To think psychiatry is misogynistic?

[tvde]

I have been reading works of feminist psychologists such as Jess Taylor and critical works of people such as Joanna moncrieff.

the argument is:

• Trauma responses to abuse are normal, rational, and proportionate to what someone has experienced.
• What is often labelled as “mental illness” can actually be understandable reactions to violence and oppression.
• The mental health system has a history of pathologising women’s responses, especially after abuse, instead of addressing the trauma itself.
• This can become a form of victim blaming, where women are judged for their reactions (e.g. being “too emotional,” “unstable,” or “making bad choices”).
• These patterns are shaped by broader systems like patriarchy and racism, which influence how people are diagnosed and treated.
• Common narratives shift responsibility away from perpetrators and subtly place it on victims (e.g. questioning behaviour, choices, or credibility).
• Widespread rape myths reinforce this—such as believing it’s not “real” rape without physical resistance or injuries, or that men “didn’t mean to.”
• theyre given drugs which don’t actually have good success rates (see moncrieff)

I see this countless times working with women and child victims.
Have you experienced this to?

Not misogynistic but totally flawed. There is a big distance between Jess Taylor and Joanna Moncrieff

Is there really? Moncrieff talks about the impact of antipsychotics and how they’re being abused for a lot of groups. Jess goes further and focuses on the impact on women.
i didn’t say moncrieff was feminist but she raises important questions about pharmacology

Well it always has been.

I can’t believe I had to have my womb and ovaries cut out because I had PMDD. I’m fucking sure if men’s mental health was compromised by hormonal fluctuations they’d have come up with a better solution.

Im so sorry that happened to you, and yes this is a really good example of misogyny in action.

i agree, this goes back to Freud and further.

Wasn't Freud a cokehead? It woukd explain a lot about his bizarre theories.

If you look back throughout time women have been punished for being women.

The word “Hysterectomy” literally means “to remove hysteria” because it was believed that women’s wombs somehow began to wander inside their bodies and cause mental impairment. I mean it was clearly hormonal issues causing the problems. There have been many battles to rename this procedure and remove the reference to hysteria. It’s just fucking insulting.

I don’t know too much about it. I heard initially he noticed how widespread sexual abuse of women was, and he initially tried to treat this but was silenced by the men paying and instead asked to pathologise the woman. I have no sources for this though, I just remember reading it somewhere.

i guess if that’s true, that in itself would be a bit of a trauma and the coke and bizarre views would be a rational response to knowing what women are going through, unable to help them and being forced to shut up?

Yes I agree. Mental health has always been treated in the most vile ways, from ‘demonic exorcism’, to insulin treatment, to ects.

It’s horrendous.

I don't think psychiatrists from decades/hundreds of years ago are relevant here. Looking at your specific points -

Someone who has experienced trauma will only be seeing a psychiatrist if they now have (in the UK) fairly severe and persistent mental health problems. That goes for men too - a ex-military man who's witnessed violent death would only see a psychiatrist if they now had severe mental health problems. A man who's withdrawn/mildly anxious/functioning alcoholic won't even get referred. One with severe panic disorder & alcoholism would. Claiming severe panic attacks/severe anxiety or depression/self-harm are a 'normal response' doesn't help anyone.

Drug efficacy - well loads of drugs for physical health problems have low efficacy. This is not unique to psychiatric drugs. Different people respond differently- you don't know till you try.

Attitudes towards sexual assault - I don't see modern psychiatrists trying to analyse what a patient says happened (in terms of was it assault). Unless they are doing a medicolegal report (and even then the psychiatrist is reporting on mental health not whether a crime happened) or suspect the patient is openly lying (unusual but people do lie to get benzos/opiates).

Do you honestly think men get better mental health care than women in the UK? Men are less likely to seek help, have much higher rates of death from alcohol & substance misuse & in almost every country worldwide men have higher rates of death by suicide.

If you're saying psychiatry systematically discriminates against women then logically men must be getting better treatment. I really don't agree with that. Alcohol & substance misuse are commoner in men - services there are underfunded and just as crap as the rest of the NHS.

But why don’t men seek help? I would argue toxic masculinity and patriarchal pressures.

i would argue that all the examples you’ve given me need intensive trauma focused treatment, not medicine that often doesn’t work and has terrible side effects.

It's the way real physical problems in women are fobbed off with 'anxiety' and antidepressants that gets me. As if we're dreaming up our own pain.

To expand further -
ptsd is a normal response to war, and I think it gets a lot much more sympathy than trauma to rape. We don’t say ok no have ptsd. But we can say this is normal, lots of people get it and you’re not broken, your brain is protecting you. It just doesn’t understand you’re safe now.

do you see how language can make a difference?

Yes this is endemic too. Why do you think this happens?

Well misogyny obviously. And yes, women doctors can be misogynistic.

If you are interested look into the origins of the DSM, how psychiatric disorders are diagnosed and characterized. There are some really good lectures available on the topic. Knowing more about the origins of psychiatry, and nowadays the links between the pharma industry and defining a mental illness, is very interesting.

Honestly sometimes I think we police each other better than the men police us! Don’t make too much of a fuss, be kind, it’s not always about you, isn’t that a bit attention seeking? You think that’s bad, I lived with this for years!

Ooooh this is also juicy. A group of rich men with funding interests arguing around a table.
homosexuality was in it once too.

Read "The Women's Room" by Marilyn French. So much in that novel that still resonates today.

Ah, but men DO have hormonal fluctuations, but there is also the fact that when women are seen as irrational is when their hormone levels are most similar to men's.

Think about football matches - it's totally ridiculous to get pumped up and angry because a bunch of men you don't know lose a game to a different bunch of men you don't know. But it isn't portrayed as irrational in the same way as PMT does.

Imagine if a woman behaved like some of our “world leaders”. They’d be branded as hysterical and dismissed straight away.

I can only talk from my own experience with postnatal anxiety. I initially saw a male psychiatrist who was extremely dismissive, told me to count myself lucky I had a healthy child and that I was unreasonable to put so much pressure on my husband having to look after a child and a 'sick wife' and kept talking to my husband rather than me. I saw a female psychiatrist a few weeks later after getting worse, who was extremely supportive, respectful and helpful.

Of course, the first one could have just been rubbish at his job and nothing to do with being a man! But it did feel like he was quite misogynistic and derogatory towards women.

I don’t know if misogynistic but definitely placing the issue at the victim’s door. I have severe birth trauma from the way doctors didn’t listen and midwives were not supportive. Ended up with emergency c section which I really really didn’t want. And then awful post natal care. Complaints to the hospital they accepted they shouldn’t have treated me as they did but no apology as the manager responsible for the response weren’t the ones on duty at the time. The therapy I was given just focused on how I could think about different things when I was upset about it. So not dealing with it, just avoiding it basically. Making it my fault if I was upset about it as I “should” have been avoiding thinking about it.

Not much good if you can’t access therapy treatment due to being traumatised . Sometimes medication helps you to access therapy.

Yes very good point. Moncrieff discusses this in depth. She is of the argument they’re used for things they were never meant for with little rigorous testing and a lack of acknowledgement for long term risks but obviously do have their uses.

I wonder where the line should be?

Yes this is highly problematic. If you’d had someone telling you your feelings were understandable, normal, and validating your experience would you have found that more helpful? Do you think you just needed a space to grieve instead?