AIBU to be sad and shocked by this article?

[LittleDorrit]

Have just been reading this:

www.guardian.co.uk/society/2009/mar/18/child-poverty-labour-eradicate-promise

and I am shocked by the conditions this family is living in, but in particular how little/what sort of food they are able to afford.

It's not so much an AIBU issue, but just wondered whether others in similarly difficult circumstances think this is typical, or whether the mother could try to buy other types of food (e.g. rice, lentils, etc.) or perhaps be able to afford to spend a bigger proportion of her budget on food... £20 is very little.

I read that book morris i found it fascinating

tinysocks didn't say where they live. If they live in, say, India then I for one do not want us to adopt a similar attitude to the poor.

We did used to have a 'work or fuck off' policy in this country and people died of starvation. I certainly don't want a return to those values. Any of us could find ourselves in need, and a safety net needs to be there, whether or not we endorse the lifestyle choices of the poor.

I don't want to live in the USA either, where you have to be rich to be able to provide medicine for your kids. What a way to live.

alicecrail, she's got a new one out called 'Shadows of the Workhouse', in a similar vein.

I read that midwife one whilst lying on a sun lounger in Spain. Was quite bizarre.

Very very sad state of affairs.I admire her ,I truly do .I don't think I would cope as well in her situation.Education has got to be the answer to it all.

I think a lot of people tend to know somebody on benefits who seem to be working the system / not care they're on benefits / are happy to be on benefits / no intention of working etc, which can build resentment in people who are struggling to make ends meet whilst working.

What we must do is remember that you cannot judge everybody in a "group" by the actions of one person.

It's really enjoyable actually. There were quite a few of these sorts of "studies" around that time but most of them are out of print.

I read one called "At the Works" which was written by the wife of the owner of the said works. She came over as a real interfering, hectoring old bag, whereas Maud Pember Reeves isn't half so bad. (Also my grandmother was a child in the East End at the same time so it gives me a clue as to what her life would have been like.)

I read George Orwell's The Road To Wigan Pier recently. V v good. One of the interesting things was that of course well-meaning middle class people were saying exactly the same things about 'Why do these people buy bacon and white bread when they could be living far more cheaply if they just bought swedes and potatoes?' Also IIRC they were complaining about poor people owning luxuries like books just like some people today do about tvs.

morris i didn't mean that we shouldn't have the safety net, but what i am saying is that somewhere along the line it has gone from people who need it to people who want it, and i agree that education is the answer. Perhaps they should bring back old fashioned home economics, and also show these youngsters (god i sound like a right biddy!) what their lives could be like with a career. I think people have lost their pride

What people who are comfortable often forget is that if you are very poor, you literally cannot afford to make mistakes. You have no safety net, nobody who can bail you out, no savings account to raid, no ISA to cash in. You have nothing in the bank, only what you have in your purse. (which in my case at the moment means £10- if I had to buy everything we need between now and Monday, say, I would probably despair).

duchesse - you're lucky you didn't have a child like my DS1 - who at 2/3yrs old (can't remember exact age now) ate NOTHING for an entire week, the only fluids he took were about 4/5oz of weak squash a day.

Apparently once he was hungry he'd eat.........well I wasn't prepared to wait and see how much longer that was going to be so we went back to what we'd been doing before and waited for him to start eating everything we were eating at his pace.

INterestingly I've just made pasta and cheesy sauce. I put a little bit too much water in the pot for the pasta (and the sink had other stuff in it so I couldn't pour it away easily - opening the front door would have resulted in an escapee if I'd got my hands full with a pan and hot water ).

I left it as it was - but it took considerably longer than if I'd used just a little less.

Just made me think - what if I was on a meter, had left the water to boil and gone off to do homework with the DS's or whatever, not really noticing how long it was taking to boil, those extra few minutes must surely eat into the gas meter.

Horrible thought.

FAQ- I did and I do. And boy is she tricky, but I am not running a restaurant. She has reached 13 and is still growing so the limited amount of food she took around 2/3/4 doesn't seem to have harmed her. Admittedly she never went on a several day long hunger strike, but am wondering whether your son wasn't unwell at the time?

We all, as mums, like to give our children what they want... Christmas presents, treats, new clothes etc etc.

So if you are living a life of poverty when all of the above are an impossible dream, are you really going to give your much loved DCs nutritious swede and lentil stew for tea, instead of pizza and oven chips which might actually make them happy?

I wonder how people living below the poverty line manage with discipline and/or encouragement? My DCs know that if they behave badly they'll lose a treat, or their pocket money. What happens when there are no treats, or pocket money? Are you more likely to use smacking as discipline if you have no money, I wonder?

my son was perfectly well at the time - we wouldn't have done it if he was ill.

7 days, with no food, no milk, only a couple of oz's of fluid a day...........

I then believe that some children will not eat if they're hungry - I truly believe he would have gone on longer had we kept trying to force him to eat what we had.

Yes even with the food that he was eating he would have phases of not eating muchm, like you say - they all do, but this was totally different, this was absolute determination from him that he wasn't eating what was put in front of him.

pmsl at 'rich'

i'm on rent allowance and the dole with 3 kids myself! i don't post with no awareness of her situation... i post having been there but worse as our incomings didn't cover our outgoings (i took a pt job as i had been told by the dole that they'd only cut me x amount if i did... they cut us off completely and rent allowance cut us off so we were left with only my pt wages) and i literally had to chose not to pay the rent to feed my child.

That article so reminds me of the 2 years that I spent on benefits. I was also doing courses, like the mother in teh article, to update my skills. I remember so well the constant planning and organising.

I had a similar amount to spend on food as she has, and yes, the 5 pounds to last 5 days situation too.
What did the extra money go on?
10 pounds a week for the subsidised creche at the college, I seem to remember. Also, we were behind with water or gas payments, I forget which, so we were paying double for that for ages. Also, we ran an old banger.
Didnt smoke, drink or go out.

FAQ...my freind is doing early childhood studies, and she is on benefits, but had to take a loan out for that...if she needed childcare, it would be impossible...as it is, her dd is on school and her parents are nearby and help out, and dd goes to afterschool clubs and stuff...
So, I don't think undergraduate courses are free...college however seems to be a whole different matter...but since she started Uni she is much worse off than she was whilst being at college...

FairLady - I'm talking about the OU - don't know about other Uni's - we have none round here, just a college with no courses that even vaguely grabbed my attention.

I remember when the Hugh Fearnly Whatsit show was broadcast last year, I had a debate on another forum about it. I was trying to explain why I still bought cheap chicken and no one could get it or even begin to understand my reasons.
As I said, my DD loves a roast, we had so little and treats were very thin on the ground. I was not going to tell her she couldn't have chicken or any food because of someone elses ethics. I felt I couldn't afford to have them.
It was all fine and well for them to say they'd give their kids chick peas but they'd never been in a position where they had to discount 90% of what the shops sell because they couldn't afford it.
I bought everything I could afford and to hell with ethics.

To hell with ethics is fine .... to hell with nutrients not so good.

hello Sorrento - how was the interview??

Hiya,
I don't think I got it, he wants somebody with up to date contacts which is fair enough I guess, we'll have to wait and see but I'm going to keep looking.
Thanks for asking

I am on benefits and only have £20pw shopping budget. This week we have had... Jacket potatoes & beans, pesto pasta, mince & potatoes with carrots, mushy pies. I try to give my DS as much friut and veg as possible and I'm afraid without iceland I wouldn'y be able to do this. Frozen veg is the way to go £1 for a big bag, I wish I could buy fresh but I'd rather my DS have some nutrients!
I bake, bake, bake... any sod the ethics I have to buy cheap eggs, smart price flour but it makes my DS happy. I think the girl in the article has got it bang on... she buys fruit and veg, how many other people on benefits or not can say they don't feed their DC pizza and chips???? I know its our weekend treat at a some total of £2!

hey... i am on benefits same amount as the lady in the acticle £120 - i manage to still have money left over - i have deorted my flat - pay internet - top up my phone - have a day out with my daughter once a week, even if it is jut a bus ride - top up nursery fees - buy lunches at college 3 days a week -buy fags - spend £50-70 a fornight on food - pay budgeting loan to council, pay credit card and tv license etc - i manage on the poverty line

I read the article with interest- growing up in Wales in the late 70s/early 80s was a similar story for my mum on her own with us.

The one thing that really gets my goat is the money she has to put in her gas and electric meters- meters are more costly than if you pay direct debit- an instant tax on the poor that should be banned.