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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To really dislike South West Water the money grabbing wotsits?

33 replies

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:05

It is long, I am about to rant. If you make it as far as the bottom feel free to comment.

18 months ago we changed from rates to water meter in an attempt to save money. Our rates were £45 (now like £50 or so) and we were anticipating getting our water down to about £25-£30, the average we were told for 2 adults was £25 so we thought, with DD, would be a touch higher.

I had an outstanding amount of around £50 or so brought across, and set up a direct debit of £30.

We live in a two bed flat, my DH, me and DD aged now 2.8. We shower probably every other day, using a non-power shower. DD mostly jumps in the bath at the same time and plays in the water we use. Occasionally (perhaps once a week?) she has a small bath of her own. We bath occasionally too, share the water with each other and DD. We do not flush each time we pee. We use the washing machine every other day, using economy settings. We do not run the water when we wash clean our teeth, do not have dripping taps, re-use bath water to water plants.

We have just received a letter from South West Water stating our DD is going up to £69 per month .

Apparantly we have an outstanding balance of £312, and this is to clear the debt. Apparantly our water consumption is £41 per month. So, therefore neither the DD, or the outstanding amount makes sense.

If we pay £30, and our usage is £41, then we owe £198 (? thereabouts), not £312. So there is a difference of £114. She said it also reflected a rise of 4.8% (which I did not know about).

She then said there was an outstanding debt of £300 from prior to the meter being installed. I said that still not make sense. Firstly I did not owe this money, and secondly if I did, I would by their own calculations then owe £498, not £312!

I asked her where this alleged debt came from, she said prior to the meter being installed. I asked when, she said she did not know. I asked her to find out. She asked for what period did I want to know. I said as far as it goes until my account was Zero balance. She went off, came back, said, they can't go that far; she is only able to go back as far as 2007. I said in that case, i would use my rights to request my information as per Data Protection Act, as they cannot demand money from me if they cannot evidence that I actually owe it.

I told them in the meantime I will cancel my DD and pay £41 per month manually. She said they would chase me for the outstanding balance. I said if I got evidence (which I know they cannot give me) I owe them the money I would pay it, if not, they can take me to court and prove it to the court - which would them show they lied to me either way I wont pay them £69 per month for water I hardly use. I said that my calculations, taking off this alleged £300 owed, means I owe £312, minus £300, plus £50. So I owe them £72, but as I am now disputing it they can wait for it.

So I am I being unreasonable to think they are greedy bastards?

Rant over. For now.

OP posts:
dragonbutter · 22/03/2009 10:12

Good for you.
If you're sure you don't owe it and they can't prove it, then why should you pay it.

Bit rubbish though. poor you.

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:16

Thanks Dragon - I just cannot beleive we are even using as much water as £41 per month, I don't even let DH flush the loo before he takes a crap like he used to do!

OP posts:
dragonbutter · 22/03/2009 10:17

he did what? have you checked he's not secretly installed a water feature?

hey, you still up for exeter meet up next weekend?

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:18

I know I owed £50, expected that to get swallowed up with my £30 payments.

The woman said she can't evidence the £300 owed now as it no longer technically exists as it has been replaced by the new bills!!!! WTF! I told her that if they were to fo example take me to court to get this money back, they would have to provide some evidence that this money is owed. If so, I want to see that evidence and she is saying she cannot do so.

OP posts:
dragonbutter · 22/03/2009 10:19

can you ask to speak to someone more knowledgable?

JazzHands · 22/03/2009 10:25

I don't understand - how can they start charging you for something like that without a bill letter etc to say they're going to do it.

Same as the leccy and gas people they abuse the Direct debs that people set up.

What gets on my tits is that when i lived in a flat by myself and was out at workmon-fri and if I'm honest out/in the pub the weekedn they said they couldn't fit a meter so I had to pay the £££.

Now I am working part time with DH and DD around so all washing etc loads more water suddenly my house has a meter.

Fuckers.

JazzHands · 22/03/2009 10:26

pavlov if they contac you about this again get it all in writing.

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:28

I can, but its not worth going down that route. I have told them I am putting my count in dispute which means they cannot chase this money until they prove how I owe it. Fortunately for me I know how these things work.

They told me the least they can reduce Direct debit to is £60, so i told them I would cancel it and just pay the water I am estimated to use until I get the evidence I require.

I do not beleive them so no point talking to another muppet to continue trying to baffle me.

OP posts:
andlipsticktoo · 22/03/2009 10:29

Blimey!
We are with SWW too and are still on rates.
We pay £67 pcm for 10 months of the year and I was thinking of changing over to a meter to try to reduce that, but now I'm not so sure. There are 5 of us and my washing machine is on hte go constantly!
Could they have got their readings wrong, especially as you are in a flat? Could it have been confused with another flat?

iamaLeafontheWind · 22/03/2009 10:30

You know you are right, keep at then.

But one thought - did they charge for installing the meter?

edam · 22/03/2009 10:31

Grrr at South West Water on your behalf. Is it worth trying Trading Standards?

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:32

Jazz - I agree completely, they are fuckers indeed. They do not have any right to take any money from my bank account, which I think people may not realise. They will not just tell I owe money and they will take money from my account. It is not their choice to make. Hence I am cancelling my Direct Debit.

OP posts:
immigrationofficer · 22/03/2009 10:35

They are bastards. I had a flat in London that was empty for over a year as i was working abroad and had to pay full water rates. I don't pay any of my utilities by monthly direct debit because they are so confusing and i do not trust them not to steal money.

I have a friend who works for British Gas and he gets old ladies ringing up all the time crying about their bills - he's nice though and lets them off

Anyway, I namechanged for the ILR thread but must change back now.. seeya.

nametaken · 22/03/2009 10:35

I would say the average water charges are £100 per person per year.

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:38

They did not charge for meter,as we wanted it put in to reduce our bills given that we do not use much water.

I said I wondered if we are paying for another persons water (in a flat), she is sending out paperwork, we have to go through some 8 point thing to see what water we use, then we have to go to the landlord down below, turn off our stopcocks, blah blah blah, we have to evidence it. If we suspect after all that there is a problem, we have to pay £69 for a bloke to come and check it.

Andi - i would not bother! Thing is, friends of mine pay £70 per quarter, sw water and use about the same as us (minus one child, but can a child really use 2thirds again in water? er don't think so!)

OP posts:
nametaken · 22/03/2009 10:40

I would say that children use the same amount of water as adults. They have the same amount of washes, wash the same amount of clothes (if not more) and wee as much. In fact, if anything, I would say a child uses more water than an adult.

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:43

nametaken - double the amount of 2 adults though? how would they use more? DD is 2.8, shares our bath/shower water, wears clothes more than once.

OP posts:
JazzHands · 22/03/2009 10:45

Our DD doesn't use much water. We rarely wash her

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:46

Jazz - LOL nor us with DD! She looks filthy whether we wash her or not, so no point eh?!!

OP posts:
JazzHands · 22/03/2009 10:47

How long have you lived there pavlov?

Could it be a debt from before you moved in that they are trying to claim back from the wrong people?

Have you kept you bills?

If you have and they say £x and you paid £x and you were paying a rated amount there isn't wany way they could have miscalculated as it is a fixed amount IYSWIM.

nametaken · 22/03/2009 10:48

It must just be mine then they keep leaving the bloody taps on - plus in the summer they play for hours with the hosepipe on in the garden .

To the OP, we are southwest water but your water consumption does seem very high.

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:51

I have some bills haphazard. But they have to by law give me copies of the bills I do not have when I send them £10 and cite Data Protection Act.

It is not from a previous person, or else they would have asked for it by now!

OP posts:
pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 10:51

Been here over 3 years!

OP posts:
nametaken · 22/03/2009 10:55

could you have an undiscovered water leak?

pavlovthecat · 22/03/2009 11:01

nametaken - yes, I think that is possible. But apparantly that is our responsibility to sort out too as we own the pipes leading into our property. It appears we have to do everything first, before they do anything to earn their money.

OP posts:
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