Divorced male politician champions marriage?

[Warmlight1]

To think this is a huge red flag ( but not a patriotic one)

www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/couples-children-should-married-reform-uk-deputy-leader-richard-tice-b1294502.html?fbclid=IwdGRjcAT6MT5jbGNrBPoxJ3Bkb2YBZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAc3J0YwZhcHBfaWQMMzUwNjg1NTMxNzI4AAEeyhi_hx1fz8j-pF2h0MYQMsrJTXV9WFwrH-PekD1iPGKmDU6n0zx3qpoS1dE_aem_OKiH8_wE8O3iLTAIFPy42g

It's all us Asians who will get priority! We are all decently married and guess what: British born. 😀

@friedaklein WTF does 'decently married' mean?

British born muslims are part of the 'British born Asian' group you refer to and a recent Channel 4 survey showed 60-66% of their marriages were not legally binding (religious marriage only) so would not count under these rules.

Reform are horrendous and these kind of nonsense make things more divisive and worse. We all need to be treated respectfully regardless of marital status.

I'm happy for you all! But seriously this was the case in my community ( speaking very generally) but one generation later looks back on multiple divorces and a lot of women putting up with stuff they oughtn't have.

No, I absolutely agree women put up with what they shouldn't have and I am all in favour of divorce being easier for Asian women.

I am joking. I thought that was obvious.
I don't care if people are married or not.
In fact, I think single mums should get priority.

But that is because they find there are more advantages to being unmarried if you are poor. I'm not legally married. We had a ceremony that we consider to be our wedding and we refer to each other as husband and wife, but we aren't formally married. It was postponed due to family illness and then I got pregnant so just never got around to it.

We have to do it in the next year or so for other reasons. Just deciding whether to make a "thing" of it.

I will start by saying I completely disagree with Reform, their members, their policies and most of what they stand for.

I do however think it’s interesting to look at whether the decline of marriage has contributed in some way to the housing crisis. I was married, I’m now divorced. My ex and I now live in two houses instead of one, with the kids splitting their time between us. We each rent a 3 bedroom house to accommodate this. Our circumstances are mirrored many thousands of times across the country.

I don’t know what the fix is. I would not choose to remain married to my lying, cheating ex. No one should remain in an unhappy marriage, or be encouraged to marry to secure a council house. I don’t think married couples need to be given housing priority over other more vulnerable groups. But the decline in marriage, or I suppose the increase in divorce rates, is contributing to the housing crisis.

Absolutely. But I think you may have been suggesting that the policy might have a consequence which he doesn't intend in terms of relatively higher proportion of British ethnic minorities qualifying- is that what you are getting at?

Maybe the issue is that incompatible people are marrying and having kids. People with totally different ideas on parenting, hygiene, education and health are partnering up for reasons other than they will create a happy, healthy family unit.

Be honest, don't you see a lot of couples that really don't seem to like each other much?

Yes! Like Brexit.

I think the causes of the housing crisis lie in decades of neoliberal policy and the transformation of housing from a basic human need into a commodity and mechanism for the transference of wealth to the already wealthy. In other words, don't worry. You are not the problem!

As for Mr Tice, Dicky by name...

They talk absolute 💩 this man probably blames his ex wife for absolutely everything they don't care about women they just care about men and how women owe them a life and children !

This ^^

I don't know the figures, but there are so many families using up two houses these days, instead of just one. And that, coupled with the fact everyone is living much longer, and that for the most part, we no longer have several generations of a family sharing one house, mean we need more houses than we ever did before. And that's not considering the current immigration figures, be they legal or illegal.

That’s how I interpreted @friedakleinpost. Reform just spout the first vaguely contentious thing they think of that makes their supporters happy, without considering what it means in reality. The unintended consequences would definitely raise blood pressure in certain quarters 😉

But we already know they want to scrap the HRA and Equality Act. This could mean that same sex marriages, civil partnerships, civil marriages, overseas marriages or non-Christian marriages etc could be made unlawful or not recognised as legal under a Reform government.

I don't think reform are going to scrap same sex marriages. I don't think it would be wrong to not recognise marriages which don't meet the legal definition of 'married', in this country. Religious/humanist ceremonies that aren't legal, should not be treated as such, wherever those ceremonies take place and irrespective of the legal standing in those other countries.
That said, I don't agree with prioritising married couples for housing - marital status is completely irrelevant to the level of need. As things stand, single parents need more support, but maybe this wouldn't be the case if we made NRP pay their fair share of children's' costs, instead of putting most of the responsibility onto single mums.

Well there's no doubt about it but but everyone is acting as if these things are fixed.
Divorce is expensive. Look at the costs to couples who divorce. So why the big rush to get married? Especially coming from a Divorced man. Why not do much more politically to enable stable co- parenting, and take the pressure off people to commit their whole lives to each other?
There could be shared housing co operative arrangements for single parents. There could be better childcare networks enabling people to work flexibly. We can re imagine housing to accommodate relationship and parenting. Not the other way round.

Got to the bit about children ideally being 'British born' and closed it down.

It’s weird to fetishise marriage over healthy, committed partnerships.

They seem to think marriage ending in divorce is still better than being together for 30+ years never marrying.

I don’t actually have too much of an issue with this in that it’s usual conservative fare. (And I say that as somebody unmarried and childless so who clearly did not do a “good thing for society”). I also am not massively opposed prioritising married couples over single people, with children or not) if you want to support and encourage family formation.

But it is unusual when people champion a life they are not leading.

I was thinking this. Does he realise this may mean an overrepresentation of people from Asian communities which his followers may take issue with.

Which survey was that?

Agree with this. Higher numbers of people living outside of a family structure (whether divorced of simply unmarried) does require more housing. I live alone if I had a partner that would immediately be one less home needed. A friend of mine is a single woman who owns her 4 bedroom home. One less family home on the market occupied by just one person placing pressure on availability for others. Dunno how we fix that though.

Surely it should be those most in need first in queue, married or not is irrelevant.

That's what struck me as sheer effrontery - the complete blanking out of his own reality
Even Catholic priests caution against getting married solely for children. It is a huge and in religious terms sacred commitment. Which he'd know as he's apparently a Christian.
Anyway that aside, there's no mention of how domestic abuse continues to be challenged in this policy. Generally needs to be easier to leave not more difficult.

Also what about widows/widowers with children who find themselves in a single parent household through no fault of their own? Or say the husband fucks off and leaves the wife and kids? Not thought through at all.

If yo u were both in social housing, only the one claiming CB would be entitled to a 3 bed tho, the other a 1 bed because you don't house kids twice. So one will either get our of overnights, kids will be on the floor or the parent private rents. So whilst you'd need 2 homes, social housing shouldn't be providing 2 3 beds.

I think anything worked to stop women escaping abusive homes is clearly regressive, and reeks of rich, male entitlement .