To think a new/ex demo 7 seater would be a waste of money for us?

[Mastersstudent83]

For context, we are a family with 3 older dc still at home (1 adult who doesn't drive, 1 teen, 1 pre teen) and one just graduated from uni, not living with us but visiting every 6 weeks or so. We currently own a 2 year old hatchback (bought ex demo 2 years ago). This is the first time we have owned a nearly new car, having had years of running old bangers into the ground.

Most days this works well for us, as during the week there is only usually the driver or the driver and one passenger in the car. It's been reliable, is under warranty, has fairly good fuel efficiency (though not great for it's size), is easy to drive around town and the monthly finance is low as a percentage of our income.

However, when our dc who has left home comes to visit/when grandma comes to stay/on longer trips/ddog comes along with us all, it's not at all suitable. We either stick to walkable distances or split up the group and some of us take a bus/train instead. These situations crop up at least monthly, and although it's the minority of the time, when it happens it's just so inconvenient we have come to the conclusion that we do need to go back to a 7 seater.

The trouble is, DH loves the peace of mind of owning a newer car under warranty and would prefer this. I totally appreciate this. The younger 2dc are autistic and breaking down in an old, unreliable car would just be awful for everyone. We do rely on a car to get around as public transport overwhelming for youngest dc. But the payments on a nearly new car of this size would be £££ more than we currently pay. Although we could afford this, we don't have much left on our mortgage, and we were planning to pay this off early. This won't happen so soon if the car payments increase significantly. Plus the depreciation will be huge.

With our kids' ages, I don't think we will need a bigger car for long, so I wonder if it might be a better idea to buy a 12 plus year old Volvo XC90 in cash. The excellent safety record, luxury spec and good boot space even with the rear seats up is what attracts me to this model. I understand Volvos have a good reputation to go on for years if you buy one with FSH and maintain well. DH is sceptical, so I would love to hear people's experiences with older Volvos and thoughts about this situation generally.

You could use hiring a car as a dry run to see how much easier it would be and whether it's worth the extra cost.

Is there a combination of passengers that could allow a smaller second car whilst meeting the needs of the children?

A tip for cars I got from my dad is to look at what cars taxi firms buy as they can't afford for them to be unreliable and they usually are more spacious to allow airport runs and similar.

I agree. I drive a 14 year old 7 seater Ford that I bought about 3 years ago, no trouble with it at all. DH drives a 15 year old focus. We used to have a 22 year old Yaris that never cost us anything in repairs?

I would be very very nervous about buying a Dacia without checking crash test ratings, especially a 7 seater as they're not always tested with the 6+7th seats in.

You don’t need to hire a 7 seater! Four of you can go in the normal car and three in the hire car. Or, frankly, buy a small, cheap second car. DC can learn to drive in it too. Make sure the autistic DC are in the more reliable one.

Something like this.

Yeah we saw the low ratings but it's based on very specific sensors and such. The actual results for the dummies were fine.

This is a good point. I do love the safety record of the XC90.

12 plus year old Volvo XC90

I have two friends with them and they've had loads of trouble from new.

Interesting. My DH finds all the 'nanny' safety features a PITA, so would probably suit him quite well. I will do some research.

That's interesting to know. Do you know if it was electrical issues? Some people find the older models less hassle because fewer components to go wrong.

Definitely do your own research to see what you are comfortable with - my feedback on it is that it drives fine and we haven't had any issues (so far), but the middle row is tight. Not sure it would work well for primarily adult-sized people unless you're on the smaller side as a family. Oddly the 3rd row is more spacious! We really did struggle to find anything under £25K with 7 seats and without 100K miles... definitely a gap in the market.

This sounds like the perfect solution to me.

This would be workable on shorter trips, but as mentioned to a pp, on longer journeys the younger dc need regular support from a parent (both autistic, the youngest has several additional conditions).

If we split into 2 cars, at least one driver would need to both drive and support. It would be exhausting at best and dangerously distracting at worst. Older dc try to help but often inadvertently make things worse, so can't rely on help there, plus I don't think it's fair on them to rely on this.

@Superscientist Thanks for the taxi tip. We live near to an airport and I must say I have seen a fair few Joggers being used as airport taxis. Hadn't realised they had 7 seats, thought they were standard estates tbh.

Is there a reason none of the other adults can drive the second car? Grandmother? Older DC?

@PurpleThistle7 Oddly, I actually think more space in the back row would be better for us. DC4 would prefer to sit separately from her taller brothers, but it would be easier for me or DH to provide support from the front passenger seat if she is in the middle row.

The Dacia Jogger has a one-star EuroNCAP safety rating, a deeply flawed conclusion which EuroNCAP reached without even crash-testing it.

Far better analytical minds than mine have written much about how that rating was awarded. Here's one such: https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/features/opinion/tom-wiltshire/dacia-jogger-euro-ncap A perfunctory google search will bring up many similar articles all saying the same thing.

Essentially, the rating is comprised of a number of different categories, and the overall final score cannot be higher than the lowest individual category score. When the current Jogger was launched EuroNCAP did not crash it, but simply took the rating awarded to the Sandero (which is structurally similar from the B-pillar forwards, but completely different from that point backwards) and deducted one point in the 'safety assist' category because there is no seatbelt warning for the third row. The Sandero had only scored two stars in safety assist itself because Dacia had made a decision on cost grounds not to fit lane-keeping assist, and the autonomous braking system at the time was radar based so did not detect pedestrians, only other cars. With the deduction of the star for the lack of third-row seatbelt warning reducing the safety assist category score to one star, the overall EuroNCAP score was capped at one star. The car itself is structurally fine in a crash, and it comfortably meets all the EU regulatory requirements.

Then, with the GSR2 rules which came into force in August 2024, lane-keeping assist became mandatory anyway, as did speed limit sign recognition. As the latter is camera-based the autonomous emergency braking system on the Jogger became camera-based too so it now (as of any Jogger ordered after 4th April 2024 in the UK) detects pedestrians. So most of the issues the Sandero was originally penalised for, which flowed down to the Jogger, have now been rectified but the cars have never been retested and the EuroNCAP rating has not been updated. And the research shows most drivers switch them off anyway.

I’ve just bought a grand tourneo 2023 plate for less than £300 a month. 7 seats.

Every time I’ve had an old car it’s dropped to bits!

I would get a slightly older Toyota verso. Totally reliable and you will get one relatively cheaply. 7 seats when you need them. I’ve only just got rid of my 2008 200k miles one. Also good safety

Unfortunately not. DM can't drive, oldest dc is learning but lives 8 hours drive away (4 on the train), so is likely to continue taking the train up for ease. DC2 about to study full time in a local city which is not car friendly, so no rush to learn just yet.

Yes - this is the exact information we found when we were looking into it. I wouldn't want lane assist anyway as I hate all the beeping! And my kids are older so put on their own seatbelts no trouble. So those issues weren't a problem for me.

I drove my Jogger home after collecting it from the dealer before I'd worked out how to switch lane-keeping assist off. It was absolutely terrifying. Not a mistake I've made since.

I don't want to hijack this thread with pro-Dacia propaganda but one of the irritating things about the modern safety tech is that they have to reset themselves back to 'on' at every start. If the off switch is buried deep in several layers of menus on the screen it becomes really frustrating. With Renault/Dacia cars you can set all your preferences once, then apply them with a double push of a physical button on the dash at the start of every journey - it's a sanity saver.

Is there more than one driver? What about hiring a second small car for the occasions it is needed?

Mastersstudent83 · Today 15:38

That's interesting to know. Do you know if it was electrical issues? Some people find the older models less hassle because fewer components to go wrong.

Sorry, I'm not sure - the only one I remember was a clutch problem, they were just complaining that they were always in the garage.

As a fellow Zafira driver I think the Dacia Jogger is the only sensible modern alternative. Cheap, 7 seats, practical.
Or pick up an older 7 seater car and do bangernomics. Many 2012 Zafiras still about, Renault grand scenic was available to 2020, Citroen grand C4 Picasso

Here is a great summary of the market: www.autoexpress.co.uk/best/used-mpvs-people-carriers

Thanks everyone. Spoken to DH about Dacia Joggers. Going to do some research and possibly book a test drive.