to think that locking a 6 year old in a dark cupboard is too harsh as a punishment?

[HeadFairy]

My 6 year old niece was being really cheeky this afternoon, she refused to say thank you when she was given a present, and then refused to apologise. Both my mum and my sister thought it was ok to threaten to lock her in a walk in coat closet (it's tiny, with no light). I have no doubt they would have done it if she hadn't apologised. That seemed really strong for me, or am I too soft? To me it would have been "upstairs, now, no toys or games, sit in your room and think about how rude you've been" but never drag a crying girl to a cupboard and threaten to lock her in. That just seems awful to me or am I just a big softy?

YANBU.

Unless it was said in jest. I threaten to beat my DCs's bottoms. They know I don't mean it. Otherwise it's a bad idea.

I must say I'm glad I'm not alone in thinking my sister's wrong. I thought I was just being a softy or I just didn't understand because my ds is only 13 months and he can't answer me back yet.

some families fall out for spurious reasons BUT in your case i recommend never seeing either mum or sis again

cruel and barbaric

if i were you i wouldn't let them watch my children.ever

christ if that is what they do in front of you, what do they they do when they think you arent looking

I know it's awful whichever way. Hopefully she has never done anything like that, and the reason she has threatened it is because she is at her witt's end.

Wow, that's horrible. I always threaten really ridiculous things like throwing all their toys out of the window, aiming for puddles (which usually makes them all laugh, improving things generally). But actually my dcs behave quite tolerably for some reason. If anyone does something really horrid they get sent to their room.

Wtf? that is absolutely ridiculous, pair of idiots, not on, you dont lock children in the dark, and force them into small spaces to teach them a lesson, unless that lesson is how to be petrified. I would have no problem in telling them they are out of order, poor girl, do whats right and stand up for your neice, someone has too.

poor kid. Did your mother ever threaten to lock you or your sister into a dark cupboard?

Sorry people how times change. I used to put in the basement (I was sometimes a nightmare)strangely on my own or a combination of my brother and or the friends who lived downstairs. I'm sorry but I can't help laughing. I loved the dark and we would make up strange stories but never finish them because my Mum or the other Mum (I still call her auntie) would then let us out and we would be good. Maybe it was rare but memorable and to tell the truth my Mum is such a big softy. My primary school friend used to beaten with a belt. I found it shocking then and I still do. I just put my boy in the corner for a few mins I do threaten to give his toys to the charity shop but have never done so. If push comes to shove!!!!

Sounds like something out of Dickens or those unpleasant books about abusive childhoods.

It's not often I'd interfere in someone else's parenting, but if she were my sister she'd precisely know my thoughts.

I usually do say something like "is that really necessary?" or "crikey, that's harsh". My mum never locked us up in a cupboard to punish us as children, to be honest I've never seen her do it to my niece either, but she did threaten it today. I was quite shocked because she usually agrees with me when my sister is arguing with her dd. My niece seems totally unaffected by all this by the way. She's not terrified of her mother or cowering in the corner. Within minutes she's back to her old self, being cheeky, funny, clever, cocky. All the usual things she is. Does that make a difference? I'm not sure it does, but I don't think she's suffering. I just think it's bad parenting.

I knew someone who used to put her child in the cellar. Really odd. She was at her wits end, I think. We did, erm, 'have a chat' and thought of something else. . .

I once put ds1 in the shed, because I thought it was an outlandish thing to say and he'd stop whatever it was he was doing, but he didn't, so I put him in the shed - for about 3 seconds which he thought hilarious.

Anywaaay - I think what happens when people are locked in a battle of wills like this, is that they forget what is okay and what isn't. It's just the wills at battle, and sometimes everything escalates. I think this is what happened with my cellar friend.

Talk her out of it. Think up some other things she can say or threaten - if she has to - to stop this.

I know! Buy her a copy of HTT.

And with the cocky thing - not a good sign either, things will just bigger and worse and more threatening unless your Sis changes her whole strategy.

We usually do manage to talk her out of it when we're all round for sunday lunch like today. My mum usually leads the charge in saying "don't rise to the bait, ignore her if she's irritating you" which is why I was quite surprised she didn't today. I think she's very tired and stressed so that's why her patience snapped today (my mum's that is) but normally we both advocate a more reasoned approach. The funny thing is my sister is a big fan of Tanya Byron, she's always going on about things she's written in The Times etc, but in the heat of the moment it's like she forgets everything.

By the sounds of it, the mother has absolutely no authority with the child, mine would be contrite for a good hour after being told off.
Ok she didn't put her in a cupboard but what would she have done if the girl hadn't said thank you, if the child called her bluff then your sister had nowhere to go.
If she wants to avoid trouble in the future she needs to only threaten punishments that she will follow through.
Many a time i've had to give mine a little smack on the bum because I said I would, not meaning it at all but if you don't then they know you aren't serious. So you have to be careful what you say.

I know 100x, my sister's relationship with her dd1 is exactly the same as my mum's relationship with my sister. Both very bright, intelligent people, highly strung and more than a little neurotic and they both know how to wind each other up. My mum and sister are much better now, my mum's mellowed with age, but it's like history repeating itself.

I agree katie, I know it's hard to follow through if you've threatened something quite strong, which is why I'd never threaten to lock a child up in a cupboard, because it's actually quite hard to do that, even if you're the hardest hearted person. It's much better to threaten something that's easier to follow through with, like the withdrawal of toys or something.

Yes - also KatieDD you know some children are keen to please and easily mollified and told off, and some are much more wilful and difficult and you know, it's not always the parenting.

However, my feeling is that your sister has to take charge of this and address it, and basically find some new strategies, because this isn't the way to go and she probably knows that, but also doesn't know what else to do - especially when her sister and mother are there.

This is why How to Talk is good when it's good, you can navigate away from these confrontations which are silly, and just about dominance and not about persuading your daughter to say thank you nicely.

I'd give her a copy, and suggest you both give it a go or something.

I haven't heard of how to talk 100x... is it this book? I agree her strategy isn't working. My niece isn't cocky in a bad way really, she's really bright and pushes things sometimes too far. I think because she's bright she starts something she can't finish. Just because she's articulate and got the language and reasoning to argue at quite a grown up level, she is still only 6 years old.

Gee do I know all about willful children and I wouldn't have her any other way, but they do need clear direction is all I'm saying.

[nods] She sounds familiar.

Yes! That's the book.

Am an advocate. Excellent for changing the script of confrontation and find other ways to do things. Stops the head to head thing.

That's the one, I might dig my copy out for a refresher, i do remember it being very helpful.

not read the whole thread but YANBU

To be honest I wouldn't even think of punishing a 6 year old for something as small as not saying thank you. I would very obviously thank someone on her behalf and talk to her later about it without an audience.

Thanks. I might get her a copy. I hope she doesn't get too offended. She's read lots of child rearing books (hmmm seems to forget everything when she's having an argument!) but she's bought them herself. I hope she doesn't think I'm implying she's a rubbish mother, because apart from these albeit rare occasions, I think she's a pretty good mother. She always encourages her girls to be expressive and creative and they do have lots of fun, I caught them all dancing around the kitchen to the radio the other day. It's just when the red mist descends and my niece starts pushing her buttons that my sister loses control.

anastaisia, it was more the way she refused that was wrong really. She was deliberately defiant. I do think some kind of punishment was in order, but I think my sister was too harsh in this case.

yes,you keep blaming the child.stops you looking hard at the real dysfunction the adults