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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to close the door in the tv licence man's face?

80 replies

Upwind · 22/05/2009 13:07

we moved house just before our DD was born a few months ago. I remember my DH saying he would sort out the tv licence transfer, but can't be certain that he actually did, and can't reach him at work today.

We live in a flat and our buzzer rang a few minutes ago. They man had a heavy foreign accent and refused to say why he was calling, but kept repeating "just open the door".

So I didn't let him in. But one of my neighbours must have because he started knocking on our door a few minutes later. I was feeding DD and assumed it was a novice salesman or wrong address so did not hurry to let them in. He kept knocking aggressively.

When I did open the door, I felt rattled. I did not think to ask for ID and was not offered any. I told him that my DH looks after the TV licence and would sort it out. He demanded my personal details very insistently. I closed the door in his face and now suspect that was a mistake Will obviously sort out licence today... but was I unreasonable?

OP posts:
Kiwinyc · 23/05/2009 11:05

The threat of being caught and fined is enforced with heavy-handed intimidation. Its unbelievable that they're allowed to operate in such a way in a democratic society.

From wikipedia:

'In September 2008, [snip] and during December 2008, it was reported by the press that the chairman of the all-party Commons Culture, Media and Sport committee had accused TV Licensing of behaving "like the Gestapo", employing "tactics that are outrageous", saying: "The tactics used by TV Licensing in their letters are intimidatory and cause genuine distress. Their records are not always correct, but they write letters that assume members of the public are criminals"[17].

Meanwhile, in 2004, the Institute for Public Policy Research criticised the TV licence fee for its regressive impact, pointing out that it represents a much higher proportion of income for low-income households, that evaders are most likely to be single parents, lone tenants, pensioners and the economically inactive, and that the difficulties they have in paying the licence fee are compounded by the penalties enforced for non-payment[4].

'TV Licensing enforces the BBC's statutory obligation to ensure that every address where a television licence is required is correctly licensed,[42] but its agents have no special rights and, like any other member of the public, rely on an implied right of access to reach the front door.[10][53] The occupants of a visited property may deny an agent entry to the premises[55] without cause and are under no obligation to answer any questions or enter into any conversation. If an agent has evidence that television is being watched or recorded illegally but is denied entry by the occupants so that (s)he cannot verify the suspicion without trespassing, then TV Licensing may apply to a magistrate for a search warrant, but the use of such warrants is rare.[44] The BBC states that a search warrant would never be applied for solely on the basis of non-cooperation with TV Licensing[56][53] and that in the event of being denied access to unlicensed property will use detection equipment rather than a search warrant.[55]

The law allows a fine of up to £1,000 be imposed on those successfully prosecuted. This figure is frequently publicised by TV Licensing to maximise deterrence. In reality, magistrates rarely impose the maximum fines allowed to them by law. During the year 2005-6, the average fine including costs was approximately £153[57] (slightly more than the cost of a licence). However, in addition to the fine the guilty party will be obliged to purchase a licence at the usual cost and will be encumbered with a criminal record.[58]

TV Licensing is managed as a sales operation[48] and its officers are motivated by commission payments. In 2005, a TV Licensing officer was found guilty of false accounting and perverting the course of justice after he deliberately forged the confessions of four people to obtain commission payments.[59]'

I would be less disinclined to pay if the TV licensing comission operated transparently and the BBC were honest about exactly where and how the money is spent, but this is not the case.

Snorbs · 23/05/2009 11:43

FAQingLovely, it's quite possible that the person who fined your parents didn't "detect" your TV by any more complex a method than noticing the distinctive, flickering glow through your bedroom window. But they have had computerised records for a very long time - if it was recent enough that you had a screen used for a home computer, it was easily recent enough for the entire TV licensing database to be on a BBC mainframe computer.

It is technically possible to detect a TV from a distance as TVs emit a range of frequencies which "leak" back up the aerial cable (hence why cable TV and satellite TV make it harder now - no aerial). It was also easier 20 or 30 years ago when TVs were big, high-powered and not well shielded. It's a lot harder now and with things like LCD and plasma screens the signals they emit are a lot different than a hulking great CRT.

But, as I understand it, they very rarely bother. There may be one or two vans equipped with such stuff for marketing purposes, and there are more vans that have nothing more in the back than a chair and a packet of sandwiches. They drive up and down the local roads a few times to be seen by the local populace, and wait for the license applications to come rolling in. Or, they just wait until night then pull up outside a house that doesn't have a license and watch the windows for the distinctive, flickering light.

It's a lot quicker, easier and more effective to do it that way than by using signal detectors, IF amplifiers, frequency analysers and all the rest of the stuff you'd need to detect the signals remotely and then try to work out exactly which house they came from.

Ivykaty44 · 23/05/2009 11:59

sorry it was this one

FAQinglovely · 23/05/2009 12:05

ermm they wouldn't have seen a glow - it was broad daylight and the bedroom at the back of the house - and it was an ancient BBC Micro computer

FAQinglovely · 23/05/2009 12:06

should add my dad bought the old beeb the year they were available for the public to buy it (we also had the internet shortly after it was "invented" too)

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