To think people on benefits can’t win

[Flamingosareflummoxed]

I’ve heard so many people this week, in real life, moaning about people on benefits. I get it that we are all struggling. The cost of living is crippling.
But every week there are posts on here from women who were in 70K per year HR positions who are finding it difficult to get interviews for MW jobs.
There are no jobs.
The few jobs that there are will be flooded with applications, why would recruiters chose someone who has been unemployed for years?
Plus all those with long term disabilities who need reasonable adjustments.
Its like people want to bash people knowing there is no real alternative.

Are you really so naive to think that the millions on benefits are on benefits because they can’t get jobs. While we are bringing in immigrants to do those jobs?

Workshy culture is deeply embedded within this country’s fabric. Why work when you can live for free paid for by other. And majority of claimants are giving bad name to the minority who genuinely cannot work.

Why don’t you have that luxury?

If you’re a single parent too then you have the same ‘luxuries’ as she does.

Flower stick, factory work ? I don't think there are any here anymore?

We advertised a position recently. Charity sector. 24k a year. Nothing fancy. 212 applications. 10 years ago we used to get 20, maybe 25. Something has definitely changed.

Presumably she has kids tho and when they reach 18 most of the benefits will stop?

Honestly, I need someone to tell me where all these hidden sectors are , I have many varied skills but never heard how someone just suddenly crosses fields claiming they have transferable skills. I am foreign and in my country most people stick to what they studied...any help and info I can read getting to know the English work market a bit better?

...She’s recently changed to disability benefits because of obesity-related health concerns and was proudly saying to DH that she’s going to sell her car because her PIP entitles her to a “free luxury car”… not sure it does, but it’s this sort of dialogue that pisses people off. Again, doesn’t represent everyone on benefits but doesn’t exactly help the image of those on benefits either.

It was going well until you over-egged the pudding. And of course the benefits are for obesity.

@MeetMeOnTheCornerLucky I’m not one of them, then. I learned German, was fluent and have lived and worked in Germany. However, I’m getting on a bit now and language teaching in schools is nowhere near as good as it was in my day. I watched my own children flounder and give up, as do most others. There are fewer opportunities to take MFL at A level and many universities are reducing or scrapping their MFL degrees. None of that is the responsibility of the ‘poor little uk doc’ as you so disparagingly refer to them.

What could change things for the better ?
Employers could be helped to take on apprenticeships.
The NMW and credits should slowly tail off.

Social housing should not be allowed to be rented out to someone else.
Employers should scrap nonsensical recruitment processes. Application form/cv then interview. Just some judgement.
Specialist support for disabled people to help find work.
Change the NI that was imposed on employers
Ensure people that are defaulters of tax do pay it. No let offs. No get out clauses.
Invite billionaires to pay tax more voluntarily.

There will be many more.

I am applying for all kinds of factory work, the places are snapped. The majority require heavy lifting and not everyone is physically capable of doing it, so the majority of these jobs go to men

Universal basic income is what it says it is. Basic. Payable in all circumstances so nothing more than a safety net, the way benefits are now. If you want a better life then you work.

And for those that can't? What happens to them?

How are you suggesting we deal with the knock on impacts of increased crime? Increased demand on healthcare (though reform are totally keen for that to be privatised anyway) ? the impact of more children going into care as they're living in poverty? The knock on impact on education? The rise in homelessness?

Our core services are on their knees. The idea that reform are going to cut benefits and that will fix it is incredibly short sighted as its going to generate more complex issues that will be more expensive to fix as the services affected are already at breaking point. Farage was a key supporter for brexit and brexit is one of the main reasons why we have such a back log for asylum claims (this is why asylum rates have risen so much in recent years because people are no longer moving through the system) and why there has been a rise in small boats (being in the eu meant we could see if someone had applied and been denied elsewhere and return them). He promised more money for the NHS and the next day was on the telly saying "I never said that". He has cost us so much to date from the public purse so the idea that anyone thinks this is the man to fix it is utterly beyond me. He'd sell his own granny to get himself ahead and that's what he's doing, he's very cleverly playing us all against each other to position himself as a 'leader' rather than recognising that he's been very instrumental in getting us into the shit we're currently in. I don't understand why other people cannot seem to see this?!

It’s not a case of hidden sectors, it’s about making yourself as relevant as possible for the position you’re applying for.

When I worked in recruitment I’d see a constant stream of generic CVs sent out for varied roles, with zero tailoring or tweaking to make their skills fit the role.

I once read a great guide from an ex police sergeant who was offering advice to people leaving the force who had been finding they weren’t having much luck securing interviews. He details how to position yourself in a competitive market, and highlight previous non-connected experience in a relevant way. I’ll try to find it and see if I can link it here.

We know people who worked in the city, lost jobs at 50, and now do Tesco deliveries, they always seem to have jobs available, get something coming in.

DD is on a zero hours contract, the most hours she's had in a week is 17, the least....is zero....mostly its 4 or 8.
A lot of the staff are students, they all want to do more shifts, the managers say they havent got any extra hours for them....but are still recruiting!

So lots of these people have got a job....but they dont even guarantee 1 shift a week!

You already cannot sub let a social housing property. Only take on a lodger which some people need to do in order to cover themselves as benefits don't fully cover all social housing rent depending on circumstances.

Changes to recruitment could inadvertently remove protection against discrimination.

Most of reforms approaches (such as this) are inherently anti women and are dangerous to us.

There are already specialist services to help vulnerable people into employment that's not new.

The idea that the UK benefits system is generous and that it provides a survival-level standard of living is pie in the sky .( Other countries look after vulnerable and workless people far, far better ) Our system is oppressive , cruel and dehumanising .. Designed to scapegoat and enslave the poor ,extract their meagre wealth and funnel it upwards to the elite ............ (The Tories wet dream ) ..........

Used to work in insurance. High earning. Had a baby with husband. Don't have a village so when our ds started school I got a minimum wage cleaning job. I now have another job in the evenings when dh is home with ds and I earn about 1k a month. My dh is the high earner. Yes its cleaning and dealing with messy toilets but its 2 or 3 hours a day and Im done. People will do these jobs if they're desperate for some money.

And reform want to remove any protections for employees against things like 0 hours contracts or unfair recruitment to prioritise the company. Because you know, its always good to look after the rich. Even when you're pretending to be for the working man.

Disability benefits aren’t paid for obesity as such, but the underlying conditions which cause them, or are caused by them. Obesity in itself is not a disability under the Equality Act 2010 unless it leads to severe long-term physical or mental impairments that hinder day-to-day activities or participation in the workplace. Obesity caused by underlying conditions such as impaired mobility etc, would qualify by the underlying condition, not the obesity itself.

There was talk at one time that disability/sickness benefits paid in respect of obesity would be time limited and require the claimant to engage in appropriate weight loss/fitness programmes to continue to be eligible. These programmes are offered but benefits don’t seem to be conditional on participation.

Motability is always brought up on these threads, and referred to as ‘free cars’ because people generally don’t understand how the scheme works, who benefits or that the car is not ‘free’. As far as the poster you quoted is concerned their MiL is unlikely to qualify for the higher rate mobility component necessary to access the scheme unless her obesity linked medical conditions are severe.

I worked in disability benefits and as an outreach worker for disabled people for over twenty years, and I find the attitude of posters towards disability benefits really odd. Everyone knows someone who is apparently cheating and quite prepared to admit it to anyone who asks. Posters seem to consider themselves qualified to decide whether someone is worthy of claiming, despite no medical experience or qualifications and not a shred of understanding of how these benefits work, and seem to consider the DWP assessors who actually are qualified, incapable of the decision making with which they are charged. You just don’t come across this in real life.

@Bamboozle30001

You realise you can do this BECAUSE your dh is a high earner right?

Because if you lived in say Central London and were a single person you aren't paying your whole rent in that line of work.

Of course people will do these jobs if they need to, but we also need to be realistic that mw does not equate to living costs now.

Absolutely this. Divide and rule is alive and well regardless of the colour of government.

Logic of the situation is - AI takes jobs but doesn't pay taxes as not a 'worker' - so no money paid in tax for benefits to unemployed caused by AI.

Take any job. If I’m hiring and I two CVs both have been made redundant. If I see you’ve been out of work for a long period of time, versus the person who has taken a retail, hospitality job then I know which one I’m inviting to the interview. Sadly, the welfare system creates many people who work but don’t want to work longer hours or earn more as they’ll lose their benefits! Insane, that people would rather expect the state to prop them up than want to earn their own money! Obviously people in caring roles or with disabilities are a different kettle of fish. I’m talking about those who can work but don’t want to progress.

Exactly this. And also you're taking people at their word.

My mum was a sahp. She will tell you it's because she wanted to focus on her family and she felt pushed out of her previous workplace by the manager.

What she won't say is that she struggles a lot with her mental health and has zero personal resilience and refuses to talk about it or deal with it in any way.

What she also won't say is that's really the outworking of inter generational trauma and as someone who's worked in mh I can see that she probably actually has ptsd. There are a whole lot of reasons why people make flippant remarks and sometimes they're just very disconnected from their own reality. Or they feel embarrassed or judged. Or they're more vulnerable than they even realise themselves. There are so many people I've worked with where I've been pushing them to claim pip or esa but they insist on uc (or what would have been jsa) because they can't see their own vulnerabilities. So for all the people we hear about who are claiming where they shouldn't be, I'd argue that there's probably just as many or possibly more who aren't claiming their full entitlements.