AIBU to think that women should be able to talk about something other than housework/family?

[fairywave]

Maybe it's just me but I ended up out with a small group of women, a couple of whom I hadn't met before. For about an hour or two, most of the conversation revolved around housework, parenting, husbands, etc. Don't get me wrong, I like to talk about all these things too, but not on a night out! I could honestly feel my eyes glazing over. Am I just weird to want to talk about politics, music, books - anything other than housework!

I have FiveLive on when I am doing the DCs' meals and listen to it when out for a walk with the pram, but I am nowhere near as 'up' on current affairs as i was pre-DCs (when I read a newspaper every day - oh the joy).

I do try not to talk about my kids all the time but if I am with a group of women with babies a similar age it is enjoyable to talk about them (they are only 9mo though so perhaps it will wear off)

But I try not to refer to them unless someone asks outright cos I just assume no one is interested (and I am probably right)

Could be just that they are not sure what common ground there is. If I were to talk about what I do at work or what interests me, the eyes would start glazing pretty quickly: not that many people have a lot to say about medieval palaeography or the reproductive habits of Mexican livebearing fish. Strange, but there it is.

So I am always relieved to find that we have some common ground in the children.

Fairywave, it is another mark of how the world is, there is enough crap thrown at women, especially SAHMs without other women labeling them incapable because of their chosen topic of conversation (in ONE situation). It never ceases to amaze me that women can slam other women for discussing the things they do all day.

Why on earth is it odd that that particular conversation revolved around that? If you have lots of friends who discuss other things then you are not being representative. You have no idea if that is normal for those ladies. You have said that you discuss other things at other times with other people so really you are whining that you had to have one conversation about a subject that is not your favorite. I think we have all done that at a party. Most of us are grown up enough to cope with it without having to label those people involved in such a derogatory fashion.

In short, yes you touched a nerve, the one that makes me protective of and respectful about my peers.

Hmm, I was once at a gathering where the women started comparing engagement rings and then the two with the biggest diamonds started comparing WHEN the proposal had been and how big the wedding was to be....then went onto how long it would be before their other half earned enough for them to become stay at home wives...

I stopped seeing these people.

(BTW the men were discussing cars)

Cory -- am fascinated by any conversation that could include both palaeography and Mexican fish. Can you come and liven up my dinner conversation, please?

cory - you have wide-ranging interests ( or are those the only two ).

I find that most things are interesting when discussed by way of humourous anecdote. Talking about children can be a nice breather if you've been talking about composite guarantees the whole morning (yawnarama)...

cory - you have wide-ranging interests ( or are those the only two ).

I find that most things are interesting when discussed by way of humourous anecdote. Talking about children can be a nice breather if you've been talking about composite guarantees the whole morning (yawnarama)...

KingCanute, I just re-read my original message to be sure but I didn't imply that anyone was incapable - I said that I found the conversation boring and then asked was I weird to think so, so obviously I wasn't representative and felt a little like the odd one out. I'm kind of relieved to find that's it's normal enough not to want to have these conversations. In fact palaeography and Mexican fish sound pretty interesting to me

It's how you talk about things that make them entertaining, not necessarily what you talk about.

Housewives with no conversation are a bit of a cliche IMO.

Fairywave, your title said that you thought women should be able to, implying that these women were therefore incapable IYSWIM, anyway, I have put my raw nerve away now as it is not really that important and I have to admit I took a farly lighthearted op to be something much more sinister (again!) I think I need to take a good dose of "take it with a pinch of salt" before posting

Why didn't you change the subject?
Maybe they were sticking to neutral ground as they didn't know you that well.

Do you not think that housework and family can be a springboard to thousands of interesting ideas and topics, philosophy art politics anthropology pyschology literature? Most of the novels I read when I was twenty and knew nothing of children and housework make ten times more sense to me.
But I agree that introducing these tangents into conversation can prove irksome to others. I think it's a question of light relief - (it's lovely to hear other people spinning straw into gold) and companionship in times of trouble...

I didn't read the other posts on this yet, but...it depends. I don't have many friends who have children, so I'm actually excited when I get to talk "kids and house" with someone, since my friends are all "clubs and career". But I know what you mean. I did like belonging to a book club, where most of the people didn't have kids and probably never will. They would have been horrified if I'd brought up diapers! I do have a hard time, however, with people who think it's NEVER ok to discuss these things. I do most of the hoursework and kid things, because I only work half days-NOT because I'm a woman. It's hard sometimes when people assume what I do isn't valid, or that I shouldn't discuss it or something. I know that's not what you were doing, I'm just putting it out there.

Some people just aren't interested in stuff outside of their home/ own experience.
Some don't feel "qualified" to talk about other things, maybe they are used to being put down by parents/partners/associates.
Some people talk about the things that are highest on their priority lists and don't get the time to sift down to the less important (to them) things.

I think YABU to expect that everyone wants to talk about the same things as you do; but it is reasonable to expect that most people (but not ALL) will have some conversation outside of home topics.

My experience is that people (mums in groups) avoid these topics and stay on 'safe' ground like parenting, school etc. I think if people are looking to meet others to relieve the daily grind and just want the company of other grown ups, then they do stay safe.

However, it is a little self-defeating as if you are politically aware/interested then you are not going to be drawn to 'one flew of the cuckoo's nest' mind-numbing baby crap.

I have to say, although I have (as a human rights lawyer) a great interest in current affairs, I steer clear of anything controversial because I don't want to hear the tory crap that I'll inevitably be greeted with in the small town, middle England community I live in! It surfaces enough in other ways - veiled racist or outright snobby comments though.

So may be I'm just as bad! I just avoid it all if possible

I think Debs40 has a point - mostly we stick to what we know we all share - it may be bland but it's easy, and inclusive and non-confrontational. Let's face it - the one thing we all do equally well (or badly!) is pro-create and then pick our our way through the minefield that is parenting. It's the thing that binds us, no matter opposed our angled of approach may be. The trouble with being born into a generation of women who have been brought up to recognise that we have equal value and equal potential in the workplace, is that we feel are in danger of letting the sisterhood down by not taking the world by storm, and changing nappies at the same time. With choice comes dilemma.

I suppose we are no different to men, who may at first only bond over work or football/golf, whatever, but in time, once they feel more secure in their friendships will risk debate on heavier topics, and branch off into more specific, more captivating areas of interest. I have to say although I do at times I get bored with talking about child-rearing and homemaking (I've been doing it full time 16 years so I'm entitled to be bored!!!) I cannot think of anything more worthy of my time, and I don't regret it or feel belittled by it.

That would be 'how opposed'...

I agree there are many other subjects and the whole mother housework thing is a shocker. But I am a SAHM - maybe it's all too relentless. A friend who is a mum and works 4 days a week - basically does as much as she did when she worked 5 days a week but is more stressed and paid less - and she feels that there is nothing more bonding with other women than becoming a mother but also nothing more divisive. Think MN is a brilliant example of those extremes and sometimes so are the small groups of chatting women mentioned in the OP. Most of my closest friends do not have children and we talk about other stuff.

There was a thread about Rachel Cook's Observer article complaining about boring parent talk. Maybe she had a point?

at the risk of being seriously flamed here, isn't it something to do with the type of people who are in the group anyway? If you get a bunch of mums together (who aren't also already friends) then their common ground is being a mum. If you get a bunch of bankers together, their common ground is being a banker - and their conversation is likely to reflect that.

If you get a bunch of FRIENDS together their conversation will be far more wide-ranging because they know each other - ime, anyway.

When I talk to my friends, we talk a bit about how DS is getting on and a lot more about what's going on with them; sometimes we move onto the state of the world/economy/situation in Iraq/Afghanistan etc. but often we keep it personal.

Does anybody know the best way to avoid colours running in your washing? (ducks)

heehee Helen31

I think that this is absolutely about 'context' friendships. You make friends with people because of the context you're in - at first (work, university, being at parent group whatever). Sooner or later, someone divulges a bit more information about themselves and hopefully gets a similarly open response and the germ of 'real' friendship can start.
Maybe you need to think of a way to link from the 'safe' conversation into the riskier but ultimately more satisfying ones by exposing a bit more of yourself. Even just asking how someone feels about something "Do you ever get bored with housework? I sometimes think I'll scream if I have to load the dishwasher one more time", or "Did you plan to be a SAHM? Would you make the same choice? I'm thinking about xyz".
Then you can dig a little deeper and move sideways and before you know it you'll be into the psychology of collecting or Mexican leaping fish

I know exactly what the OP means, but........as a leftie what happens if I discover one of my new mummyfriends is a Daily Mail reading Cameron lover? Or she discovers I am a leftie?

I think you have to do these things slowly. Like on a series of dates. You have to know someone quite well for your friendship to survive 'You'd vote for HIM?? But he's a complete numpty / hideous toff'

I think it's very dangerous and rather shallow to assume that you cannot be firm friends with someone who does not share your ideals, political, religious or otherwise. Unless you are so strident and militant in your beliefs that you cannot possibly function in any social situation without getting your soapbox out, and castigating perfectly decent people for having the temerity to have their own mind, in which case I'm not sure they'd be high on my Christmas card list anyway! I have lots of friends who have beliefs/values I don't especially share but it doesn't stop them being good people. We just don't discuss those things in any depth, or if we do, we are happy to listen to one another's POV and respect their right to have it, even if we don't respect the POV itself. The point is, we should be aiming to spend our time with people who stimulate us, not send us into a coma!

oh I don't know, the occasional social coma can be quite relaxing...

if you've spent the last x years stuck at home avoiding doing housework and wiping bums and noses, apart from the weather what else îs^ there to talk about???

Apart from the news/politics, which I thought was a subject to be avoided in polite society anyway?

So, OP, if women bore you senseless talking about the home, how do you suggest they broaden their convo (genuine Q), esp if not interested in talking politics.

tiggR, I sort of agree, but the old adage 'birds of a feather..' does hold a certain truth

I confess, all I have to talk about are pushchairs and mumsnet my poor husband. The occasional poo convo, but will have to wait for dd to bulk out her nappies to make that more interesting.