Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

New renter rights act is a bloody good thing!

444 replies

Pineapplewhip · Yesterday 06:24

Naturally landlords have some justifiable concerns/questions but those that are up in arms about the whole thing are completely bloody immoral. The slum landlords have spoilt it for the good ones and the decent landlords should blame them and not the government for protecting people.

If you arent aware of the actual points of the bill - I've listed them below. I cant see how any reasonable person can disagree that it's just enforcing the most basic human decency and regulation.

  • End to no fault evictions: landlords can only evict renters if they want to sell, move in themselves, move their family into the property or there are serious rent arrears. They have to prove they are selling too - they cant just say they are!
  • Rent can only rise once a year, any rise above market rate can be disputed fairly and 2 months notice is given.
  • Landlords can't refuse you for having children or being on benefits (if you prove that benefits/finances make the property affordable). This isnt about being on full benefits either. Many single parents need benefits to top up income.
  • Landlord ombudsman - tennants can raise fair disputes and repair issues for free online and landlords cannot just ignore it/grey rock. Repeat offenders will be visable in the database. Landlords legally must act on the complaints.
  • Faster action must be taken on damp and mould. Basic human rights! No more shitty emails from a middle man letting agent just blaming the tennant for not opening a window - when actually (for example) a house needs its brickwork repointing.

The only legitimate thing I have empathy for is the concern that it will be more of a process to evict non paying tennants as it will need to go through a court. However - this is why landlord insurance exists!!

Please ask yourself - if your child was renting - wouldn't you want them protected like this?

OP posts:
Shineonyoucrazydiamond1 · Yesterday 10:04

Pineapplewhip · Yesterday 06:45

Did you not have landlord insurance to protect you? This is what i am assuming would protect a landlord - but not being a landlord myself I dont know about the cost/limits etc... so wanted to ask.

I agree I think people will sell up and the market will miss these rentals - but maybe after a time the next wave of "landlords to be" will just accept this is the norm and actually be responsible. I don't see the buy to let method of investment disappearing.

A couple of thoughts- If landlords are forced to have insurance against tenants that don't pay/damage the property, and if the risk increases due to the change in regulations making it harder and slower to evict bad tenants, therefor increasing the cost of the insurance, who do you think will pay for this? It will be added to rent, because so many small private landlords are already running close to the wire/ at a loss. This increases rent for everyone- the tenants that cause the issue won't carry the cost, because they will continue to not pay their rent/damage property, so it will be the 'good tenants' who pay their rent on time and look after their property who really take the hit. As a good tenant will you be happy to effectively subsidising the bad ones? There's no doubt that the changes to regulation have caused a huge exodus of good small private landlords, which has led to a reduction in rental accomodation available- you only have to look on rightmove to see that where there might have been 10-20 nice properties available there are now 1 or 2 pretty shite looking ones, the result is that it's going to be alomost impossible for people starting their career or moving from 1 area to another to rent. This is going to impact social mobility, career progression and those in jobs who move around. Is that net progress? Could improvements have been made in other ways? Could an annual inspection to check the condition of the property that protects landlords and tennants been more beneficial? There's no doubt it's decimated the private rental sector and I'm not sure who that benefits....

Upstartled · Yesterday 10:05

fundamentallyauthentic · Yesterday 10:01

Amassing a deposit for a rental isn’t exactly hard for most people. I think you’re being hysterical.

🤣, well casual misogyny aside, I think people who are starting out in life are the least likely to have a deposit, the most likely to need to rent and the least likely for a landlord to now take a risk on.

Unexpectedlysinglemum · Yesterday 10:06

Itchthescratch · Yesterday 09:54

Many areas are seeing falling house prices and interest rates at record highs. Many landlords could take out the money they have invested in a BTL and put the money in a bank account with zero hassle and risk and earn more.

I think that’s exactly what they’re all doing, especially with flats that are crashing in value

ThePeppyOpalScroller · Yesterday 10:07

Pineapplewhip · Yesterday 06:24

Naturally landlords have some justifiable concerns/questions but those that are up in arms about the whole thing are completely bloody immoral. The slum landlords have spoilt it for the good ones and the decent landlords should blame them and not the government for protecting people.

If you arent aware of the actual points of the bill - I've listed them below. I cant see how any reasonable person can disagree that it's just enforcing the most basic human decency and regulation.

  • End to no fault evictions: landlords can only evict renters if they want to sell, move in themselves, move their family into the property or there are serious rent arrears. They have to prove they are selling too - they cant just say they are!
  • Rent can only rise once a year, any rise above market rate can be disputed fairly and 2 months notice is given.
  • Landlords can't refuse you for having children or being on benefits (if you prove that benefits/finances make the property affordable). This isnt about being on full benefits either. Many single parents need benefits to top up income.
  • Landlord ombudsman - tennants can raise fair disputes and repair issues for free online and landlords cannot just ignore it/grey rock. Repeat offenders will be visable in the database. Landlords legally must act on the complaints.
  • Faster action must be taken on damp and mould. Basic human rights! No more shitty emails from a middle man letting agent just blaming the tennant for not opening a window - when actually (for example) a house needs its brickwork repointing.

The only legitimate thing I have empathy for is the concern that it will be more of a process to evict non paying tennants as it will need to go through a court. However - this is why landlord insurance exists!!

Please ask yourself - if your child was renting - wouldn't you want them protected like this?

No point having renters rights if there isn't anywhere to rent.

Twenty years ago you could have rented a garden shed if you wanted to. Now you can't get anywhere, it's a joke. All this law does is get landlords to leave the market. I'd rather have a damp bathroom and dodgy plumbing over being homeless.

Landlions · Yesterday 10:08

Being a landlord is fine. Keep the place well and in-line with safety and health laws. If you're the tenant keep the place well, remember it's someone else's properly. Don't trash it.

Overitallandout · Yesterday 10:08

When I rent my studio flat the agents fees, right to rent fees, inventory fees (rent guarantee) the first two months rent is lost to fees. fees are not on a sliding scale so my friends house covers her fees in month one.

Now the tenant can chose to give notice in month three on the periodic basis of the new act and move out two months later, then I’ll have to start all over again. (Hopefully with not too many maintenance costs). There’s potentially not much money to be made in private rentals if you lose your tenants every five months.

lots of LL’s selling up near me, five houses on my estate that were family rentals with tenants some over ten years all losing their homes due to LL’s selling because of the new act.

i worked hard in my life to get where I am today, the rental and my own home with DH, the rental income allows me to work part time due to life limiting illnesses which otherwise I’d probably claim benefits for (just so ya all know before I get flamed for being a LL).

IMO the government should have set up a better process for evictions to protect both the tenant and the LL.

tenants that are asked to end the tenancy are told to stay put by the council and drag it out through the courts, why, because the council have no home for them. So LL potentially gets no money unless has a rent guarantee is in place (another expensive that’s put on the tenants rent). And on and on it goes.

Littlebitpsycho · Yesterday 10:11

glitterpaperchain · Yesterday 09:39

In your hypothetical situation, who have they sold their houses to?

@glitterpaperchain well presumably people who can afford to buy them. I literally said in my post I am talking about renters who are NOT in a position to buy

Peoplearebloodyidiots · Yesterday 10:14

Agix · Yesterday 06:55

Landlords SHOULDN'T be able to "easily get their property back". That's someone's home. They have jobs likely in the area, kids going to school, all their mail going there, that address registered with their banks and energy providers. Landlords shouldn't be able to turf them out on a whim, that's the whole point.

The fact that you think they should be able to is part of the problem.

That is someone's home. The centrepoint of how they are building their lives.

Landlords not being able to easily chuck someone out SHOULD be the sacrifice landlords have to make for the privilege of keeping multiple properties and profiting off of it.

And if with thet comes not being able to chuck out disrepesectful tenants easily either, that's just another risk. Because you are dealing in homes, not mere bricks and mortar.

So if a home is so key then just buy one or get one provided for by the state fgs.

Buying a home to rent out to others is a commercial enterprise, not a charity.

5128gap · Yesterday 10:15

The tenant wants a secure affordable and well maintained home. The landlord wants to make a profit from the property with as little inconvenience/work as possible. The potential for conflict between these two positions is huge. When the state steps in to lend its weight to either side there will be much ruffling of feathers amongst the side that feels the other has an advantage.
Unfortunately when the side believing itself disadvantaged is also the side with the greater overall power (the landlord, the employer) they typically find work arounds to push back and regain their advantage.
They avoid contracting with those they percieve as high risk and well protected in the first place. They don't employ the disabled person. They find a way to offer the property only to working people. So in reality a different set of problems can occur for those the state seeks to protect.
I'm not sure anything short of the provision of ample social housing is going to ever put paid to the exploitation of tenants by private landlords. But, we will see.

Littlebitpsycho · Yesterday 10:16

coulditbeme2323 · Yesterday 09:56

There is so much naivety here.

"Landlords can't turn down benefit claimants."

We marketed one of our 1 beds last month and had 17 viewings, 4 of which were on benefits.

Who do you think won the property?

@coulditbeme2323 exactly. I have answered many questions about this through work this week.

No you cannot 'turn down' benefit claimants. Can you choose somebody else who isn't on benefits? Of course you can. It's becoming clear that some benefit claimants think these new laws mean they HAVE to be allowed the property if they want it, it simply doesn't work that way

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · Yesterday 10:16

SuperSharpShooter · Yesterday 06:46

As a long term renters OP I agree.
All those accidental/BTL LL's will actually have to do some work for a return on their investment 🤷

There is IMO no such thing as an ‘accidental’ landlord. Surely the decision to rent a property is invariably made because it makes financial sense, or did so at the time.

Nobody wakes up one morning to find tenants in their property and thinks, ‘How the hell did that happen?’

One thing I do think necessary, is much stronger action against the sort of slumlords who cram tenants in, leave mould, damp and dodgy electrics not fixed, and I dare say, often demanding rent in cash and not declaring it. In fact I suspect that failure to declare rental income is rife, and not just among slumlords. If you have no mortgage, don’t use a letting agent, and don’t live in an area where you have to register as a LL, there is literally nobody you need to inform about a rental.
The self assessment tax form asks only how many properties, it doesn’t even ask for addresses. The system is IMO incredibly lax.

I say all this s a LL myself.

glitterpaperchain · Yesterday 10:16

Littlebitpsycho · Yesterday 10:11

@glitterpaperchain well presumably people who can afford to buy them. I literally said in my post I am talking about renters who are NOT in a position to buy

But who can afford to buy them? Currently we have so many renters because people are unable to buy.

So if the market is flooded by landlords selling up, prices go down, more renters can afford to become homeowners. Win win

coulditbeme2323 · Yesterday 10:17

Littlebitpsycho · Yesterday 10:16

@coulditbeme2323 exactly. I have answered many questions about this through work this week.

No you cannot 'turn down' benefit claimants. Can you choose somebody else who isn't on benefits? Of course you can. It's becoming clear that some benefit claimants think these new laws mean they HAVE to be allowed the property if they want it, it simply doesn't work that way

Thankfully

Mumof2wifeof1crazytimes · Yesterday 10:17

I am a LL and I fully support the majority of the changes, especially the removal of section 21 and allowing pets. I don’t like the removal of AST as my tenants would prefer a 24 month tenancy to give them security. My tenants are lovely, if I won the lottery I would give them the house.

Littlebitpsycho · Yesterday 10:18

fundamentallyauthentic · Yesterday 10:01

Amassing a deposit for a rental isn’t exactly hard for most people. I think you’re being hysterical.

@fundamentallyauthentic read it properly. The poster is responding to a previous post about a deposit for BUYING, not renting. If you think amassing a deposit to buy is easy, you're deluded

Upstartled · Yesterday 10:22

Littlebitpsycho · Yesterday 10:18

@fundamentallyauthentic read it properly. The poster is responding to a previous post about a deposit for BUYING, not renting. If you think amassing a deposit to buy is easy, you're deluded

I hadn't even realised that that poster had misunderstood my point! I was scratching my head about how anyone might think getting a house deposit together was so easy.

ProudAmberTurtle · Yesterday 10:23

HobGobblynne · Yesterday 10:04

So you knew your first line "another simplistic law by labour" was wrong then?

It's Labour's law. It's simplistic. And it's terrible.

They're not implementing it because they had to - they chose to take it on (and make it slightly worse) and have championed themselves for implementing it.

Timetakesacigarette · Yesterday 10:23

I agree with the OP but, unfortunately, the upshot will be that landlords sell their properties making the rental market even harder particularly for those on benefits, with kids or pets as there’ll be more competition for properties. Will weed out some of the more unscrupulous landlords hopefully.

fundamentallyauthentic · Yesterday 10:25

Yes, sorry for not reading properly. But in some cases (i.e flats in certain parts of the country), it is damn easy to save a deposit).

On second thoughts…nobody wants to buy flats.

Upstartled · Yesterday 10:28

fundamentallyauthentic · Yesterday 10:25

Yes, sorry for not reading properly. But in some cases (i.e flats in certain parts of the country), it is damn easy to save a deposit).

On second thoughts…nobody wants to buy flats.

Flats have always been risky. For homebuyers and any landlord who doesn't own the building.

jountyey · Yesterday 10:30

OP, 2 comments: to evict non-paying tenants you have always had to go through Courts, it’s not something new. And a landlord insurance only covers first 3 months of rent not being paid. To go through court and bailiffs takes much longer than 3 months.

Nanny0gg · Yesterday 10:32

greenappletasty · Yesterday 07:01

Short sighted OP and naive. Unless you’re been a landlord you have no idea what reality is like. I’ve rented privately for 15 years before I bought and I’ve been a landlord too.

I was a landlord. I bought a house and the market crashed. If I had sold I would have lost money so I rented it out. I had over a decade of the most horrendous tenants and it showed me the very worst in people. Every single tenant trashed the house. Every single tenant disputed the deposit after trashing the house. Here’s just a small sample: left dog regularly overnight alone so it pissed, howled and barked. It took 6 months to get rid of the smell of piss and I had to take up an entire hard floor costing me over £5k in damages. Used a saw to cut off half a kitchen cupboard. Left so much shit in that house at end of tenancy that I had to order a skip. Ignored my repeat warnings not to remove the hair blocker from the shower, then flooded the entire lounge ceiling bringing it down and lied trying to pin it on the neighbouring house. The drain man I was made to pay for confirmed the pipes were blocked with copious amounts of hair yet tenant still demanded I pay it. Set fire to lounge carpet but refused to replace. Drilled 40 plus bolts into brand new painted bedroom walls and attached fitted cupboards. Cost me £1000s to repair. One tenancy change over I opened the oven door to find I was looking at the foundations of my house. They’d refused to clean the oven once and it was that bad the bottom of it had fallen out - when I said I needed to keep some of the deposit they screamed and shouted claiming it was fair wear and tear. Ripped out bathroom ceiling lights, smashed toilet pan, never ever weeded gardens, never ever handed back the house in the same pristine and clean state they got it, refused to pay for professional cleans at changeover despite it being in the contract, smashed ceiling light shades, defaulted on rent many times.

I had 5 tenants over a decade and they were all horrendous and entitled.

And as for mould and damp. I spent thousands because of their refusal and thick as mince attitude to old Victorian houses. I told each and every one repeatedly, “This is a Victorian house. It is designed to BREATHE. That means you must open windows every single day, no matter the season. You must not dry clothes on radiators. You must open the window every single time you shower.”

But no. Every single tenant refused to do this then complained repeatedly about the damp and mould spores forming on the walls everywhere. I even paid £900 for a specialist damp surveyor who presented them with a report saying this is not rising damp, or atmy other kind of damp. It is condensation caused by the inhabitants who are not treating the house as it needs to be treated. But they never listened. I’d lived in the house for nine years before I rented it out and never had any damp at all because I opened windows every day. It’s not rocket science. The damp inspector said most of his work was due to stupid tenants.

I could go on. I never made any profit and made a loss every year for a decade. Tenants have NO IDEA the costs of being responsible for the upkeep of a house. They have no idea that stress and time lost putting right their abuse of the property.

I did not increase rent once in ten years.

selling that house was the best thing I ever did. And it was in an area crying out for rental properties. Of which now there are hardly any and the demand is greater than ever.

The new bill has driven thousands of great landlords out and you will all be even more stuffed than you already are.

Did you do regular inspections?
Every three months would have stopped them getting so bad surely?

Ithinkofawittyusernamethenforgetit · Yesterday 10:34

I agree as all my children rent, I do too. Damp is a tricky one however. I used to let a lovely airy flat which for at least 8 years hadn’t had a whiff of damp. Suddenly had a message from letting agent with terrible photos - the new-ish tenants had pulled their furniture out to reveal damp on the walls and sides of furniture that faced the walls. They had a new baby but they admitted they hadn’t had the heating on much. Letting agent was sure it was their fault but advised us to get an independent survey. We got the tenants to choose who to go with, we had to pay. The company also did remedial work, I was slightly sceptical but went with it. The report was very detailed and completely exonerated the property itself. In fact it said it had the right balance of air-flow and heating. The tenants then handed in their notice, then asked to buy it! We had all the remedial work done and redecorated, fine ever since.

Ithinkofawittyusernamethenforgetit · Yesterday 10:39

glitterpaperchain · Yesterday 10:16

But who can afford to buy them? Currently we have so many renters because people are unable to buy.

So if the market is flooded by landlords selling up, prices go down, more renters can afford to become homeowners. Win win

Not everyone wants to buy or is ready to settle on an area. Of my three children renting, none would want to buy yet even if they could. I rent and I couldn’t afford to buy in the area I’ve chosen.

HobGobblynne · Yesterday 10:39

Shineonyoucrazydiamond1 · Yesterday 10:04

A couple of thoughts- If landlords are forced to have insurance against tenants that don't pay/damage the property, and if the risk increases due to the change in regulations making it harder and slower to evict bad tenants, therefor increasing the cost of the insurance, who do you think will pay for this? It will be added to rent, because so many small private landlords are already running close to the wire/ at a loss. This increases rent for everyone- the tenants that cause the issue won't carry the cost, because they will continue to not pay their rent/damage property, so it will be the 'good tenants' who pay their rent on time and look after their property who really take the hit. As a good tenant will you be happy to effectively subsidising the bad ones? There's no doubt that the changes to regulation have caused a huge exodus of good small private landlords, which has led to a reduction in rental accomodation available- you only have to look on rightmove to see that where there might have been 10-20 nice properties available there are now 1 or 2 pretty shite looking ones, the result is that it's going to be alomost impossible for people starting their career or moving from 1 area to another to rent. This is going to impact social mobility, career progression and those in jobs who move around. Is that net progress? Could improvements have been made in other ways? Could an annual inspection to check the condition of the property that protects landlords and tennants been more beneficial? There's no doubt it's decimated the private rental sector and I'm not sure who that benefits....

Landlords should absolutely have insurance - this isn't a new thing from the RRA, it's always been good practice. Insurance is a business expense that needs to be factored in.