To think that it would be nice if stuff like maypole dancing were done more but that 'wokeness' is probably not the reason that it's done less now?

[Jane3212]

On Facebook today a post popped up about traditional stuff like maypole dancing that's done less now. The person who wrote the post blamed this on 'wokeness erasing English customs'.

Is 'wokeness' really the reason maypole dancing isn't done as much? I think things like that are nice but I'm not convinced 'wokeness' was the reason they've somewhat faded. Overstretched teachers & schools could be one. It's fair to note also that maypole dancing was never something my mother (born 1960s) or grandmother (born 1930s) experienced, probably as they grew up in London.

AIBU?

That's quite unusual. Black face morris got confused with racism (and black and white minstrels) and condemned. It's actually a form of disguise, especially in border morris traditionally done by farm hands in the winter and involved a fair amount of extortion - hence the need to not be recognised.
The Morris federation doesn't allow black faced sides to join. It's one of the best places to get public liability insurance so many sides are members.
The sides which used to be black faced have tended to go with colored make up now. Or masks just over their eyes.
Black faced sides are banned by many of the bigger festivals too.

@sweetpickle2 that’s not blackface - they were mummers!

We had once a year maypole dancing at my infants school late 70s. Alas i never got chosen as one of the dancers. Maybe I would have made a mess of it.

I did the maypole at primary in the late 70s and my DC danced the maypole in their primary school in New England USA as part of a school wide May Day celebration where they sang, played handbells, marimba, displayed their art work projects and all the parents/grandparents were invited to the celebration. There would be a small riot if they suggested cancelling it as all the small dc watched the 10 yr olds dance every year and wanted to have their turn at it. It was a rite of passage and beloved

and very educational from a whole child, rather than book learning perspective

My village has a Mayday festival, complete with May Queen, loads of morris dancers, tiny children hoofing around the pole and more ribbons than you can shake a stick at. It's been going on for 400 years or so and doesn't look like stopping any time soon!
Plait dances are easy - it's the tent dances that do the damage, especially if the band keeps going when you're running out of ribbon ...

I was at a primary school in the 1960s which had a maypole. I’m pretty sure it’s the only one I’ve ever seen, and it was used just once during the 7 years I was there. Not exactly successfully iirc!

All the festivals we dance at mention how much black facepaint is allowed.
There's also a traditional dance called the "n*word dance"

We did it at primary school in the seventies and it was great fun. Never had the opportunity since sadly.

My daughter’s school does maypole dancing (tiny rural school) and they are incredible to watch. Faultless.

I can assure you we do!

I don't think it's accurate that only in England old traditions fade. It affects most places. Places like Japan or India which are often thought to preserve a lot of tradition also have this issue. Eg. In Japan in the 19th century there was rapid development & lots of old folk tales were only preserved because collectors searched them out. Other traditions like woodblock painting didn't survive, and a lot were only kept alive with concerted effort.

It's a shame & people should try to preserve this stuff: I just don't think it's only an issue in England.

This

I went to a primary school that owned an indoor-outdoor Maypole - but how many places actually have one these days?

We also did country dancing so learned a lot of folk dances - the head made it compulsory for the football team for footwork training 😉

Maypole dancing is probably one of those activities which is sneered at by those with internalised Anglophobia, but which is actually good fun if you give it a go, like English country dancing and perhaps morris dancing too. I remember doing English country dancing as a child, and it was a lot of fun. Then as an adult I did Irish ceili dancing once, and that was enjoyable too, but it was really pretty similar to English country dancing, so I thought "why on earth is ceili dancing so much more popular in England?" - I think it largely boils down to people being prejudiced against traditional English culture.

I found the opposite in Sweden - I was shocked about how many multi-generations of families head out to dance traditional dances at Midsommar.

Same with Saint Lucia's day in December where it is standing room only if you don't get to the church early

I wonder more if Irish, Scottish and Welsh traditional songs, dances etc were encouraged partly as a nationalist thing in 19th and 20th centuries, which maybe helped keep them alive. Ireland for one also stayed more rural longer which helps keep traditions alive.

Whereas England urbanised earlier and wasn't ruled by anyone else so didn't see the need to preserve/promote folk culture for nationalist reasons. Also perhaps partly class system & snobbery?

Interesting! Was this in an urban or rural area?

Many of the English who sneer at maypole dancing in England would probably find it a charming tradition if they saw it being done abroad.

People will blame wokeness for everything..

My 70s primary school had outdoor toilets and we had to share books , the idea of a maypole ..

I did Irish dancing and country dancing , which was weird as the the school was in the east end of London.
I associate maypole dancing with the wicker man film !

My eldest did a year of country dancing in year 2. She learnt all the main ones and still remembers them.

My youngest practised maypole dancing for a good half term before May Day when she was in reception. They had little costumes provided and parts (she was the May Queen). And the children and staff took it very seriously. Due to health and safety, they all wore their PE trainers. It was a very cute display outside for the parents. As much fun as the nativity at Christmas I think.

Both were private prep schools, but there’s no reason for it just to be in private schools (and probably not many of those!)

i don’t think “woke ness” is why it’s not widespread though…

Nah. Not wokeness. It's more that people just aren't that interested in it.

God I hated it at school. Utterly tedious involving a lot of standing by your ribbon. Beyond dull. Nobody liked it. It has gone because the curriculum has pushed out nearly all arts. Kids are lucky if they get art or music weeekly. Many don’t and you can firmly claim the Tories for that.

Do let us know where you’d source a gazillion Maypoles, staff that can teach Maypole dancing along with time in the curriculum and money?

There are many things that have been pushed out and schools are screaming out for, Maypoles isn’t one of them.

Back in the 70s, my progressive and diverse North London elite state primary school was big on culture. We learnt calypso songs, cockney music hall songs, and I loved country dancing. As a previous poster said, the people who keep folk going are woke hippies like my old teachers. Now I must "honour your corner lady, promenade your own, oh I want to be near you, you're the one for me..."

Maybe it's more common in the North? Did a lot of country dancing at primary and Scottish dancing at secondary (Manchester). Maypole dancing every year at the local Fete Dore, Sheffield.