AIBU to think prolonged young adult lifestyles now extend into people’s forties and to wonder what the outcome of that will be?

[rotiegg]

Of the bat this isn't really about a judgement about any one person its just to trigger a speculative conversation about this trend.

I am noticing that the lifestyle of what was once “young adulthood” i.e. casual dating, hook ups, going out to pubs, clubs and parties every weekend, drugs, booze, some what chaotic lives, poor diets, living in messy flat shares, mostly not having kids or being married and a career that is all over the place, doing unpaid, or precarious work still trying to break into various fields is now going on into people’s 40’s? In fact I was inspired to start this threat after listening to a women on a local community radio show talk about her new art show which explores living that kind of life at 40 while also starting to deal with perimenopause.

There was also a segment where two women again about 40ish spoke about things their friends had done as “revenge” to recent past lovers and it was really immature stuff like urinating on a drunk passed out boyfriend in a club because he hadn’t helped her when she’d been sick and another where a friend of theirs orchestrated an elaborate rouse where they enlisted a friend who they knew would be an ex’s dream woman to seduce him via Instagram and once he was in love with her got her to dump him brutally to break his heart.
I do get that it’s a lot harder these days to find secure housing, committed relationships, well paying work, especially in the arts. I work in the creative arts as well and so I see a lot of this in my peer group and we are probably at the coal face of precarity for middle class workers but even if people decide to opt out of traditional work or living arrangements at some point surely a degree of maturity is reached?

I’m not immune to this, my life isn’t exactly where I thought it would be by this stage in many ways but I do think my life is more stable than it was when I was 23. I just wonder if people think that the fact that people are delaying or unable to progress in life as they did in the past that it is also sort of extending the behaviours of youth as described above for longer and what that means when people who never “grew up mentally” start to bump into real physical ageing with out a home or savings etc? I know its been a thing for a while but in the past it seemed to go on until the 30’s now its stretching into the 40’s where things like real aging, disease and menopause wait for most of us.

That doesn't logically follow. One could say she really ended up poor, with two kids and a loser bloke because she agreed with you that this is what real life is supposed to be like.

She could have chosen a happier life as a single woman with no kids and no loser bloke.

True. But doing that with two young children will be a lot harder. And starting from scratch in your 40s with 2 young children even more so.

Yes but life simply isn’t straightforward and not everybody follows the same pattern. Thank goodness.

She will find her way. All power to her.

It's a perfect storm of factors. I think the arts have always attracted people who are more comfortable with instability, or accept it to pursue their dreams. My uncle is almost 70 and him and all of his friends are artists and still behave like they are 20. I think he's moved between countries too much to qualify for a pension anywhere, he currently "lives" in an artists community just outside Frankfurt but he's not there very often. My mum had to pay the bill to get his motorbike fixed last week or he'd have been indefinitely stranded in Brighton.

But also, "adult" life is increasingly hard to achieve. Can't save 50 grand for a deposit? Can't afford kids? Might as well have a good time I suppose. Then there's choice, there's more than one way to live life and society is way more accepting of that than it used to be.

One where they don’t piss on other people without their consent, mostly.

My thoughts exactly. Had this woman not bought the "biological clock" nonsense, and the idea that a woman is only complete with a man (any man will do) and a couple of kids, then she could well have ended up a happy, single, childfree woman. The horror.

From an individual pov it makes sense to postpone after career etc or ultimately have choice over whether to have the house + 2kids. Except if delayed much then there's usually not so much energy left, child is left with aging parents early etc
From a societal pov this is a bit of a disaster with narrowing populations, noone to pay for or look after all the aging people, less scientific innovation, less advancements cos less people to do them etc. But great with some of those singles looking after their parents... That's all transitionary though, one generation or two of difficulties until it stabilises.
From a environmental pov less population will be much better. Provided we don't find new and innovative ways to kill the planet like data centres.

But she would be in the exact same position had she grabbed a bloke in her 20s

I don’t see moving country as extended young adulthood. It takes a lot of planning and is quite difficult to do.

I think the only people I know who are my age (late 40s) and don't own property aren't irresponsible - they're just less well off in the first place than me and most of my other friends. Similarly those who have job-hopped low status jobs - they're friends who weren't well off in the first place and didn't manage to get a great education. I have one good mate who is smart guy but basically goes from one menial job to another (no fault of his own, those jobs just aren't very stable) and my (privately educated) DH has said of him 'If he'd been able to access the education I had he'd have done at least as well as me'.

Depends on the circumstances of course but it's all been in the EU and he's got a British and an Irish passport, not sure there's been much planning involved.

Not quite by late 30s the school run would be coming to an end.

I'm not quite sure what you're getting at, but I think I agree. I've got a friend in her 50s who does the festival circuit every year: Latitude, Isle of Wight etc. The rigid way of life that people lived in previous generations has given way to a move to do what you want, try different things, travel, delay marriage, kids (if at all), housing ladder etc. Top that up with huge global influences through social media about what a good life looks like, higher expectations from women about relationships, the rise of the child-free and Peter Pan appears to be alive and kicking. Although I think you might be talking about people who just never get around to securing their future and are then left stranded when old age and illness strike?

And you can ask the other side questions

How many people who are with a mortgage and want to move but are stuck with kids settled and the complications and cost of moving house, if it’s even possible?

How many people don’t find parenting fulfilling or fun or loving, it’s hard daily grind with no possibility to take a career chance because you have to earn X amount every month no matter what?

How many people have a relationship that has lost its passion? Or even worse?

There is a stability in being self sufficient, there is a stability in only having yourself to worry about.

How many people regret the mortgage, kids, husband? A lot more than admit it I would wager.

It’s just as easy to be trapped as it is to be rudderless.

We have two teens boys who are lovely, and on the rare occasion they listen to life advice from us we don’t suggest that they buy a house, settle down and have children as their life goals. Get an education, have fun, take chances, go where the opportunities are. That is our advice.

I can't be bothered to point out all the obvious differences. Enjoy your evening.

Not a horror at all from my perspective. Preferable to most other ways to live IMO.

I don't know anyone in their 40s acting how you describe, I don't even know anyone in their 30s acting that way. I also don't know anyone working in the arts, maybe it's more prevalent in that group, it does kind of fit the stereotype.

You’re correct.

In some ways it’s nice people aren’t being forced to settle down earlier than they are ready for.

On the other hand yes I do find people much more immature now. And yes, having children does generally (not always) mature you as you have far less time to indulge yourself than previously and your life becomes about responsibility and duty.

I’m mid 30s, I went to a lovely girls state school in a middle class area where the girls had professional parents and were well educated. Regardless, I have experienced the following from my (childfree) friends in recent months:

1. Turning up to meet my youngest DC as a newborn, having smoked a spliff and genuinely expecting me to be fine with that
2. Another friend coming to visit, turning up 2 hours late without apology (she was hungover, apparently) when she knew I was cooking a roast that would be ready by X time. She then simply ate her meal and left within 90 minutes because ‘she had somewhere else to be’ (and yes before anyone starts, it’s normally me making the effort to go to her as it’s halfway across the country).
3. Another friend who turned into an absolute head case when she got dumped, and spent years trash talking and social media stalking her ex before he agreed to get back with her and now we have to pretend the whole thing never happened
4. Loads of other friends talking gleefully about taking drugs at music festivals, probably made by orphaned Colombian street children; before talking about the evils of billionaires etc
5. Another friend moved to New Zealand and threw an enormous leaving party and we all contributed to a very expensive leaving gift. She returned 2 months later, having partied away her money and ‘not realising how much things cost out there’.
6. I have a ton more friends who have spent their lives from job to job and travelling, saving no money, who now at late 30 something have no pension, savings or permanent home and will clearly be very reliant on the state in future years. A few of them are trying for babies.

Very few of them seem to have any self awareness, or proper life experience they’ve accrued in the last 20 years. They’re about to crash headlong into middle age with nothing.

I only know one person like this. Most people I know , infact everyone else , had it together by mid 30s. However it’s hardly surprising these days. People can’t afford to adult anymore.

They can always afford to travel, party, drive a nice car and get on the jabs though..

I think people are prone to unhappiness no matter what they do. If their childfree life was so fulfilling they wouldn’t have got married and had a baby. My childfree friends had wayyyy more fun than me for a few years. But are now a bit sad and rudderless, and the party lifestyle is less kind to a 38 year old than a 25 year old. I think the childfree life needs to be planned as carefully as the husband/children thing - you need extra financial safety, savings, more self reliance, a stronger social group. If you are sensible and do all of that, I imagine it’s a great way to live.

Honestly I love watching the lifestyles of a few friends who have gone 'off piste' and go around DJing,, being at festivals all summer and so on. I'm not jealous of them and I don't expect them to be jealous of me, I think we can appreciate the variety of our friends' lives

Thought nearly all bank workers have been given the elbow now

But l do take your point.

Ah, live and let live. Not everyone wants to follow life's "script".