AIBU to ask whether you own a Bible?

[BeanQuisine]

Just idle curiosity, really.

We often hear right-wingers insisting "This is a Christian country", whether we're in UK, Oz or the US etc.

So I'm wondering how many of us actually own Bibles, and whether we ever read them. I did read assorted bits of it in my youth, but don't currently own a Bible.

YABU: Whether Mumsnetters own Bibles or not is none of your business.

YANBU: It's a vaguely interesting question.

I'm sure lots of people are reading Homer's Odyssey this summer, and even more are not, but I suspect the ones who aren't just say 'no, I'm not reading it' rather than insisting that it's tosh and that they don't believe in the Olympians.

Choosing to read ancient literature does not imply complete acceptance of the world view demonstrated in that literature. I say that as someone for whom the bible is my scripture. But it doesn't have to be yours for it to be interesting.

Did anyone check out Ezekiel's donkey reference?

Yes, Catholic here. I wouldn't describe UK as a christian country, far from it. Most people are atheists.

Would have been funnier if you hadn't laughed at your own joke.

What's the likelihood you understand what is meant by "right wingers" when they state that this is a Christian country? Or what it means to be a Christian?

I got one when I was christened . I believe it’s in my mums loft. Never read it and I never will as I don’t believe in religion

I was given a bible when I left my (religious) school. It is at my mum's as it's inscribed and she is sentimental so I guess I technically own a bible but it is not currently in my possession!

What about all Christian countries in Africa the
Sub-Saharan and Southern Africa, as well as in North African communities.
Christianity does not = white. 🙄
Some of the most devout Christian’s I know are black.

There might be one kicking around in a box somewhere. I can’t rule it out.

The New Revised Standard version ( Anglicised) is a good 'middle of the road' choice, not ultra modern wacky language but not King James and old 'quaint' language either. I also quite like the Living Bible Translation and the New International Version. I suggest you look up something familiar to you or I could suggest
1 Corinthians chaper 13 on Bible Gateway website. You can scroll through the text in many translations or paraphrases and see which sits comfortably with you.

The people in those countries are not sitting in the UK loudly proclaiming it a "Christian" country despite the demographics clearly showing it's nothing of the sort.

There is an element who use "Christian" and "ethnically white" interchangeably because its suits their agenda and appeals to their audience. They're commonly referred to as Christofascists, they used to be a predominantly American thing, but like everything Trumpian it's gradually making it's way over here, chiefly through people like Tommy Robinson, and a few characters in the Reform and Restore "parties".

Bizarrely, Zia Yusuf was at the "British Values" thing recently. How that man can pretend that he's not also going to be on a boat "home" if his buddies get their way is beyond me.

No. I don’t happen to collect mythology. I’ve read various kinds, but don’t really need to dedicate the shelf space to it.

People say the UK is a Christian country because they don't have the language to more precisely describe British culture, but they know that it's substantively different from countries which don't practice the Christian religion and it's a clear label that they can reach for.

I've lived in countries with a higher % of active Christian worshippers which nevertheless are quite different from British culture so I agree it is not the right terminology. But I also think that the Christian faith has shaped British culture and it's strange to claim that it's just a pure secular culture that came from nothingness (those old maids were bicycling to Evensong after all).

Many attempts to describe British culture more carefully though are ruthlessly disparaged by the current state establishment though. What is the default response when asked what British Values are? To parrot the nonsense from gov.uk about liberty, tolerance, respect for our diversity etc. Those aren't substantive cultural markers, those are tools for managing multiple cultures!

British people are frequently lost when it comes to trying to identify what their own culture is because they lack this language - it has been taken from them. (It's plain as day to anyone who's lived elsewhere, of course.) Can we blame them for reaching for a word which however imperfectly tries to convey the idea that a British culture does exist substantively and we aren't just living in a managed economic zone?

Yes - very graphic!

I was worried it would be some atrocity perpetrated on a poor donkey, so I was quite relieved.

British people are frequently lost when it comes to trying to identify what their own culture is because they lack this language - it has been taken from them. (It's plain as day to anyone who's lived elsewhere, of course.) Can we blame them for reaching for a word which however imperfectly tries to convey the idea that a British culture does exist substantively and we aren't just living in a managed economic zone?

I agree. I think British culture is an infinite number of things - and would be a different combination for every individual.

To me it's about major cultural figures - rather humanities-based, for me, because that's my main area of interest: William Morris, Thomas Hardy, Vaughan Williams, Purcell and loads more artists and thinkers too. Also the engineering and science geniuses in our history and the countryside and architecture.

I like evolution, not revolution (What do we want? Gradual change. When do we want it? In due course!) and I like the fact that, on the whole, that's the way British history has happened - no major bloodbath or political trauma like the French or Russian Revolutions.

Please don't say 'but you've missed out this/that//the other'. Yes, of course I have - I'm just giving my personal take - everyone will have their own. I wouldn't presume to make a statement that fits everyone.

I had an illustrated bible as a child, but I no longer have it.

I remember being given another Bible when I was in primary school. I’m not sure why because I didn’t attend a faith school. Though, I’m pretty sure I stuck the pages together with nail polish…

What a busy thread !

People say the UK is a Christian country because they don't have the language to more precisely describe British culture, but they know that it's substantively different from countries which don't practice the Christian religion and it's a clear label that they can reach for.

I'm quite swayed by the whole "western world" being shorthand for the fundamental shift in human belief demonstrated by Christianity. As advanced by Tom Holland (not that one) in "Dominion".

I don’t think the once’s spouting about a Christian country are focused on race. Not denying that there aren’t a lot of racists about.
My personal opinion is that they’re against Islamic culture, the differences in values, the changes in society, parks becoming places of worship, most meat providers opting for halal.
Need I say it the victims of the grooming gangs, cities becoming predominantly Muslim areas.

Me, I'm swayed by the "western world" being shorthand for the fundamental shift in human belief demonstrated by The Enlightenment.

And yes, although Christianity played some role in that, it was really a profound movement away from religion, and towards a modern civilization in which science and reason hold far greater authority (both ontologically and ethically) than myths and superstitions.

Not really though, monastic schools and later universities that advanced reason and science, and public hospitals, the administration of charity, and, above all, reading and books, were all part of the European Christian package for many centuries before the 'enlightenment' showed up.

they were novelty items. Some came with a magnifying glass

I have the new testament. If I want old testament I can get it on the internet.

I do, I also have a Koran, and texts from other religions because they are interesting

No I don’t, I don’t remember seeing one in any hotels recently either.

i still have have the Gideon Bible we were all given at school and which has a reading guide to read it in 2 years, which I have done. I also have a King James Bible and one in another language from the country we live in.

i am no longer a practiser or believer as I once was: too much misogyny and too many church scandals, but I keep the books as they all mean something to me and I will possibly read again some day.

On the other hand, the Enlightenment helped put an end to the religious stranglehold on science, education and thought in general, paving the way for the modern Western secular world in which ideas and theories can be discussed without the risk of dire punishments for heresy.