think dangerous ground is trod when we assume we know other people's business better than them.

Wastwinsetandpearls · 02/01/2010 16:23

My dd lives the other end of the country from her father, we only did this with his agreement.

When I left my husband ( or rather he kicked us out into the streets when she was a newborn) I realised that I could not carry on living in London and my ex did not want me in the same city. We moved to grim northern home town where I lived for 6 years. DDs father went bankrupt and moved near grim northern town.

I was bloddy miserable lving in a racist, poor, mainly uneducated town with no prospects. I was teaching in a school where a shocking number were on the child protection register, at ;least 10% of girls were pregnant before leaving school, drugs and child prositition were rife.

So we moved, dd is now happier. Interestingly he met another girl had a baby with her and she fled the same grim northern town to live down south.

I think I made the right decision.

MrsNarcissist · 02/01/2010 16:26

She didn't tell him she was leaving, he found out when he tried to inform the dcs school that they wouldn't be in for a couple of weeks. The area she has moved from is a quiet town and she has moved to one of the largest, and poverty stricken, HA estates in the country. She has had little to do with her hometown and lived with my parents from the age of 16, as well as a time as a child, and had a good job in the town where she lived with her dcs. The job had an creche handy and promises of a career.
Her partner did seek legal advice but was told the law was only in his favour with his last child. Seems a little crap as she could have had the family home but he has no rights to ensure adequate access.

Each and every poster, aside from Riven, has talked about the rights of the mother and not the right of the child, each child, to have a relationship with both parents. A relationship that does not involve visits every few months. I cannot imagine robbing my children of their father without it being for reasons of abuse.

She left when her baby was just seven months old.

As for the 'real world' comment, in my real world (aside from my madness during PMT) my children would be my first priority.

OP posts:
MrsNarcissist · 02/01/2010 16:30

Wastwin, your baby was a newborn and her father agreed, i too think you made the right decision.

As for knowing what went on she did go and make accusations and said he was violent, but then withdrew that two counts when she wanted him to look after the children. He pushed her once seven years ago and then again a week before she left. Even then I don't think that's a good enough reason to uproot your dcs, kick your partner out yes, but take your dcs away from friends, school and their home???

OP posts:
WhatFuckingYearIsItAnyway · 02/01/2010 16:34

I think the woman moving back to her hometown, where presumably she has a large support network of family/friends is perfectly OK

who knows what went on in her marriage ? She could really need that support right now....it doesn't appear she would get any from you, that is for sure

hbfac · 02/01/2010 16:38

But MrsNarcissist - Can't you see ...

The overwhelming response to your OP is "Yes, staying nearby is the optimal solution". Come on, you knew it would be.

Why? Because that's how the majority of us think.

And likewise, you say we haven't talked about putting the dc first ... for heaven's sake ... it's so much of a given that women do this it's a fundamental premiss.

So why should you cousin's ex be so radically different?

You say you "think" - you aren't thinking, you're imagining, because you don't know, and you can't know because you have no observable facts to know with. In cases of marital break-up, (including those involving abuse,) that's often the case for those outside.

The questionis; what are you using to "think" with? You're putting a lot of suppositions in place of facts.

Why not start with the supposition that your cousin's ex actually thinks like the majority of respondents to your OP?

I really mean that "Why?". Because, while your cousins ex may be a loon, statistically it is more likely that she isn't, and has followed the same thought-processes as the rest of us.

So, statistically, you should be pondering why she's moved, and then your reasoning would have taken you in a completely different direction.

I'm sorry to go on about this, and after this ... perhaps inappropriate ... rant, I promise to scoot off. But the thing is, I think that what you're using to do your thinking with is a widely held cultural premiss that thinks women are a bit crap and are double crap if they leave marriages and steal the children. Which flies completely in the face of what we do know about women leaving relationship and how they think about their children.

It acts to subtly distance women from their emotions and their sense of their rights and their autonomy. It helps to lock a lot of women into less than optimal situations. It may not be the case here, but it's a prevailing mind-set.

And I have to return to the "not putting dc first". Please do some reading. Women in relationships generally weigh up their own lives against that of their dc and come to the conclusion that dc weigh more. And those that don't come in for ENORMOUS cultural opprobrium - of which your post seems to me to be an example.

It all adds up to making it very difficult for women with dc to keep a tight hold on their self-hood and their autonomy. And I'll be honest, I think it helps to enable abusers in those relationships where abuse does go on.

No, I'm not saying that happened in this case. Hell, I don't know. But the attitude of blaming the woman, of constantly negating a mother's autonomy is Not Helpful. An Must Stop. Now.

And yes, of course I think it's optimal for the parents to stay geographically close after a break-up. But then, most of us do.

Pikelit · 02/01/2010 16:39

You are being too simplistic (and wrong) in assuming that all of us, with the exception of Riven, are ignoring what is best for the children. But right now, if I don't get to Waitrose, things will be seriously wrong round here. So I shall return to this discussion later. Will to live permitting.

Wastwinsetandpearls · 02/01/2010 16:39

She was a newborn when we split, on his insistence I went to live up north while he stayed in London.

He then moved up north when dd was about 4. When dd was 6 we moved back down south leaving her dad up north.

hbfac · 02/01/2010 16:41

Just read "made accusations of abuse, which she then withdrew".

I really am off now ... .

BitOfFun · 02/01/2010 16:56

Oh, and moving far away isn't always harmful- my dd1's dad moved to Oz when we split up when she was a baby. They are in touch regularly, I kept visits open and stress-free from his parents and sisters, and she goes on holidays with him and is off to Oz for the second time this year. They have a great relationship and she has the opportunity to spend more time with him as she gets older. They cackle away on the phone with each other for hours most weekends.

So with a bit of effort on both sides there is no reason at all for it not to work well.

MrsNarcissist · 02/01/2010 16:57

SHE IS My cousin ( sorry sticky shift key) not him, my loyalty would be with her not him. So I do know this woman, she had lived with me for at least eight years of her life. i think she left, if i may be candid, because she got into another pile of debt and couldn't face her partner. They had got together on a whim and she got pregnant very quickly. She stayed because he had money in the bank and she left because she realised after twelve years that she didn't love him. she was also a size 24/26 and thought that noone else would fancy her, most of her old school friends where she came from are also big and I think she thought that she may well fit in there and there had been a school reunion and I think she had got some interest from old boyfriends.

You see hbfac, you seem to assume i know nothing of this girl and yet I know her well. i was using her case to point out a huge 'wrong' in the lives of children and their rights to have both parents around. This girl lived rent free with my parents and then left, in the same manner as this time, with a load of stuff in black bags and claimed that my parents kicked her out when she told them she was pg.... that's why she moved in with her dp in the first place. She also told her dp that my husband hit me often....the girl is a liar.

OP posts:
MrsNarcissist · 02/01/2010 16:59

She has cut ties with everyone, including the mothers of all of her dds friends, myself, my sister, parents and all of my extended family. i think this is a deceitful move.

OP posts:
MrsNarcissist · 02/01/2010 17:01

I AM NOT blaming her i am just saying that the children suffer by not seeing their father, a man who they were devoted to.

OP posts:
madamearcati · 02/01/2010 19:14

YANBU I think in most (not all) circumstances it is an extremely selfish thing to do.

paisleyleaf · 02/01/2010 20:16

The house, in a nice, quiet town. The good job, with a creche, career prospects etc
It sounds like it would've been easier for her to stay.
She must've put quite some thought into leaving all that, and decided it worth it.

Stephief · 02/01/2010 20:26

Its usually better for the kids if the parents can live near enough for the kids to see both, but I guess if the mums family is further away she should be able to go there if she wants her family around her too. She counts aswell, not just the kids.

My ex husband moved a short distnace away when we split (to be near his now-wife) should I have told him he wasnt allowed to go because of the kids? Not my place really. Its his choice.

People will do what is best for themselves when a relationship breaks down, its best to keep well out of it where you can.

KimiLovesHerFamily · 02/01/2010 20:48

When I split from DH1 I moved 10 minuets walk away, we have two wonderful children and it took both of us to make them it will take both of us to raise them, I have a new DP who has just changed his job and will be working for a firm in Dorset , (we live near Windsor) now I made it clear that no how no way were the children and I moving to Dorset, thankfully DP can work from home and only have to go to the Dorset office now and then.

I would never in a million years take my children away from their father.

mummytowillow · 02/01/2010 21:18

I did exactly the same, lived in Kent for 17 years, met husband there, had daughter, he left me, so I returned to my hometown and my family up North 300 miles away.

He was never abusive or controlling, he is a wonderful daddy, BUT he left me and her with what I consider no choice but to move. I couldn't afford the mortgage on my own, or the childcare as I worked full time, yes I had friends there, but no family what so ever. I needed my Mum, Dad and friends to help me as I was distraught, so move I did.

He comes to see her once a month and I took her down to see him at Christmas. Its not ideal for her but the best we can do at the moment, he left so he has to face the consequences.

scottishmummy · 02/01/2010 21:25

you don't know their private circumstances or preferences.so dont judge or guess the what and why of someone else split up

WhatFuckingYearIsItAnyway · 02/01/2010 21:39

mtw, I read your posts and you did exactly the right thing

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