AIBU to question school swimming progress when DD still can’t swim a width?

[Nenanena]

Dd is 9. We go swimming as a family every few months and spend longer in the pool on holidays. She did a year of swimming lessons when she was 7 at the local leisure centre. Moved from Stage 1 to just beginning stage 3 but didn’t like the teacher and felt intimidated in the deeper water. Persisted for a bit despite not enjoying it and then got upset so we stopped lessons. About 6 months later started swimming in Y3 at school (at same leisure centre). Did 12 weeks. Initially got put in complete beginning group, when we flagged up she had been in stage 3 they moved her up. Currently halfway through another term of swimming in Y4. I got to see the lesson the other day as helped walk the kids to the centre.

Dd was in the ‘bottom’ group. They didn’t even have a width to swim in because of way pool was arranged. Some of the kids were mucking about so the teacher had to do quite a lot of behaviour management. They seemed to do loads on technique and isolating arms, legs etc and less focus on stamina and distance. She still can’t swim more than 6m unaided without putting feet down. Face always expected to be in water so think she isn’t breathing well. I’m shocked. We get no feedback about progress (was the same with private lessons). When I was at school we worked towards badges. You aimed for a width then a length etc and progress was fairly rapid. What’s the point on working on butterfly arms if you can’t even do a width of an easier stroke? Makes no sense to me.

My son is still doing swimming lessons at y10, he's doing the water skills one which sits between the later stages. He started at around 5/6. We've taken him weekly. My daughter progressed and finished all the badges quicker at around y7. I think swimming is a great thing to just master over time - whats the rush? Let them perfect the different strokes, breathing and stamina. My DS really struggled with stamina for a while as he is asthmatic - it is only in the last year where theyve done more stamina training that he is better. I think weekly swimming lessons is something parents have to commit to if it is something you value. We accepted that some instructors would be better than others - some are shouty, some just let the kids swim lengths up and down without much input, some get the kids out of the pool so they can demonstrate technique poolside, you just take the good with the average.

We do 1-1 lessons. I wouldn’t rely on the school for anything, that can’t even teach them the basics these days.

I agree with you that the swimming framework nowadays is about making money! I also just want my children to be able to swim a length safely, tread water, etc... I couldn't care less if they can swim butterfly!

I have three children. The big two have each had some private lessons. The eldest can swim competently but lacks technique and stamina. The middle one can swim a bit but again, lacks technique at stamina.

The youngest taught herself to swim on holiday but can only do it from standing.

They are all having lessons at the moment and I'm impressed with the teacher but I don't want them swimming beautiful butterfly. I wasn't safety. By far they've made the most progress on holiday with access to a pool
or sea every day.

I swam with a club as a child and became very proficient and could easily swim a mile or two during a training session age 11.

This is not a brag, because I was actually one of the 'worst' ones there! I was slower to progress than my peers and I didn't have any natural aptitude for swimming (I never won any races!) but the regular lessons over 5 years ensured my progress. I was never going to be an Olympian 😂 but I could out swim all my school classmates and most people I know even now.

Maybe see if you can find a serious swimming club for her to join where they will aim to help her genuinely improve rather than ignoring her and allowing kids to muck about. She doesn't have to win any trophies (lord knows I never won a thing!) but she will grow in confidence, stamina and skill under the right coach!

This is taught my son to swim myself and im not the greatest swimmer but if he ever got in trouble he knows what to do tread water roll on back ect... and can swim really well

You teach your kids to swim prior to going to school, school lessons are there to build on what they already know and confidence. I took mine swimming since they were babies and we taught them ourselves. Both have swam in galas and done sea and lake swimming sessions. This is on you, not the school.

Kindly, your child is never going to progress quickly in school group lessons. For safety reasons, they have to take non-swimmers one by one or at most 2 at a time so she'll never get much actual swimming time in the lesson. If you're concerned, you need to do 121 lessons with a private teacher. And reinforce technique by going swimming regularly yourself. Most parents couldn't hope to teach the correct technique that she would get from a qualified swim teacher, and those techniques will be learnt for life. Yes, it does involve face in the water from the start, and speaking as someone who never learnt properly and still swims with her head out, that is the best way to learn water confidence.

I’m in my thirties and have younger siblings. None of us did 1:1 lessons or had our parents taking us on top of group lessons on a Saturday. We are all very good swimmers.
My daughter is now doing swimming lessons and isn’t progressing as quickly as I and my siblings did . It does feel these new standards focus on so much when not focusing on basic swimming .

My old dad used to do a bit of part time work at the local leisure centre where he also gave private swimming lessons ( he was a qualified bronze medallion life saver). His first lesson for clients involved no swimming whatsoever . Instead he concentrated on getting them to lark about amd have fun in the water just so they grew confident in the pool. It worked and most people progressed very quickly after that first " lesson" ...no forced ducking heads under the water ,just making sure he was near so they felt safe and weren't about to get a lungful if they went under.

Our primary school has its own pool and they still dont teach kids to swim very effectively. DS had sporadic lessons for years and made limited progress despite high level of confidence lol. I bit the bullet and started taking him regularly and doing intensive courses and now he's excellent. Absolutely nothing to do with his school.

Has she a swimming hat and goggles? As an ex swim coach I was always amazed how many girls used to turn up to swim with long hair all over the place and no goggles. If the hair isn’t out of the way and they don’t have goggles then they can’t put their faces in the water. Without putting their faces in the water they never learn to breathe or swim properly.

I am 66 and I can't swim either. We had regular swimming lessons in the last year of primary school and I went a few times at senior school, but then got a persistent verruca which wouldn't resolve. Both DP were disabled so they couldn't take me. I just don't like the water at all.

My 81 year old friend is also a non-swimmer. Her DM wouldn't let her go to the outdoor pools during the summer months as that's where many children caught polio. No vaccine in those days.

School swimming lessons are fairly useless ime. They are too short with too many kids. Unfortunately we found the only way was private or small group lessons. We were lucky there was a fairly decent swim school nearby (the leisure centre was also rubbish), but it was fairly costly. They did learn quite quickly though and progressed to a swim club.

If you want her to learn effectively op, I would look into lessons. Private or small group if you can afford it.

As an experienced school swimming teacher I can assure you ive had non swimmers swim 5 and 10 metres even 15 metres so please dont write kids off there many factors at play. Op she closely gone back over and doesn't have understand of the basics such as aquatic breathing, body position correct arms and legs.

I must add school swimming should be a setting block, we always advise to do top up sessions or go with their parents if they dont attend the pool all that progression is often lost. The responsibility is also on the parent not the school.

Take her yourself is my advice. My son found lessons within a group so overwhelming and so I stopped taking him. Taught him myself without him actually knowing that’s what I was doing (he has Sen). It worked really well and he’s now a fairly strong swimmer and quite confident in the pool.

Haven't RTWT, but can she float with confidence? If not, it's not surprising that she will panic and put her feet down. I taught my own DC to swim, and then secondary students at school, and never advanced them further until they were absolutely confident about floating, then kicking. After all, confidence in floating/treading water can save their life, even if they can only swim a width.

School swimming lessons are no way near enough to get a child to a decent standard of swimming. You should never have stopped the proper lessons. My child is 10 and it’s only in this last year they really work on stamina and distance. But she has been having weekly lessons at the leisure centre for 5 years. She’s on stage 7 now.

Swim teacher here.

I agree with you that the swim England pathway is purely about making money. 10m butterfly at the same time as 10m backstroke (stage 5) is insanity. No swim teacher will agree that that’s the best way to get kids swimming, so it can only be about making money.

so I’ve set up my own swim school. For distance and deep end. I run special classes where I don’t care if you have a screw kick on breaststroke and can’t get your fly arms over, I’m not going to limit you to 10m to correct those techniques, when you can get on with 400m backstroke.

that said, you spoke op that your dd isn’t breathing correctly in the water, which ties in completely with only 6m. That is fundamental. There is no value on working on her stamina (you can’t anyway if she isn’t breathing correctly) when she isn’t breathing right. The teacher is right to have her in the lowest group, that’s basics number 1.

also, you and others on this thread, are keen to direct blame somewhere - the teachers, the pool, Swim England pathway etc - when actually, none of you are saying ‘my dc is really really poor at learning to swim.’ But that is the crux of it. If others are moving quickly through the groups, then it isn’t the teaching, nor the space, it’s your child.

and to conform to quite a few posters upthread who have confidently claimed ‘you can’t teach a child to swim in 12 school lessons’. I can. If the child is able to take instructions without fear. I’ve done it plenty of times, get very excited about taking a non swimmer in September and getting them kick a length on their back by December. It’s my favourite bit of my job!

And one final thing op - why would you complain about your dd being in the lowest group when she was stage 3, when you had absolutely no idea of the other children’s standard? It is entirely possible that stage 3 at 9 years old would be the weakest swimmer in the class. General rule where I live (an affluent area), but stage 1/2 - 5yo, stage 3 -6yo, stage 4 -7yo, stage 5 - anything from a 6yo up to 10yo. Club swimmers start sometimes from 7yo. So they’re doing 2km in an hour.

If the school swimming lessons are anything like my oldest school swimming lessons, they are a waste of time. She's a competitive swimmer and was really looking forward to being able to swim in school time. Instead it was a 2 mile walk to the swimming pool. 60 kids in a normal 25m pool. The top group spent most the time queuing to swim a length, climb out and join the back of the queue again. Then a 2 mile walk back to school.

Op - Swim England do Water Safety Awards. If you're going for 1 to 1 lessons for your Dd I'd ask them to focus on them and distance awards. That sounds like it would be more of use to your Dd. Around me some of the swim schools use STA. My DD's followed STA for their baby and toddler lessons. The lessons at this stage were certainly focused on water safety (I am not sure if they are higher up as they moved to Swim England based lessons). It might be worth looking into if you have any swim schools that follow this system in your area.

I personally think that if you want yiur kids ti learn to swim so they won't drown, take them swimming weekly yourself. If you want them to learn to swim competitively then a swimming school is the right option. If we sre taking about swimming lessons during PE, that's just a tick in a box exercise that the students have been in water and has nothing to do with learning to swim.

We can continue to lounge poolside looking glamorous and sipping cocktails while all the swimmers thrash about ruining their hair ☺️

The classes do sound bad but that one class isn't going to help her if she only started getting lessons at age 7 and if you rarely take her to practice. They have to have their head in the water or their body will be at the wrong angle and they will sink. They should be teaching her how to manage breathing though.

Where I live the kids start lessons as babies and definitely if they start at age 4 they have a lot of catching up to do. Age seven is very old. It would be like waiting for someone to be that age before teaching them to read. You wouldn't do that.

She needs private lessons, or private practice. School lessons are ridiculous, particularly in the bottom group, where not only do they put the non swimmers, but also the trouble makers. It is very difficult for anyone to make progress in this situation, and there will be a lot of time simply spent making sure nobody drowns!

Honestly most kids get private lessons as well as the school ones in order to learn to swim properly. I'd get cracking on this before she gets any older and more self conscious .