Who is going to pay for your state pension/ care in old age?

[itsadlibitum]

Apparently birth rates are falling, and this is putting future pensions (and I would imagine general tax income) in jeopardy as the population will proportionally age.

What's the solution? Should we just write off our paid for "right" to a state pension and state support for care in older age?

Does this change your view on public investment in supporting people to have children if you otherwise thought this was a personal choice and you should support/ pay for your own children?

AIBU to think that NI contributions for "pension" is essentially government mandated mis-selling and state pension will go out the window in the next few decades?

So today’s pensioners want triple lock pensions and winter fuel allowance etc, but when they were working they wanted to pay low taxes to pay for their parents and grandparents pensions.

I paid for the triple lock for eight years as a higher tax payer. When I started work the basic rate of income tax was 33% with 9% NI on top. There wasn’t nearly so much resentment about paying tax as there is now.

I personally think the triple lock should go and the threshold for WFA is now too high, having over corrected.

The last time that the pensions were changed was 2020

What changed in 2020?

It’s such a ludicrous and misogynistic viewpoint. Having children impacts women a lot more than it does men in every way possible - physically, financially, emotionally. To bring a child into the world a woman has to go through pregnancy, morning sickness, childbirth, postpartum… all a man has to do is ejaculate.

And then in the majority of cases women are doing most of the child rearing, affecting their career and finances.

If they brought in a rule (they won’t) that penalises those who don’t have children it would disproportionately impact women.

I haven’t read the full thread so might had missed it but, I kind of don’t understand. I know the birth rate is falling but our population is growing due to immigration (I know as well as people living longer). Immigrants tend to be working age people, so ready made workers without having to do 18 years of growing up and being funded, so why is it an issue. I’d understand more in an actual falling population.

Economic immigrants are already made workers
Refugees are more varied, but I think we can all agree on that. Who may commence their education Long past the age where it might be expected. Therefore diminishing the returns on the ROI if we’re going to look at it in those terms.

You are really determined to prove the whinging Pom trope that is so well known here aren't you. How the hell am I being self centred by pointing out that you are delusional? The self centred one is actually you.

This thread is not about working conditions, access to healthcare etc. and @Itchthescratch has already made a great response to your comments. They called you selfish, and they are right.

You can protest, whine, riot in the streets if you want but there is no way you will ever achieve the retirement age going down. Has the fact that superannuation is becoming increasingly unaffordable, and not just in the UK, completely bypassed you? No doubt the answer is yes, because you can't seem to see anything beyond your petty grievances. You could well live until you are 100 and you expect 40 years of your life to be funded by others.

As for working forever, I have already retired, which I did at 65 - and without a single complaint that when I started work the retirement age was 60.

🎯 @SouthernNights59.

Me too! Too late to do anything about it and never had Equality throughout my working life!
Do not be fooled by the successive Governments saying they don't have the money, they just want to use it for other things! They've never bothered going after the tens of millions lost to their mates on ineffective Covid contracts. It's all about making sure the rich get richer.

Wow.

That is some projection going on right there. At what point have you extrapolated from my arguments that I have a disregard for future generations? A life of political activism motivated by a desire to fight for a more equal society would prove otherwise.
The pension issue and inequality to access is one issue among many.

What on earth makes you think you know exactly what pension I want and exactly how much I have contributed??

If you've actually taken the time to RTFT you would see that my arguments are mainly about the people who faced moving goalposts without the means to be able to make private provisions and the impact on their lives of working for almost a decade longer.

The really selfish people on this thread are the ones who cannot see or do not care about the implications and impact of working longer on other sections of society other than themselves and are telling people worse off than themselves to " stop whining"

I think about people who still work and are active in their 60s,70s and 80s. Keir Starmer is 63. The next PM might be 65 come 2029.

Blair is 72 and is running his Institute for Global Change. Lord Sugar is 79 and is still super involved in business. Boris' dad is still writing and publishing and he's 85.

People who have paid in with NI should probably get something back. But this can't go on forever.

We need to transition to mandatory personal savings. A Singapore style system.

Congratulations.

Maybe they'll give you a medal for "never whining"

I see you're already retired, so that makes all your arguments sound like"I'm alright Jack"

Just as I answered the previous poster the really, really selfish posters on here are the ones asking everyone to shut up stop whining and don't even try to effect change for future generations.

Come on now, none of them have worked a lifetime down the pit or doing shifts on the docks have they?

It’s easy to remain healthy when you’ve got a desk job and lots of money.

Well, no. You were a bit more secure in the knowledge that you'd reap the benefits. There's much less complaining about tax when you can see your doctor on the day you actually need to, rather than having to wait two months or sit in A & E for 13 hours. When NHS dental care was the norm, when there were generally a lot more support services, day centres, council run care homes.

Nobody minded paying a higher tax so much when you weren't also paying off a massive student loan because the state had not only paid for your degree, it had also given some people grant money to help with living expenses whilst doing it. My husband did his HND when you could still claim dole in the summer holidays!

Nobody minded paying a higher percent NI contribution because you knew your turn would come, even if it did end up being a few years later. Millennials and younger have no such knowledge, but they still have to pay.

It's about what you get for those taxes today, versus what you used to get. That's why people are complaining. More in, less out.

Ok you are totally powerless over your retirement, your lifetime income and spending. That's awful for you.

Did your research not show you some changes you could make. A small amount started at 18 until retirement at 67 does build.

I’m sure I’ve seen a calculation where a small amount invested between 18 and 30 results in millions in a pension pot
I do think the government left compulsory enrolment too late, but we got there in the end.

I better get a state pension since I’ve been paying for it all my adult life but I doubt it 😡. I don’t intend to stick around for long enough to need care though.

Compulsory enrollment has been a great benefit and has helped people.

Don't most people however have a plan career wise and life wise. I've studied X,Y,Z and I have these skills. This is what I can do to best maximise my income. This is how much I'm going to save, invest and plan for me retirement.
Not just "be happy", live off vibes and expect the government to take care of it? - barring major physical or mental health issues preventing work of course.

If you've paid in to the state pension via NI you definitely deserve it. But in the long run we should transition out of this.

Out of interest, do you speak to people like this in RL?

Nobody talked about private pensions etc when I was 18. There wasn’t even an internet then. Yes if I had started at 18 then I would be minted in retirement.

However I didnt have a crystal ball then and I don’t have a Time Machine now 🤷‍♀️

We haven’t expected to get the state pension in our retirement income planning. We assume we’ll get it but we’ll be taxed to remove it - it will only go to the less well off. We have sufficient income to retire comfortably and to pay for our care so that we are not imposing on our kids.
But it frustrates me that pension saving is optional and that despite the topic of social care being raised frequently in the past no Gov has had the courage to deal with the problem - I believe the solution needs to be resolved through cross party discussions, we need all the political parties to get together and sort this shit out in a grown up adult like manner!
We need to get rid of NI - everyone should pay the same tax from income on pensions, investments, and work.

@Dfdd I didn’t expect to be alive at that point. I did what I thought was best at the time and I won’t apologise for it. I have contributed financially for 35+ years yet you are berating me still.

If AuDHD had been recognised then, I may not have had to battle so hard for some things but it wasn’t.

Your faux shock at my actions has really clarified in my mind that the second I stop working, I can off myself:

I hope that puts your mind at rest.

A small amount started at 18 until retirement at 67 does build.

How many 18 yrs olds can afford to save for a pension today? All my money at that age went towards supporting myself at uni

I’m sure I’ve seen a calculation where a small amount invested between 18 and 30 results in millions in a pension pot

😆😆😆

Investing a small amount for 12 years will not lead to millions!

I think some people have been unaware of just how bad things are, and how little they will get.

A good friend of mine (who is happily married to a relatively high earner, thankfully) has something bordering on a phobia of anything to do with future financial planning. She hasn't had a steady income since before her eldest was born 18 years ago. Has only done stints of full-time work here and there, some part-time and consulting work.

She is wilfully ignoring the topic, letting her dh handle things and hoping for the best.

And in all other areas of life she is quite successful and functional.

I can't get discuss any of this with her. She says she's terrified to look into it and would rather not know.

I have no idea how old you are. You might already be retired? Most people have some agency over an entire lifetime. With only yourself and no children to pay for it's sad that in a lifetime there was no tiny amount to put by for retirement.

In real I meet a variety of people some provided well others a bit and some never worked and are reliant on the state of which seem happy to do that.