to ask this parent to "supervise more", when my dd stays there?

[onthepier]

One of my dd's friends is a boy of her age, (10). He often stays here weekends and she is frequently invited there. His mum is different to me, apart from cooking a meal in the evening for everybody, she leaves her children to more or less fend for themselves in the daytime. She thinks nothing of sending her children, (aged 10 and 11) off on errands by bike, whether it's the supermarket, passing on messages, collecting dry cleaning, etc. They're allowed to go where they like (within reason), as long as they text her throughout the day so she knows where they are.

Recently my dd stayed there for the weekend and came home on the Sunday evening in a bit of a state. They'd been out cycling all day and she was absolutely exhausted, (it was hot weather). After questioning her, it turned out she hadn't had a drink since the night before, her friend kept taking her on all these long cycles, (routes she isn't used to as they live in quite a busy part of town, and every time they got back to the house his mum wasn't there. (My dd said there was nobody to ask for a drink or anything), her friend very rarely stops at all, to sit down, eat or anything.

I know my dd needs to develop her independence, (I'm maybe guilty of doing too much for her), but I feel a bit annoyed with the mum for just leaving them to it.
I've told her before that my dd is used to having an adult with her when cycling, we stick to country routes etc with not much traffic, and she certainly isn't used to cycling near dual carriageways, roundabouts etc. My friend's normally laughed it off though and said she'll be fine, her son is very road conscious and wouldn't let anything happen to them. My dd is apparently just told by her friend's mum to help herself while she's at there house, but she doesn't seem to like to. To be honest at our house, all of her and her brother's meals are either put in front of them, packed up for them, drinks offered at regular times and snacks within easy reach.

I'm going to have another chat with my friend, and poss say my dd won't be taking her bike there any more as I don't think it's safe. I'll pack her a few drinks and snacks next time she goes anyway, that she can get out of her bag any time without having to ask. I've told my dd I'm annoyed with her for not just filling a glass with tap water on such a hot day, and for not being assertive enough with her friend when he won't stop for breaks.

She literally got home that Sunday, burst into tears and her legs collapsed from under her! She then had two large glasses of squash and a long bath, within an hour she was OK again. Does anybody think it's more of a case of getting my dd to be more independent, or do you agree with me that my friend is in the wrong? Very difficult when people parent differently!!

My dd is a very confident, outgoing child at school and on her own territory, but she's not nearly so forthcoming with other children's parents.

I don't know.

Your friend sounds a bit like me TBH. If I'm not there DS#1 would help himself to food and drink for him and his friends. And I wouldn't object to him going off on his bike or skateboard for hours. Like your friend I rely on mobiles to get hold of him - rules are simple, if he doesn't answer his mobile he doesn't go out for a while. Most of DS's friends are local and their parents have similar expectations and attitudes to me.

However if he had a friend who had been invited to stay I would have more input in events I suspect. And I would try to ensure what is and isn't acceptable to the parent of the guest.

But the onus is on you I'm afraid to broach the subject now. And to teach your DD to stand up for herself. She is going to need to learn to ask for a drink if she needs one, and to say no when she doesn't want to do something.

You know what the parents are like, if you let your DD go despite that you can't really moan about it after!

I think your DD at age 11 should have had the gumption to turn a tap on, so i do think it's more about her getting to grips with helping herself if that's what they have been told to do.

A bit of both, I think. I am not so laid back as your friend, but I really would expect a thirsty child to be able to go into the kitchen and get themselves a drink of water. I have to say, I do give my children a lot of independence wrt going out and about by themselves but am a bit about a 10 year old cycling on dual carriageways and roundabouts. So YANBU at all at putting your foot down there if you feel your DDs cycling skills are not up to it.
But otoh your DD does sound like she is used to be waited on hand and foot by you, and that is an issue you need to tackle now.

YABVU You know what this family is like yet you still allowed your DD to stay with them, their house their rules.
As her mother you should have judged if she was capable to living in that environment.
A 10 year old should be more than capable to ask for a drink, are you sure she isn't exagerating?
I find it hard to believe she didn't have a drink for 24 hours yet she still managed to cycle for hours in hot weather and not faint.

I am probably a bit like your friend. I certainly didn't arrange all dd's food for her at that age, she knew that when she needed a drink she could go to the tap, and if she wanted a snack she could help herself.

I think if your dd has been told to help herself to drink/food at the friend's house that is exactly what she should be encouraged (by you) to do. And if she is a confident girl I am sure she will be fine with it once she gets used to it. And also encourage her to be more assertive with her friend, if she is knackered on the bike ride tell her to always stop and tell her friend that she needs a break.

When dd was your dd's age she cycled herself to football camp (about 4miles away) on her own, I think that is far preferable than having been driven there.

All this though is my parenting style, not others, and I know that some of dd's friend's parents do not even let their kids out to the shops on their own yet, or on a bus. I think they are probably a bit shocked that dd has had so much 'freedom' for so long.

No I agree with you. I wouldn't really want dd to go if this was the deal tbh. I suppose it boils down to that old chestnut of different families operate in different ways.

I suppose at 10 drinking is up to you. I don't remind dd to do it now. She makes breakfast and sometimes a sandwich. Not sure she'd feel confident to help herself at someones house, even if they said to.

Cycling without an adult near dual carriagways and then 'laughing it off' doesn't sound at all ok to me though. And although mine do go out to play, I like to know that it's not too far, where they are and to keep popping in. We haven't got into mobile phone territory yet.

Yes I agree at 10 dc need to learn some independance. But independance that is being monitored much more than that. What you describe is just fending for yourself for long periods and could be dangerous.

Do you feel obliged to let her go?

What does cycling near dual carriageways mean? I imagine a cycle path that runs parallel to the dual carriageway? Can't see that as a problem, to be honest!

And yes, I would question the no drink for 24 hours - what about breakfast, for example?

Don't pack her drinks and snacks. Tell her to go to the tap nad have a drink. She's 10 - she'll be at secondary school soon!

And even though she may have been apprehensive about driving on roads, she obviouslydid well. I would probably praise her for her obvious good bike skills, it may have been a baptism of fire for her, but she has got to learn good riding skills sometime, and this will stand her in good dtead for the future.

Oh, I missed that she was cycling NEAR dual carriageways rather than on them.
And should have said, do not think of packing her drinks and snacks. You really need to be helping her to be more independent and that is just enabling her avoidance tactics.

YABVU. My parenting style is very different to your friend's, so I just wouldn't send my child there. Not send her there regardless and expect the friend to obey my rules.

I think when you have a guest you do your best to help them be comfortable - it's just good manners. If she needs a bit of encouragement to take a drink, I would practise this at home, praise her for being brave with the cycling, and maybe say to your friend that your dd is just a little bit shy about helping herself and would she mind reassuring her that it's ok to help herself.

Only you know if the level of freedom is appropriate for your dc - it wouldn't be for mine.

Thanks for your posts, I feel I should make it clear that although my dd has been to this friend's house several times before and stayed the night, it's always been because they're being taken to the funfair/celebrating a birthday/going to the cinema etc. She's been there just for tea after school many times too, and has been on cycles with this friend, but this is the first time she's stayed a whole weekend with nothing set planned.

I suppose I was just a bit at the whole "fending for themselves issue" for two days solid, I'm all for children learning independence and I do admit that my dd relies on me too much. However, for the last month she's had her own mobile phone and I've been actively when we're out, saying "I'll be over there with your younger brother, here's some money, have a go on that ride, choose something for lunch, etc", and she's getting better on that score.

I'm not obliged to send her to this friend's, but they get on extremely well and if she's invited she can't wait to get there, (a different experience from what she's used to, but poss good for her independence). I will have a word again about the cycling though, I think my friend has always allowed her two so much independence that she's often a bit by other parents at school whose children don't even go to the local shop by themselves, etc.

Btw, they're not cycling on the dual carriageway, there are two busy roundabouts next to each other, one that leads off to the carriageway. My dd reassures me that her friend knows where to go so they don't cross any roads, but in the next breath she said they have to wait ages for traffic to pass, so I'm not quite sure!

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I let my DS cycle without an adult, but I do think there is an issue with a child going on roads that are busy and that they are unfamiliar with.

The water thing is silly though. At 10, your DD should be able to get her own drink. I think she should be able to prepare food and drinks and cook using an oven/hob before she gets to secondary school and has to do food technology (or whatever they are now calling cooking).

I wouldn't be happy with a 10 year old cyclimg on or near very busy roads. But YABU about the drinks, At 10 she is old enough to either ask her friend to get her a drimk or to get herself a glass of water.

I would have no problem with dd (9) cycling on or near busy roads with a friend who was familiar with them.

As for drinks etc, I would expect her to either ask or help herself. I can't see dd not asking (or insisting) if she were thirsty.

You could try sending her texts every so often reminding her to get a drink!

I think Yabu. You know the parents, you know the environment, this is an excellent opportunity for your dd to learn some independence. A ten year old should know to get a drink or a snack. My 7 year old boy will know to fetch a glass of tap water, if he thinks we are too slow up in the morning, he will even get his own breakfast. He knows where cereal bowls are kept, cereals, milk and juice,and he can get it himself. If a 7 year old boy can, then it should not be too taxing for a 10 year old. Granted she is not in her home environment, but you should encourge her to help herself to foods and snack. Send a drink bottle with her next time that she can fill with water and take out on her bike.

To me, it sounds like a perfect weekend. Active healthy kids out on bikes, building stamina and muscle. All your daughter needs to do is learn to assert herself and cater for her own basic needs.

YABU...and as for no drink offered....well...there are always tabs one could drink out of, surely...if one is thirsty water will do?

Tbh, I think your friends mother attitude is ratehr healthy, all in all....as long as there is some input , etc....

But than, I suppose that mum you are talking about could be me,...so, I suppose I would say YABU to you