to object to my friend's 2 year old pushing my 15 mo?

[stumpywombat]

Hello, I'm new here, would welcome your advice please... I have one son, nearly 15 months, not yet walking. Best friend's son, also an only child, is 28 months old and I would say that 80% of the time we are all together her son pushes, hits, snatches things from and occasionally aims a kick at my son. My son does bat people in the face, sometimes a bit too fierce, I think he just hasn't learnt yet how to be more gentle (despite me saying "gently, gently!" to him about 100 times a day and showing him how to be gentler).

AIBU to expect that the 28 month old should be better behaved with the younger one? Or is this just the way of 2yr olds everywhere? He cannot let my son have a toy, play on the same bit of equipment etc. As soon as my son picks up a toy the older boy grabs it off him, I give mine another toy, that gets snatched away too. He pushes my son's hands off anything he is also touching, pushes him away and seems quite deliberate in this and quite mean too - lots of "don't" and "get off". Am I projecting too much onto the 28mo? I feel very protective of my little one but don't want to be OTT and precious about him. Should I be doing more about my son banging people's faces? (and if so what please?!) Getting to the point of not wanting to do playdates because my son gets the thin end of the wedge the whole time.

What's friend said about it :S

What does friend say/do when her son acts this way?

What does your friend do?

When your child is 2 he will do it too, but its how YOU treat it and react to it that will discourage him.

I haven't brought it up with her yet, didn't want to be too heavyhanded as I just don't know what is reasonable from a 2 year old. She does tell her son off but isn't very effectual, her husband is much stricter and makes much more of an effort to really instil in their son that this is not nice behaviour.

Toddler rules

"If I like ... its mine
If its in my hand, its mine
If it looks like mine ... its mine
If I think its mine, its mine
Everything else is mine too."

I think you are being a perfectly reasonably parent of a 15 month old - your job is to protect and guide him. But once you get to the point of being the parent of a 28 month old you might look back and understand better!

If your friend is not making any attempt to stop her ds from being rough then I would step in there and say something firm - "no hitting/snatching/bashing/kicking etc". Her 2 year old is not "being mean" but does need to be taught acceptable behaviour.

Your friend should definatly be with her child and showing him that it is wrong to act in this way.

Like disenchanted says, most 2 year olds will go through this stage but will come out of it with the help of someone telling them it is wrong.

you are right in showing your ds to do things more gently

I think YABU if you expect a 28 mo to be "better behaved" than a 15 mo.

It's all about how adults respond in these situations I think.

I get this with my own sons. about the same age gap too.
DS1 is 3.7, ds2 26m so they are just getting out of that phase now. Or rather, ds2 is just starting to push and grab back.

I think its what older children do. They don't understand sharing really at that age, they just see a toy they want to play with and they will take it to play with. They don't understand taking turns - or when I try to tell ds1 that he must take turns he just grabs whatever it is and says 'its my turn now mummy'

In the end we had a zero tolerance of it. Any pushing, shoving etc of his little brother and ds1 was on time out with no warnings or second chances. seemed to work after a while. But that might not go down too well with your friend

Are you unreasonable to expect a two year old to behave better than a one year old? Hell, YES! Totally. Two year olds are famously worst behaved than one year olds, as I'm afraid you'll discover soon enough They learn that they are not you but their own little person, with a will and increased physical strength and mobility. They also discover that they can affect other people. It's not always pretty, but it is a totally normal developmental stage. Your friend is intervening, but you mustn't expect at two year old to be the 'grown up' in his relationship with your baby. He's a baby himself.
Re the 'playdates' I think that's where you are going wrong, personally. A baby and a two year old cannot really play together. You are just getting together with your mate, which is great and vital for sanity, but you can't expect the kids to get along and 'play' while you have a coffee and a natter. They need constant supervision and help to avoid the snatching etc that WILL happen if you don't. This won't last. By the time they are three or so they will be able to play with minimal intervention, but not right now.

Does sam100 know my child? She was discribing him to perfection!!!When he was 15 months old I would have started the same thread now I am the parent of a 2 3/4 yr old I feel mortified that others may feel like that towards ds1 and myself. His favourite word is mine especially towards ds2 and does all the above. However he does know its wrong and I am seing some improvement (or is that wishful thinking). Please tell me that the terrible twos don't continue into the terrible 3s? PLEASE!!!!

I'm afraid that two year olds are tricky, if your friend is trying to deal with it i think unfortunatly you have to live with it but hpefully fast forward a year when you are dealing with the 'terrible twos' your friend will be extra supportive as hopefully it will have just ended for her

YABU to expect a two year old to be better behaved than your big docile baby.

YOur son will get the thin end of the wedge with children who are bigger than him. Fast forward a year - he will in all likelihood be dishing out the pastings to docile big babies while their mothers fume and you go frantic trying to work out why.

the child does it because he is two. Two year olds are both wonderful and vile.

thank you all, v helpful. didn't want to strain the friendship by making unreasonable demands. dreading it when my ds is doing this a year from now!

and yes good reality check on why we're meeting up, it's for the adults and not the kids really.

ooh so pleased I joined Mumsnet, this is great!

Two year olds are like this Its not called the terrible twos for nothing. Your turn will come.

They have no concept of sharing and reasoning with them is next to impossible due to lack of language.

It does get better.

YABU to expect a 2 year old to be 'better' behaved than an 15 month old. However YANBU to expect your friend to deal with the situation and discipline your son. My DS2 started hitting an being quite aggressive at 18 months and we sorted it pretty quicky with naughty step. I don't think two year olds magically come out of this phase. They need guidance because being two is about testing boundaries and unfortunately some people just don't set those boundaries. Unfortunately in my line of work I tend to meet the results of this lack of discipline in toddlers and am confronted by parents who completely unable to deal with their young teenagers. Unfortuantely too many people let their toddlers get away with things they would never let an older child or teenager get away with with a misguided view that 'they don't understand'.

That's what two-year-olds do. They're active, 15mo kids are passive. It's hardly a playdate when one is twice the others age. Just keep them apart if necessary and relax in the knowledge that your DS will be doing the same thing in 13 months time.

Sorry meant discipline her son not yours.