Do you use parent & child spaces when you don’t have a child?

[incognito1991]

I’ve just got back from my local retail park, which is where my nearest supermarket is and getting increasingly wound up. My 2 year old DD was asleep so I sat in the car for 10 minutes until she woke and we could go to the shop. Within those 10 minutes I saw 3 different cars parking in a parent and child bay and it was only them, no child, not pregnant, just selfish. No matter where I go I struggle to get a parent and child space because they’re all taken up by idiots with no children, I even see people with older children use these spaces, I think they should specify it’s for babies and toddlers not your 10 year old. I really struggle getting my DD in and out of the car in a normal bay as I can’t open the door wide enough, can barely squeeze her in aswell as leaning in to strap her in. If you park in one of these spaces I’d love to hear your reasons please.

I remember how frustrating it was when mine were young so I do understand the frustration but kindly if you were holding a P&C parking space waiting for your child to wake up, you would be part of the problem too as they were not designed for that either (not 100 pc clear if you were or not). There is just not a recognition generally that these spaces are limited and if being used for illegitimate reasons, it’s stops those with legitimate reasons from using them,

Nope, I would not.

I never have, and never would. Selfish behaviour

I don’t use them without a child but can think of a few justifications: 1) some may consider them the appropriate size that all spaces should be 2) which is worse - being mildly inconvenienced as a parent or having your car doors damaged by other car doors (I know which I would chose) 3) people may be ideologically opposed to this privilege and consider it discrimination.

can you back this up? The gov.uk website for ‘The Blue Badge scheme: rights and responsibilities in England’ says ‘The badge is intended for on-street parking only.
Off-street car parks, such as those provided by shopping centres, hospitals or supermarkets are covered by separate rules.’

the my gov Scotland site says ‘Car parks with a Blue Badge
There are usually spaces reserved for Blue Badge holders in car parks.

Car parks set their own rules for Blue Badge holders including:

• where you can park
• how long you can park for
• if you need a ticket
• how much you need to pay
• if you need to use a parking clock’

Gov.wales says ‘The badge is intended for on-street parking only. Off-street car parks, such as those provided in hospitals, supermarkets or local authority car parks are governed by separate rules’

The RAC website says ‘Parent and child bays are reserved for parents or guardians with one or more children under 12 years old. It’s unclear whether pregnant women can use the spaces and probably best to ask an individual store manager what their rules are.While it isn’t illegal to park in a parent and child bay if you don’t have a child under 12 with you, you could be hit with a Parking Charge Notice (PCN).
Disabled drivers should use the dedicated bays for blue badge holders’

Cars were much smaller, car parks were less busy, people didn't use car seats anywhere near as much as they do now...

Reasonable adjustment would overrule any car parks own rules when it comes to a blue badge user parking in a P and C space if that is the most appropriate space for them. Nobody in their right mind would try to take that to court!

ds is 16 and if there are no blue badge spaces, or if the P and C spaces are safer for him I will use them and will carry on doing so. Getting a baby out the car may be hard, getting a disabled child out is much much harder!

Those things aren’t mutually exclusive. Supermarkets may have introduced them because it was good for business, but that doesn’t mean they don’t exist for safety and practicality. The whole reason they’re attractive to families is that they make it easier and safer to get babies and young children in and out of cars. If there was no genuine need for them, there’d be nothing to market.

Yep fine, I agree, but that’s a completely different argument as I was responding to someone who had said that blue badge holders are legally entitled to using parent and child bays, which isn’t the case. Saying a reasonable adjustment might be appropriate in a particular case isn’t the same as saying Blue Badge holders are legally entitled to use parent and child bays. The original claim was a blanket statement, not a case by case Equality Act argument.

I wish they'd put them further from the door. Most car parks near me, the spaces are so narrow that I couldn't get the door open enough to get out when heavily pregnant without the extra room - and same when I had to get alongside to get a baby out/open up a pram safely. I really needed the extra room, but don't mind walking a bit further.

Most people who shouldn't be in them are only using them because they are close to the door so if you move them a bit further away it removes that incentive.

It's really frustrating though, people just don't consider the impact.

its still not illegal to park in them. It might be against the rules of the car park, but it’s still not illegal.

Yes you’re right it’s not illegal for anybody to park in them but that’s not the claim I challenged. The claim was that a Blue Badge gives a legal entitlement to use a parent and child bay, and I’ve yet to see any source for that. Happy for you to provide one.

Not illegal and legally entitled are different things FYI

I don’t have children and no I don’t use parent and child spaces.

Having a BB means you have a disability.

having a disability gives you a right to a reasonable adjustment.

that using a P&C space is a reasonable adjustment is highly likely - so likely that no supermarket would ever take it to court.

Again, the government guidance says that Blue Badges are intended for on-street parking and that supermarket and other off-street car parks are covered by separate rules. Whether a disabled person might be entitled to a reasonable adjustment in a particular situation is a different discussion. My original post that you are responding to was discussing whether or not blue badge holders are legally entitled to park in parent and child bays, which they aren’t. Doesn’t mean it’s illegal if they do park there, just that they have no legal right to.

The vast majority of supermarkets (if not all) have a minimum spend for home delivery.

All of the ones that deliver here have a minimum spend of at least £40. That’s beyond some people’s budgets for a weekly shop, and you can’t get enough fresh bits to last a month.

They don’t qualify. Bore off.

My mum doesnt either even though I have to drag her along practically, absolute joke. She looks forward to getting out though, despite needing to rest for a full day afterwards! Dont know how we'd manage without those spaces.

They said that until he’s end of life he won’t qualify. The nurses and his consultant are baffled. He’s rarely going out except hospital appointments and I just don’t think they have the fight in them.

I don't wish to waste my time doing so. It is not illegal to park in a P&C, provided a valid BB is displayed. I have done so many times, no children in sight, and have never been fined, as it is not illegal!! Nothing else is of any concern to me.

yeah, my weekly shop at tesco yesterday was £25, I do get some more bits on Sunday but it won't add up to £40

I don’t park in any other space than a ‘normal’ space since my children were about 7/8 and could control themselves, as expected.
An acquaintance once quipped that there’s nothing to say you have to have your kids with you!

Not being illegal and a legal right to do so are two very different things.

It’s not illegal for anyone to park in a P&C space.

The fact a shop may be less likely to fine someone displaying a BB (although most places don’t fine anyone) doesn’t change the legal status.

Only when using the supermarket out of hours - ours is open super late so if i go at midnight (which i often do for various reasons) then yes i do - they are closer to the entrance and as a solo female i feel safer there BUT there are always loads then, the carpark is empty and people are not taking their babies at that time.

Never ever at any other time though, I have a big car and it would definitely be easier with the extra space but I dont because I can just park further away and walk. Shopping with young kids is hard enough, I am not down for making it harder because I cba to walk a bit further, its a baffling mindset that some people have.