To not understand what this parent was thinking?

[Frequency]

While out with my rottweiler x this afternoon, I noticed he was panting more than I was comfortable with, so I abandoned our walk and took a detour to the nearest shop to buy him a bottle of water.

I crouched down at the edge of a very wide path to give him a drink. I wasn't paying attention to what was around me because I was watching the dog, and no one had any reason to be near us anyway. The pavement is about 8 feet wide on that street, if not wider. We were right at the edge, by the shop window.

The second I stood up, there was a toddler, eye-to-eye with my dog. He must have run up behind me while I was kneeling. He was literally nose to nose with the dog, reaching his hands out to grab/stroke the dog's face.

My dog is friendly but a little wary of small children, so I tend to keep him away from them.

Luckily, DD was with me and had spotted the kid and managed to hold his hands before he grabbed the dog's face and loudly told him, "Sorry, he's scared of kids, and he's just trying to have a drink, can you leave him alone, please?" She had to say it loudly because his mum and her friend had continued walking and were now a good 10 feet away from us. At this point, the mother then shouted at her other small child (around 7 or 8) to "get the baby," so the dog now had 2 kids to contend with while the mother kept walking away, ranting about how the young girl was supposed to be "watching the baby."

DD has anxiety and was really shaken by it, and can't stop thinking about how much worse it could have been if our dog were not friendly, or if the kid had managed to grab the dog's face and spooked/hurt him.

I still just cannot fathom what the mother was thinking, allowing her toddler to run up to a strange dog who was obviously eating/drinking, get nose to nose with him to try to grab him, and then send a second child over after she's made aware he is not a friendly dog?

Surely it is common sense to know that nose-to-nose with a strange, large breed dog, who is eating/drinking, is not a safe place to be, no matter how friendly the dog is?

He looks lovely (and charmingly dopey)!

Absolutely this!
Yes, the parent behaved poorly here, but her dog’s behaviour is ultimately the OP’s responsibility. If her dog bit the child she would be the one in trouble with the law, probably sued, dog pts etc.

I am not known for aggression however a child jumped off a wall onto my head once and before I knew it i had elbowed them in the face. The brain doesn't catch up when you're startled.

If a dog looks up to someone in their face that's a dangerous situation regardless of the breed.

So only walk them in places with no other people? The OP was giving them a drink. Should she have eyes in the back of her head?

As much as walking along the street and not seeing children would be lovely, unfortunately they're about and should stay away from dogs or ask permission to come close

Our old family dog, brought up with my five kids and a veritable saint of a dog, didn't much like very small children. He'd take himself off to hide somewhere if a toddler-sized child started trying to hug him (he was very fluffy and huggable). I often had to intervene when he was outside in our front driveway as passing small children would come running up to try to pat him.

I don't think he would have dreamed of biting (he never raised a tooth in anger in his entire fourteen years on this planet, but he would growl to himself), but this was a dog raised and mauled by children all his life. He just didn't like the small ones as they were too unpredictable for him. NOT a dangerous dog, and a complete mongrel, but even the most saintly dog can not want a strange child peering in his face.

A muzzle is what’s needed in public places if a dog might react poorly.

You want every dog muzzled? Ok, if that's for safety, I want every toddler on a leash!

I get that you're outraged about it but yes. She needs to be vigilant all the time, and she wasn't in this instance. She knows her dog is nervous around others so she should take appropriate steps - either keep clear or muzzle. She didn't.

You can feel morally wronged that the mother isn't being held to account but unfortunately that's the reality - it will be OP's dog will be PTS and it'll be OP that is prosecuted. if she is really a responsible dog owner then she should take the above precautions, to protect her dog, if not the child.

If only the mother of the two improperly supervised kids thought the same huh?

From the sounds of it the dog was not out of control, was on a lead and a head harness, doesn’t have a history of aggression or biting and is not on a banned list. Likely that a serious injury to the child would result in the dog being PTS, but not immediately clear that OP would be prosecuted.

Cool, maybe she wouldn't - that could be what happens. You hang your hat on that.

Or she could just muzzle her nervy dog, stop it from being in harm's way. Or pay attention, like you want the mother to have. Either way, it'll be the dog that suffers if there's an incident so I guess you have to make your choices based on how much you don't want that to happen.

The dog is in a head harness, from what I understand, so she is in control. I agree that muzzles can be helpful, and no dog is safe unsupervised around children imo. But your continued insistence that she ‘should’ muzzle him smacks more of wanting to be right than of anything actually useful. The dog doesn’t have a history of aggression, any dog would be startled by a person bounding up to them, and nothing actually happened.

I don’t ’want’ the mother to pay attention by the way - my life will be unaffected if her child is run over or bitten or drowns or any of the other terrible things that happen in school holidays when fuckwits take their eyes off their kids. But I can see the balance here. OP had control of her dog, the mother didn’t have control of either of her children. A muzzle might help OP, but it doesn’t negate the need for people to behave appropriately in public.

He wears two harnesses. He has his head collar because the beagle in him forgets he has ears and knows commands when he picks up a scent, so that stops him pulling and allows me to regain his attention. He also has a utility harness with a handle on the chest panel and two on his back.

He wears that because he would try to jump at passersby when he was a puppy, and I can use the handles to keep his feet on the floor. He doesn't really need that one now, but I keep it through habit, and it does come in handy when he's being attacked by smaller dogs, as it allows me to pick him up out of the way of danger.

My 'insistence' that she should muzzle him is taken directly from the evidence: a nervous, poorly-socialised dog with an unknown background. It's only 'continued' because posters like yourself are 'continually' trying to argue that because he looks so fluffy-wuffy how could anything bad ever happen and are erroneously asserting that OP is completely in control and innocent.

Unfortunately, it's totally reasonable for me to defend a point, even if it doesn't agree with yours. I get the impression you don't like to consider others, or facts, once you have decided how you'd like something to be. However, the reality is - not my opinion, not oh but look at his ears - the REALITY is that if the dog attacks a child, it will most likely be destroyed, provocation or not.

So if you are responsible dog owner who doesn't want that to happen then YOU take measures to stop your dog ever being in a situation like this - you and you alone. You can't control other's behaviour, only your own. Pay attention, take necessary steps, however aggrieved you feel that it's everyone else who is the problem. Protect your dog, that's really all there is to it.

@Rotundra I don’t actually know what he looks like so haven’t commented on his appearance at all.

If you’re not reading what I’m saying there’s no point replying. Have the day you deserve.

I said posters 'like yourself'. That doesn't mean you, and doesn't weaken the facts. If you've run out of defence for your argument then just say that - veiling it with 'you simply don't understaaaaaaaand' is juvenile.

I love dogs and have two myself, but I don't think you should have a dog that's aggressive/ wary towards children anywhere children are likely to be. You also weren't paying attention to your dog otherwise you would have seen a toddler approach it's face.

These foreign rescues are notorious for having skitty dogs who are often bred just for people in the UK to 'rescue'

My 'insistence' that she should muzzle him is taken directly from the evidence: a nervous, poorly-socialised dog with an unknown background

All of this is stuff you've made up. He is not nervous, he is not poorly socialised, I know his background.

He is wary of children because they're not something he spends a lot of time with. He can confidently walk past them when they ignore him and will sit and accept treats from them when they approach him properly. I mentioned he was wary only because it is something I am aware of when he interacts with children. I then went on to state that he is friendly, and the main concern was the child doing this again to a dog that is not friendly.

You filled in the blanks on your own and have made 2 + 2 = 5. If needed to wear his muzzle when on a normal walk, he would. He is muzzle-trained; he wears it when I think it might be appropriate, which is mostly near food or somewhere we are likely to encounter a dead animal.

Wow. What a stupid comment. Maybe because he was a rescue and needed a home, just like the smaller and less "intimidating looking" dogs.

My husband "looks intimidating" to people who don't know him. Ex-army, well built, covered in tattoos... He's the loveliest, kindest and most mild mannered person you could meet. Far more so than me 😂

There is a Border collie on our street who literally everyone with dogs avoids due to the fact he's massively aggressive. Appearances can be deciving.

And why do people keep asking why he isn't good with children?! Unless dogs are raised with or used to being around kids - and even then it's not a given - then you absolutely should be wary about them interacting!

We have two dogs who I absolutely wouldn't trust around children as they are rescues and can be very nervous / overwhelmed. All it would take is a child screaming or pulling their ear and they may well turn and snap. I don't know this for definite. But I certainly wouldn't risk it!

Obviously it’s common sense but common sense is not very common.

No, it's from what you've said. You said he was nervous, you said he was not socialised well with children, you said he was a rescue so you can't know his background. You said all of those things, many times!

If you don't think he'd attack a child, even one right in his face, then you carry on. But why would you take that risk? I've had dogs all my life, I have always taking the stance that I'd much rather have belt and braces to keep my dogs safe than think oh it'll be OK and blame other people. I love my dogs too much to threaten their well-being.

You weren't paying as much attention as you should have been. This is on you.

The dog in this situation is not aggressive, and it was because OP was paying attention to the dog that she didn’t see an unsupervised toddler approach. How is she responsible for minding her dog AND other people’s children?

Someone in our family has a small-breed which we occasionally dog-sit., Parents are forever encouraging their kids to come and say hello to it without bothering to acknowledge our presence, let alone ask if the dog is ok with screechy small humans grabbing it. It is very bad parenting.