Air traffic control— cyber attack?

[Stableunicorns]

DH is on a work trip abroad. Due to fly back to London this evening but his flight has been cancelled due to “air traffic control issues”. Currently rescheduled to tomorrow morning.

I look online and find references to “delays and cancellations”. But given that his flight has been completely cancelled, not just delayed, hours in advance, suggests to me that there’s a massive problem and it’s being downplayed by the authorities.

AIBU to think there’s been a cyber attack and we’re not being told the full story?

The last real UK ATC big outage from several years back got lots of people yelling cyberattack but turned out it was a real WTF/ghost in the machine job involving waypoints on a route thousands of miles apart but with duplicate names.

Never underestimate the ability of computers and related systems to find a way of....errr, stuffing up.

ETA: link to an account of the previous big system failure from 3 years ago.

https://www.flightglobal.com/ops-safety/2023/09/coincidentally-identical-waypoint-names-foxed-uk-air-traffic-control-system/

As a IT person, a lot of time it's a genuine fluff up in IT..sometimes we unintentionally take the systems out overselves.

Yes that was a really weird one, I think one of the waymarks was outside of NATS airspace, but obviously was a destination for a flight coming through our airspace.

Do you work in aviation, @notimagain, I know there are some controllers on Mumsnet? My DS works in NATS HQ but due to start ATCo training soon. He has wanted to be a controller for a long time! Most of my knowledge comes from him!

To be fair, with what's going on at the moment it's a reasonable inference rather than catastrophising.

@Vickythevan26

I used to work in aviation (most of the time as a Longhaul pilot) but hung up the headset a few years ago...

Hope your son's controller training goes OK.

i have baked beans and water bottles bought specifically

For today? I want your contacts!

Manchester is currently operational but flights are being delayed in and out. This is possibly due to flights supposed the be landing at Heathrow and Gatwick being diverted to Manchester and then that causing problems in its own right with capacity at Manchester airport.

Remember Heathrow and Gatwick are long haul hubs so a lot of flights for both would have been en route when the problem started. They have to land somewhere and Manchester is the next biggest option in terms of capacity and suitable runway size (a lot of our regional airports don't have big enough runways for some of these long haul aeroplanes).

So just it affecting those two airports will have a significant impact elsewhere.

It's likely that the long haul flights at Manchester will be being prioritised over the short haul for this reason.

What does this mean?

Heathrow was apparently able to land flights until it ran out of space to put planes because none could depart.

Also, easyJet and Ryanair have an issue with where planes end up. Some planes will do say Luton to Brussels and then Brussels to Manchester. But if the flight can't leave Luton, the flight from Brussels to Manchester gets affected too.

So it is a right mess.

It means that some people believe that Israel is either responsible for a hack or are refusing to help fix a hack (some people are saying they have helped with previous issues - which I have no idea if it's true or not).

This is based on zero evidence.

FAFO means fuck around and finding out and it's a reference to actions having consequences in this case the implication that it's connected to the decision to block trade to the west bank.

This is all hugely spectaculative and heavily political.

Sigh.

@RedToothBrushthanks, I needed confirmation. It’s quite scary so many think Israel may have done this.

I've just spent the afternoon taking the OH to the airport, hanging around various shops as he saw an 'ATC issue' video on the way there and I had a bad feeling about it, and then going back to pick him up. He has rebooked for thursday but its just such a faff.

It is entirely possible it's not Israel even if it is a hack! Don't assume this.

If it is there is also the possibility of Iran or Russia. Russia has been targeting German airports with drones and other activity in the last few weeks.

Plus DH works in tech and if very familiar with idiots nuking their own systems by accident. That's without considering AI as an option.

Personally I think all bets are off given the current climate. Too many possibilities!

Heathrow has flights that landed 4hrs ago but can't park up as there is no where for passengers to disembark.

It sounds like Manchester is getting to a similar state of affairs.

They will be parking flights for London in Amsterdam soon at this rate.

I know one should never say never but assuming every time a system burps it's a cyber attack isn't healthy or even realistic, even if it's fashionable.

This was flagged up as a specific problem with a specific sub-system on the flight planning side of the NATS set up very early on.

BTW there have been a few shorthaul departures out of LHR in the last half hour (one to MAN, one to GLA), so.something is working but the flow rate is glacial so problems continue.

You would want to get a flight to Manchester from Heathrow if you could as there's likely spaces on the return flight for all the people stranded at Manchester.

As someone that also works in cybersecurity, ATC is a high value target and it is just as likely now that an IT failure is due to deliberate attack as it is that it is human error or a systems failure (actually this is less likely now, IT hardware is pretty resilient and redundant). No way for us mere mortals to know of course but it is incorrect to scoff at the idea that it could be a deliberate hack - that is just as likely as software failure and both, statistically, more likely than hardware failure in 2026.

For those interested and slightly fluent in aviation speak here is a C&P of the Eurocontrol summary of the UK situation at around 1815 BST..the times in the C&P itself are GMT, hopefully those times will improve.

Aerodromes:

EGGW (London Luton)
Arrivals regulated at a reduced rate due to ATC Equipment (Data processing issues).
Aerodrome not available for arrivals between 1620-2200.
High delays.

EGKK (London Gatwick)
Arrivals regulated at a reduced rate due to ATC Equipment (Data processing issues).
Aerodrome not available for arrivals between 1500-2200.
High delays

EGLL (London Heathrow)
Arrivals regulated at a reduced rate due to ATC Equipment (Data processing issues).
Aerodrome not available for arrivals between 1400-2200.
High delays

EGLC (London City)
Arrivals regulated at a reduced rate due to ATC Equipment (Data processing issues).
Aerodrome not available for arrivals until 2355.
High delays.

EGSS (London Stansted)
Arrivals regulated at a reduced rate due to ATC Equipment (Data processing issues).
Aerodrome not available for arrivals between 1700-2200.
High delays.

Airspace:

EGTT (UK)
All sectors regulated at reduced rates until 0000 due to ATC Equipment (Data processing issues).
High delays.

It’s cheaper for budget airlines to cancel and rebook than it’ll be to get operate on a delay

Here is NATS saying they have switched the system off and on again.

Note: as this is classed as exceptional circumstances airlines are not liable. This they are not liable for compensation.

This is where you need travel insurance if you are affected.

This will piss off a lot of people when they realise.

Speculation in cyber channels that it was a 'demonstration' by Israel shortly after the sanctions were announced. I know some Israeli cyber guys, this wouldn't surprise me at all. Or Russian cyber rattling taking advantage of the timing. Or just a temporary technical glitch on a triple redundant system ........... who knows, we will never.

It’s pretty ironic timing if it wasn’t Israel.