AIBU to question people claiming they would happily pay more tax?

[Towerinthegarden]

Yet another thread about should there be tax rises or spending cuts, and invariably you get a host of people coming out saying they are happy to pay more. Well you can https://www.gov.uk/guidance/voluntary-payments-donations-to-government

I’m pretty sure what they actually mean is I am happy to pay a tiny amount more on the understanding others will pay a lot more and then I’ll see the benefit. If that assumption is wrong why aren’t all these people saying they’re happy to pay more doing it?

At the moment I don't think it reasonable to ask people to pay more. I think there is too much waste and I think the wrong people often end up getting a lot out of our current system.

No I would not be happy paying more tax. This country is not short of money it is negligent in managing what it does have. Politicians give away billions in foreign aid (especially to Pakistan WHY?), millions to illegal immigrants whilst our public services are on its knees and our own people are neglected

Yes and inclusion at all costs is ultimately damaging the experience of education. The classroom environment simply isn't the best place for some children, who may well thrive in a different environment. All deserve a good education, but the way it is delivered needs to be about what is best for the child.

The posters saying that they would love to pay more tax but only for specific purposes are ridiculous or outcomes are being ridiculous. It's not how tax works. We elect governments and they spend the money. If you bang on about being happy to be taxed more then you have to accept your extra contribution could go towards anything and would quickly get consumed within the system. Your noble contribution of £10k for example would fund 10% of some children's SEN placement for a year or a few weeks in some care homes for an elderly person.

But money is fungible

after I had my second baby we made a donation to the hospital - specifically the birth centre

Tbf if someone wants to donate £10k they could to a local school, which would be appreciated.

Same. The reason that I’m not signing the link is because it’s just a voluntary payment so you pay it and poof! it’s gone. You might just as well lose money in the lottery for all good it does.

I’ve always said that I would willingly pay more tax if it remained on our progressive system, for better and more comprehensive service services. I stick to that conviction. It’s quite selfish: society is better, healthier and more stable with a good and strong infrastructure and when it is more equal. The research conclusively shows that..

Why do you get to decide those who would pay more are lying?

You are being incredibly nerrowminded. There is always a group of voters in every survey who are willing to shift to a higher taxation model.

It's fine for you to say you wouldn't, but it's not ok for you to deny other people's political views.

Because if they wanted to they could but instead they make excuses. If you say you want to pay more but don’t then you are lying, it’s really that simple otherwise people would do it. If you all wait around for it to be on your terms you’ll wait forever but I just see it as an excuse when presented with a way to pay extra tax.

They don't want to alone, they want to move to a different model. Many of those people pay to charities instead but would prefer those services to be provided by the state.

Argue against the model. Play the ball not the person.

They don't want to alone, they want to move to a different model. Many of those people pay to charities instead but would prefer those services to be provided by the state.

Argue against the model. Play the ball not the person.

I used to say I would be happy to pay more but that was back when I naively trusted the Government to be sensible with our hard earned money. Several Governments of all political parties have demonstrated that they are happy to waste money willy nilly on various identity politics causes without even managing to fulfill the basics required of them by law such as education, health, bin collections etc. So no, let me keep and spend more of my own money, time to cut spending and at least keep taxes level so borrowing can be repaid. It's all a great big Ponzi scheme and will inevitably end in tears. I am happy to pay national insurance in retirement though. Why should NHS be free just because retired. I have BUPA anyway as NHS takes too long.

I pay enough, so no.

A small amount of additional revenue to the Treasury from people willing to make voluntary donations is not going to be sufficient to fix our neglected public services. I want everyone to pay more, including myself.

Until that happens, I will continue to direct what I can afford into charitable projects that pick up the pieces. Charitable projects that would not even be necessary if our public services were working as effectively as they should.

Voluntary is a good way to do it as you’d not get behavioural changes.

Those who are keen can pay more, those who are not won’t change behaviour to avoid it.

I wouldn’t be happy to pay more after a career in the civil service seeing money spunked left right and centre due to mismanagement and a complete lack of fucks given by senior people. You could pay 99% tax and there’d still be no money for those that need it.

@Harrumphhhh No it won’t! It’s not working like this economically. There are not enough jobs to go around and young people are not held back by your assertion that they lack a good education. Exam results are not backing that up. The huge problem is the economy not growing and young people being too expensive to employ. Their education and opportunities at college is rarely a huge issue. It’s too few jobs.

But it’s such a facile argument. I assume that most people have at least one thing they think should be funded more (schools, police, NHS etc) and the fact that aren’t sending a monthly direct to their local primary school or hospital doesn’t mean that you can discount their opinion or assume they’re lying when they say education should be better funded.

Oh give over.

The point is people want to change the model.

It's a legitimate policy position to argue for higher taxes, the status quo, or for lower taxes.

But total bollocks to pretend a voluntary donation would be equivalent to a higher taxation model.

Suggesting a voluntary system isn't a serious contribution to the discussion of the correct taxation system.

Oh so they want everyone to be crippled by tax hikes, got it. Very selfish attitude to have when lots of people are barely making ends meet as it is, as long as you can afford it though then that’s fine.

It's a NO from me. I already pay tax on money I have already paid tax on over the years.

Oh give over back at you.

Your higher taxes have already cost jobs.

It's no more 'selfish' to believe there should be higher taxes, lower taxes or no change.

Adults should be capable of talking about politics seriously, in terms of policy impact across society.

My higher taxes? What taxes am I responsible for?
This is the problem. Not enough people can actually discuss policies calmly.

I have deliberately not said what tax level I would suggest was right.

My point is anyone is entitled to say they want taxes to go up, down or stay the same. They should be able to explain what the likely impact will be.

Lots of people already do voluntarily support local fundraising and hospital and other local charities as well as national charities. But that’s done to patch things up. I’d prefer a comprehensive national system rather than a postcode lottery