Racist neighbour, what should I have done?

[Sushipaws]

I'm not best friends with either of my neighbours, we send Christmas cards, have small chit chat in the street. Both sets of neighbours seemed quite friendly and haven't had any major problems since I moved in earlier in the year.

Today I bumped into one neighbour who I chatted to, I brought up the subject of my other neighbours who have just had a beautiful baby girl. She said the baby would cry allot because coloured babies cry more than Normal babies. And that was because the coloureds carry their babies all the time. I told her I hadn't heard her cry at all and I didn't think that was true. I then changed the subject, we had an awkward moment and I left.

I wanted to scream at her, that the baby is not coloured but black and she is Normal. This is also Britain not fucking Ethiopia and I don't think my neighbours carry their baby any more than I do mine. And isn't it proven that babies who are carried more after birth cry less.

But I didn't scream, I disagreed, but rather sheepishly. I just don't want to fall out with my neighbours.

Does that make me as bad, I feel guilty.

I think it is different if you are asked to give a physical description of someone, then of course you would say black or white or Asian or red head etc - although in places like London skin shade is more descriptive - ie dark or light. But describing a group of people as "blacks" as the first descriptor is lazy at best. For example when I think about my old team I wouldn't start by saying well x is black (family from Sierra Leone) and y is white (from Russia), and z is a northerner etc, especially as it gets complex quite quickly in any case, as I have team members who are "apparently" white, but actually mixed race for example. I would tend to say well x is the person to talk to about [area of specialty] or y is lovely, or whatever seemed most relevant. If someone was visiting my office and needed to know who they were looking for then I'd be as likely to say x is the one at the end of the third row, or wearing the red jumper, as x is that black/white girl over there.

I have a feeling she won't say anything racist again because I clearly didn't agree with her. But if she does, she's obviously a complete moron as well as an ignorant cow, so I will be matter-of-fact and tell her the proper facts.

She's not even old enough to "oh well she's old", she must only be mid fifty's.

I actually hope to get to know my other neighbours better as they have kids similar ages to mine and it would be good if they could play in the back garden together in the summer.

I was at a party last year with a group of friends. Since becoming a parent my friends have obviously moved into new social circles. I didn't know who's house it was that we were at and asked the group of people I was standing with. They all pointed at the end of the room and said 'That guy over there, the tall one.' There was quite a few tall people so I asked which one, they then went into a long description of his clothes etc... until I said the black guy. I think people can be almost too pc. The funny thing was I saw some comedian recently using the same situation as a joke, but things like this do happen

Yes, I agree with your post, Nooka. That's how I'd tend to go given that set of circumstances.

Children are naturally au fait with this. When my son started his free 12.5 hours of nursery last year, he soon had a new best friend. His name was Arthur.

When I asked him to point Arthur out, he told me it was the kid in the red top in the corner, playing with mega blocks.

There were about four kids fitting that description, so I asked him to be more specific.

'The red top with the tractor on it,' was the reply.

Now, Arthur is the only black kid in our nursery. My son's response was naturally given, and I think it was the right one.

Lol. My son was like that too, except it was the other way around. He was one of the very few pale children in a group of mainly Afro-Caribbean. He is like me, very pale, so stood out a bit! dd on the other hand is very appearance conscious, and for a while would make a beeline for little girls with long blonde hair (her idealised "princess" type).

Oh and Sushi, you are probably feeling bad because your neighbour assumed you would agree with her racist opinions. This sort of situation is upsetting because you get the bile of the other person together with the worry that someone thinks you have reprehensible views too. dh was looking at flats when we moved to New York, and on being shown around one, and thinking it would do, then met the landlady who said very approvingly that she would give him the flat, as he was white. He replied that he was no longer thinking of renting the flat as he didn't want a racist landlady. I think she was surprised... Sadly we came across quite a bit of open racism in the States, and it took us by surprise. Not so much that people had the views, but that they had no shame in exhibiting them.

I know where you are coming from FAQ, but given the South African official extreme racism when the term coloured was introduced I don't know that it is a good model to adopt. Personally I think black/white is inaccurate and far too broadbrush, especially in places with a lot of mixed race people, but at least black is in general not a perjorative term.

FAQ, I feel your pain!

If you spend time in southern Africa you will find that 'coloured' is a term that mixed-race people use to describe themselves (and other people use it too). 'Cape coloured' for example refers to a distinct group of people, and is not synonymous with 'black'.

Not advocating that this usage should be adopted here, simply pointing out that 'coloured' is not always and everywhere an offensive term.

I'm not just talking about South African Southern Africa.

I remember exH getting all perplexted over which box to tick on an ethniticity form just after he moved to the UK. Wasn't one of these new fancy ones that has just about every combination of race you can think of. It only really had black, white, asian, other - with a space to specify. He wrote down coloured and when he handed the form over the woman asked him "what colour is that" - he repeated what he'd written (which i hadn't seen him write just saw him hand form over) and I explained it was "mixed race" (since then White and Black African has been added - so problem sorted )

Fair enough FAQ, and frogs I'm glad it's not always offensive (although I still think it a bit odd - I feel that I am as coloured pink as my niece was coloured dark brown, but then that's the same as the black/white thing)

I think there is also a difference between saying 'so and so is black/white and so and so is a black or a white. My father doesn't say 'that man is black'. He says 'he is a blackman', blackman being one word. It has always bugged me but I find it difficult to explain to him exactly why. I think it's because, as someone else said, it implies that this is the main and over riding characteristic of this person and not just one way of describing them.

Anyway back to the topic. I think the neighbour is ignorant and rude first due to their low self-esteem. They have made a racist comment on the back of that. I think they would also say something rude about a white person too who they felt was beneath them.

A few of my team members at work who are professional men and women have scorned the fact that I was eating west indian food and scorned another colleague for liking west indian food. They regularly go out for indian curry, chinese and pizza's, etc but west indian food (I was eating corn bread!!!) was too foreign.

Surely that is plain stupid and ignorant even before being racist?

Suhshi, You made your point which is better then just agreeing with her. This neighbour of yours is obviously very ignorant though, so whether you got through to her is another matter! I like Dandy's approach as well.
I watched something on GMTV once where they were talking about political correctness and can advise you "coloured" is considered offensive by the black community in the UK.

I was amused when daughter started nursery. Her mum and i went in first - separately - to look around and one of the children said to me, "oh, you look like Natasha's dad!" Natasha's dad is a blond Pole and I am a dark-haired Celt, but Natasha was the only other white child in the nursery at the time - and you know how us whites all look alike, right?

Her whole approach was negative. Toimmediately comment on her supposition that the baby would cry, that she obviously believes this to be down to a practice she disapproves of (because it apparantly causes crying - got, that, all you baby-wearers? etc. AND based on no evidence because the baby doesn't cry! She obviously harbours some dodgy views, imo. Now you know the kind of thing she's likely to come out with, stock yourself up with some ways to respond - as Dandy suggests.
"oh, well I prefer to think of them as my friendly neighbours and thier race doesn't come into it", etc etc.

Sorry but I never knew to refer to people as coloured was so wrong. I would naturally not tend to use the term coloured but will be extra careful not to now I know it is considered offensive.
TBH I find the use of the the word "normal" much more offensive in the context in which the op's neighbour used it.

lol at "the black community" - would that be all of the blacks, the British Blacks, Afro-Caribbean Black or the African Blacks

noonki I like your example, I think this is why we have moral stories in the bible and other text. To help us clarify what is morally wrong. We now need new stories to help guide us and others sometimes.
Sushipaws I would love you as a neighbour. You could put out that babies carried in a sling cry less! Whether they are from China, Streatham or Timbuktu!

thanks starbear, though still feel a bit of a cop out.

FAQ - you reminded me of an incident at work that always makes me laugh. I work for housing and we always have to do those ethnic monitoring forms. We had a White woman who though english had been living in South Africa for over 20 years and had ended up homeless and back over here. And had come to ask for emregency housing

Anyway when I gave her the form to tick (with about 20 options) she looked very perplexed then said 'oh I don't know, I'll live near anybody it doesn't bother me'

always made me grin.

I have to say that alot of the patients i work with use the term coloured ,as in 'who changed your dressings ' ,'oh the nice coloured nurse' . Generally speaking they are all quite old and are not using the term in a derogatory way ,its just a phrase they are used to.