to be upset I am being paid 0.5 when I will be at work three full days a week?

[basilbrush]

I am a teacher in a private school which are notoriously unhelpful in these areas but wanted to rant anyway...

My maternity leave ends in a month and once again, I am going back to teach half a timetable. So I am being paid 0.5 even though the lessons are spread out over 3 full days so I have to be on campus from 8.30 - 5.30 on those days.Apparently it is beyond the realms of possibility to rearrange the timetable and give me a half day off.

This was bad enough when I just had DS but now I will also be putting DD in nursery. Basically, three full days childcare fees times two kids equals my 0.5 salary. So I will earn diddly squat for two years until DS starts school.

I have asked school to give me more lessons on those days and please put me up to 0.6, that way I would make £200 a month after childcare. But instead they have given more hours to my colleague who is full time. This is a cunning move to save cash as "full time" can be anything from 30 to 35 lessons a week so basically he has to do the extra work for no extra money whereas if they put me up to 0.6, they'd have to pay me for the lessons.

AIBU to be annoyed? Is there any other job where this would happen? I know times are hard for private schools but there also hard for the staff who work there!

thedolly Hello! Obviously I use my free periods to do planning and marking,I have plenty to keep me busy!! Shopping would be lovely but staff are expected to be on campus all day, we can only leave between 1-2pm for lunch if not on duty in dining room unless we have medical appt etc

I love my job, I love teaching in this school and I really what to keep working part-time because for me it is the right balance. This is a situation I have already put up with before having DD when I came back after having DS. I was just saying that things are now even more exacerabted by having two sets of childcare fees but it's not forever, only two years and we'll survive

My main point was that it'd be nice to earn SOME residual income but hey, I chose to have kids and I'm choosing to work while they're of pre-school age so I accept I just have to lump it

basilbrush - I don't think you'll get any more money out of them but you may be able to negotiate time off campus.

Good luck with it all and keep smiling .

Presumably if you want your children to go to the school you will also get a fee remission, so in financial terms it's probably worth gritting your teeth and bearing it for a couple of years if you have established longevity and terms of service, rather than starting all over again somewhere else.

Indeed becky, there is a seriously huge fee remission on the horizon to the tune of 70%! This means we could send two DCs to private school for much less than it costs to send one to nursery. Which is another reason I am hanging on in there and thinking longterm...

Im a part time state teacher, if a non contact period (not PPA time)falls between periods you are teaching, they have to include that in your hours. it is on the NUT website. Ive forgot te phrase they call it, il look it up for you.

I don't undertand why you have to be on campus the whole time. They should decide on your contracted hours, with the rest of your time your own.

I wouldn't agree to it if it doesn't make any financial sense. I'm in the process of adjusting my part time hours (increasing from 3 days to 4) and my boss suggested 5 short days instead of 4 full days. When I pointed out that I'd have to pay for 5 days of childcare for 4 days pay as well as extra travel & parking expenses he realised what a stupid suggestion it was!

cascade - that will be helpful for me next year - cheers

They've never been that enlightened on the whole HR front. Four years ago we were all told over coffee that as of the following term "full time" would be increasing from 25 to a minimum of 30 lessons per week and all part time posts would be adjusted accordingly. Salaries would remain the same.

This represented a contractual change for 50 members of staff, imposed on us with no consultation whatsoever. This is completely illegal but nobody dared protest and the changes went ahead.

But hey the holidays are damn good

Surely if you're not in lessons they need to decide if you're working or not. If you are fine, but that should be paid. If not then you're free to do what you like and they can't demand you stay on campus!

its called trapped time.

Just got back to this thread. Sorry if my first post was unclear.

To clarify: you are teaching 0.5

A teacher who wants to work part time like this, quite understandably wants to have this as a block of time - ideally in school continuously for 2 and a half days, and then off for 2 and a half days.

Problem is, school timetables don't work like this. If you are teaching, eg English, the school cannot squeeze all the English lessons for your classes into the days that you want to come to work! Pupils need to have a good balance in their timetable. So the alternative is to split your classes - ie: you teach them some of the time, and other people the rest of the time.

Problem with that, is that it isn't alwayss best for the pupils, and it definitely creates more work for colleagues. Even where it works well (and I accept that in some cases it can be good for pupils to have fresh input) you can't deny that it creates extra work for colleagues, as to plan effectively, assess effectively, write reports, ensure continuity etc, it actually means quite a lot of liaison. And for some classes, it is definitely not best anyway. I teach, and currently share a couple of classes to accommodate part time staff, and I actually feel it's very unfair on the children. They are Year 7, so getting used to dealing with large numbers of teachers rather than one class teacher anyway, and to throw two teachers into the mix for one subject just creates extra pressure on them.

S0... to be honest, if you have 0.5 across 3 days, I actually don't think you're doing badly at all! I think it's very dodgy that the school are telling you that you can't leave the school site during times that you're not actually paid. But other than that, I think you'll have to just put up with it or find another job.

Someone suggested that the school ought to *'find you something else to do' to bring your hours up to 0.6, but I totally disagree. It isn't an employers job to 'find' things for the employee to do to fit exactly the hours they would like to work! The world of work doesn't operate like that!

I'm disgusted that they expect you to be on campus for 3 full days, but won't pay you for 3 full days.
You really should take this issue up with the school.

Go off shopping during your unpaid times!

They have two options then - either confront you and tell you that you're 'not allowed', in which case you tell them that they aren't paying you for that time, and therefore have no claim on you.
Of they'll just let it go and ignore the fact you're not on site. I would imagine this is the more likely outcome.

Yes I agree - they can't demand what you do in time they're not paying you for!

I am a teacher in the state sector and have my lessons spread over 4 days. It comes with the territory IMO. However there are benefits e.g. I am not a form tutor so I can come in literally 5 minutes before my lessons start. I do not do break duty either. Part time jobs are not easy to find, so I count myself lucky that 3 days per week I can drop my kids at school or pick them up.

You only have 2 years until your youngest is at school. I would let them know that you will be off site when not contracted or they pay you. Then go and sit in a cafe for 50 minutes to make the point.

I also think it is shocking that they expect you to stay on campus when you are not being paid. Don't know enough about teaching to comment on the rest and sitting on the fence after comments on here help me to see both sides really.

But I would def do as violethill suggests and tell them (rather than ask them) that you will not be on campus during the time you are not being paid. Why would they expect you to be there anyway? If they are not paying you its hardly as if they can ask you to do anything during those times?

Although it is an absolite pain in the arse, sometimes you have to take the long view.
You want to keep your job here, you like the school, you'll get a mahoosive fee discount in te fullness of time.
Saying bollocks and going elsewhere might result in a job you hate and no fee discount - what's the point of that.
Why not just slide into the heads office and have a chat, saying you'll need to pop out during your 'trapped hours' - I doubt there's be an argument.

If youa re expected to be on campus from 8.30 to 5.30 three days a week then you are working three full days a week (actually teaching or not) and you should be paid for them. If you are allowed to wander off and do your own thing then they are being as fair as they can be.

I work .6 over four days too, but my time is blocked. What is completelty unreasonable is to split time over the whole day. How many professional jobs ask you to come in lets say 9-10 then back again from 2-3. I dont think its reasonable to say put up or change jobs. or children are effected by the disruption. I share a few classes, we follow the schemes of work that are set by the department, we assess together. Never has it been an issue. The teacher may not want to leave, they may have developed years of relationships with the pupils. I would rather plan the timetable (and it is easily ajustable with a bit of effort) around a good member of staff, than they leave and a new teacher has to replace them, and start all over again. It takes years to develop these kinds of relationships with students. For years head teachers would use split time for part time workers, knowing full well that teachers could not do it so would have to go back full time. It could be classed as discrimination (read the NUT guidelines)

Of course an employer wants to keep good members of staff cascade! Why on earth would they not want to? Apart from anything else, advertising and recruiting costs a HELL of a lot of money. Plus, teaching is one of those jobs where as you say, the relationship built up over time is valuable.

I am on the Senior Management Team in a secondary school, and believe me, we have nothing to gain by losing good members of staff. All schools are under huge pressure to meet attainment targets these days, and we are hardly going to say goodbye to good members of staff for no reason!!

HOWEVER, there also needs to be recognition that at the end of the day, schools operate 5 days a week, and our purpose is to deliver the best education we can to all the children - NOT to try to accommodate the wishes of each individual member of staff. Timetabling around part time staff is NOT easy. It's a nightmare. You end up with unbalanced timetables (eg pupils getting a glut of one subject at one end of the week.} Or you force classes to be split, which CAN create more work for colleagues and be less good for the pupils. The timetable should be put together with the needs of the pupils coming first, not the wishes of part time staff! That's not discrimination. It's just running a school properly.

If people want to work part time, then that's fine if the job that need doing is part time, or if the job can be done on a part time basis without compromising the clients (in this case pupils) or colleagues. But I'm afraid the reality is that some women believe they have a right to a part time job on their terms, and this simply isnt the case.

Yes I know the issues around time table. I have been there and done it on a number of times. What should not happen is split lessons, if it does happen then the trapped time has to be paid. You know how timetabling works, the SLT will give you the timetable of classes, the HOD will then have the total number of staff/ hours of staff they have in the department. The HOD will then allocate the classses to the teacher. It is not hard to try to block time for the part time teacher. Its not that hard.

Yes I know the issues around time table. I have been there and done it on a number of times. What should not happen is split lessons, if it does happen then the trapped time has to be paid. You know how timetabling works, the SLT will give you the timetable of classes, the HOD will then have the total number of staff/ hours of staff they have in the department. The HOD will then allocate the classses to the teacher. It is not hard to try to block time for the part time teacher. Its not that hard.

That sounded a bit harsh, I agree with you violethill on many points. what I disagree with is split lessons. This should be avoided at all costs, if it does happen then teachers must be paid for the trapped time. What has happended historically that poor head teachers have used this strategy to stop teachers becoming part time. Thats the issue I have.

It's not hard cascade! I know that! I could easily sit down and allocate a nice block of time - eg Mon and Tues for someone who wants to work two days a week. Trouble is, I either force all the lessons for certain classes into those two days, which is clearly not in the interests of the pupils who will then have a hugely unbalanced timetable. OR I have to split classes between two teachers, so that the lessons are balanced across the week but not taught by one person. And in some cases that CAN disadvantage pupils, which is not fair on them, and it can disadvantage the colleague, who will then be teaching a greater number of pupils overall, which has huge implications for day to day liaison, assessment, marking, planning, parents evenings.......