to think that reality tv has created a culture of people who don't believe they have to work for success?

[wannaBe]

Was watching masterchef last night. All these people say is "this is all i've ever wanted, this could be my chance to change my life." And I can't help wondering, if they want to cook that much then why didn't they go to catering college and learn to be a chef?

You see it on the other shows too - xfactor and the like "this is all I've ever wanted, this is my one chance to change my life." er - but have they been out there doing gigs? making demo's in the hope of getting a record deal? (I appreciate that becoming a musician is harder than becoming a chef but still...)

And that's before we come to those that say "My life will be over if I don't get this." or "I was a waitress, but I just want to be something better," as if being famous somehow makes you a better person.

Why is it that people feel the only way to achieve success is to enter in some tv competition? Why have people seemingly lost the ability to go out and work for their success?

DH is a chef (owns 3 restaurants) and regularly gets people turning up asking for work experience because they love cooking at home and it is their "dream to be a chef". Most last one shift, if that.

If it is your dream to be a chef then great but you will not be cooking for your friends. The food has to be cooked quickly, on time or people won't pay or come back.

Most people want to be the Head Chef and are not prepared to put in 10 years graft getting paid a pittance first.

I always at the contestants when they get to the professional kitchen. Have never worked in one or even seen one but having seen them on these programmes I can't believe people are naive enough to think that if they can cook for the family they can actually run a professional kitchen.

I love cooking and am apparently good at it, but there's no way I'd want to do it for a living.

I would hate to be a chef. DH works from 9am til midnight 5 days a week. Most chefs do. You don't just have to love cooking, you have to not really mind not having a life as well.
At least we don't own a hotel as you have to cook breakfast (5am start) and worry about 24 hour room service. I would be devestated if my boys were chefs too.

Wannabe have you read the Ben Elton novel based on X Factor, I think it's called Chart Throb? It emphasises the extent to which contestants are coached to say 'It's my dream, it's all I ever wanted' etc. You can probably take it with a big pinch of salt.

However. I agree with your OP really... I think it was Martianbishop who said that the kids at her school who thought they were going to be footballers/rock stars weren't actually in football teams/bands, while the ones who actually were in the team or the band were the ones making career plans to be doctors and accountants

True Wannabe.

Reminds me of a job I had years ago; I used to get a number of phone calls from women wanting to train as an Educational Psychologist as they really enjoyed being a mum and enjoyed bringing up a family. The Chief EP wrote me a list of qualifications and experience required which I could then read out in response to these enquiries. Most people went rather quiet when I read it out to them.

I've been told I can sing rather well.

But I would run away screaming if anyone even dared suggest I go on X-factor or other such bollocks. Can't think of anything worse to be than famous... don't think I would enjoy being under the microscope!!

pmsl at wanting to be an ed psyke because you enjoyed being a mum and bringing up a family!

Kathy, yes iirc MB had a story re one pupil who wanted to be a celebrity hairdresser. Not a famous hairdresser in his/her own right but one who worked for celebrities.

I totally agree and think its really worrying tbh! Its about role models, who do our chidren look up to and aspire to be, particularly girls? Jordan, Kerry Katona, Coleen?, plus it promotes materialism in the sense that 'they get loads of money!' what about wanting some intellect for the sake of wanting it! I really hope the London Olympics puts some better role models in the spot light!

I wish a had a quid for every would-be writer who asked me how to go about getting an agent and a publishing deal only to admit later in the conversation that they haven't written anything.
A mate was telling me that on the creative writing course she teaches some of the students have websites and are busy networking yet they haven't actually written a book.

Absolutely.

As a music teacher i see that all the time.

Kids who have keyboard/piano/singing lessons for one term and think they are gonna be really great after that and then give up once they realise it takes longer than 3 months.

I HATE HATE HATE X factor et al.

'people who don't believe they have to work for success?'

There are plenty of people like this anyway. Lots of people are successful without having done a thing. I don't like reality TV because of it's explotative nature, but I don't think it is to blame.

I was thinking the exact same thing last night, Wannabe. I would love for John Torrode to turn around and say, 'If it's all you ever wanted to do, why on earth are you an accountant then?'. The answer is simple - cooking is one of those things that you have to really REALLY want to do, not just in a reality-tv-this-would-mean-everything-to-me sort of way, but in a working insanely long shifts and putting up with huge amounts of pressure sort of way.

I love cooking, but know that I would last about ten minutes in a professional kitchen.

One of the competitors earlier in the week summed it up for me - she didn't go to catering college, because her parents didn't think it was academic enough, so she became a solicitor instead. Made me think a bit...I am also not especially happy with my current profession (publishing), so am going back to uni in Sept (if I am accepted) to do a conversion course to be a...solicitor.

My SIL (a teacher) has told me that a many of her teenage students' only ambition is to "be famous". When asked "famous for doing what?" they often don't know.

It is not an entirely new phenomenon. Apparently Salvador Dali knew he was going to be a genius long before he knew what he was going to be a genius at. (got that out of George Orwell, but never mind.) But then he was a highly objectionable man.

i think that's not entirely true though, i imagine the majority of kids just want normal jobs.

my 15 year old wants to do something in business, his friends all want similar bog standard jobs.

some sweeping harsh generalisations of teens,they are not all WAG schleb wannabes some are numpties yes but plenty adults are daft too

read in press recently that teens feel under considerable pressure to succeed academically and worry about debt and career choice

yanbu. It has helped create a certain culture and there is definitely a whole TV language to do with dreams, journeys and sob stories. It has also created a new public emotional language involving tears (regardless of which emotion is being felt) and flapping/clasping hand movements.

yes there is an emotional incontinence amongst some folk.every bloody thing is amazing,
mediocre dullards descried as "heroes"

Isn't there plenty of evidence of the young budding genius having been around for centuries.

The difference is, a hundred years ago there were plenty of young men who knew they would never have to work, so they could bumble around and think of themselves as misunderstood poets or artists or whatever.

And what about all the bands that did not become the Beatles and the Stones- did none of them dream of fame and glory (and did all of them have musical training?). And girls dreaming of making it big as models or in Hollywood- how many of them actually thought of the hard work? As someone said, half the world's fairy tales are about the same thing. You become big and famous not through steady work but through attracting the prince's attention or (if male) through one act of heroism (or fake heroism as often as not).

Surely it is not that odd not to know what you want to do when you are 15 and 16? Or to dream of doing something exciting? I find it a bit creepy when you hear a 13-year-old saying 'oh, I know I want to be an accountant when I grow up and I know that I will need X no of GCSEs blahablaha.' Hang on, aren't you going to climb the Mount Everest or discover a lost civilisation or save the world? What about dreams? This is the only time of your life when dreams won't hurt, because they don't come smelling of lost opportunities- and all you're thinking about is how you can become an accountant.

Agree with the bursting into tears- it's like being back in some wretched medieval epic. Bring on the Edwardians- stiff upper lip!

I tend to like the ones where someone has to be good at someone - I agree with cat - but it really annoys me that most of those shows seem to think that they have to factor in an element of Big Brother in order to be interesting. So for Project Catwalk you have footage of them in the house, for Masterchef you have the "interview" and so on. I can remember thinking about a show recently that the format did not suit a "knocking out one a week" gimmick at all, but they did it anyway for cheap thrills. Of course, can I remember which show? No - mother of toddler and newborn syndrome.

Anyway, I agree with Wannabe that if cooking really is your passion that you'd have probably gone into a professional kitchen way before. But there are a lot of people who don't follow their true interests due to parental pressure, or lack of confidence due to youth, or whatever. And I think that it's fun to what people having the oppotunities to actually try it out without having to jack in the day job with a mortgage and 2 children to support.