AIBU to expect job adverts to include salary ranges upfront?

[Netcurtainnelly]

Do you agree that the salary range should be posted on every job hiring ad so that applicants' time is not wasted?

It's a sign of a dodgy employer imo.

If salary range was not published, I would probably swerve the company and not bother applying. If I was really interested, I would contact them to ask before investing any time into the application. If they refused to be transparent about it, then I just wouldn't bother.

I dont apply if the salary is not listed. Its just a total waste of my time to fill in the application, or do enough research to tailor the cv and cover letter to fit a job that turns out to be 20k lower than what I currently earn.

Not advertising the salary significantly reduces the amount of applicants. On the rare occasion we can’t reveal it we disclose the range when replying to applicants. If their required salary is outside the range we don’t waste their time.
We pay above market rate though.

Yes, I won’t apply for a job without a salary range advertised. I’m in a field where my job title could bring in £30,000-£100,000+ and while the sector might give some indication, it’s not always obvious to predict so I won’t waste my time as I am at the top end of the range now.

Most reputable employers seem to, but I would question the culture of an organisation who doesn’t operate transparently and would assume that would be the tip of the iceberg of issues.

We don’t include it in the advert, but HR do have a phone call with everyone on the long list before finalising shortlisting. So we wouldn’t be having face to face interviews with anyone we didn’t think we could offer something within a reasonable range of their expectations.

I’m not sure about including on the advert, but I admit I’m not sure why I’m hesitant. Any time I’m not quite sure I’ve had a chat with HR or the recruiter to clarify before submitting the application, so why not just put it out there. I guess I feel it could fuel even more unrealistic expectations. And I really don’t subscribe to the unionist view that everyone on the same job spec should be paid the same, individual negotiations and performance are an important component.

(But if I was very keen because everything else looked good, I would enquire before applying, if they wouldn’t disclose I wouldn’t proceed).

Lie! They only ask so they can lowball you.

If you are underpaid in your current role, then it's sensible to move jobs. By asking this question and matching your new salary to within a few thousand of your current salary, employers are preventing you from getting the big pay jumps you would expect from changing jobs. This disproportionately affects women too as women are generally paid less, so we would be trapped in only getting small % raises every time we move jobs, gradually falling further and further behind the current market rate.

Future employers have no right to see your past payslips, so just lie.

Agree! I found out later that I was in a lower salary band than the men on my team who did far less (and were shit at their jobs).

5 years underpaid. Then I got a new female boss who fired the worst guy and gave me a promotion to his grade without me even asking. More fool me I guess, but the lack of transparency tends to disadvantage women.

This seems unlikely to me.

The difference in skillset between those salaries makes no sense.

I hate this - it actually made me give up on a job application before.

I had submitted my CV, they got back to me with an interview offer and asked me to complete an online form beforehand, including this question, which it wouldn’t allow me to skip, so I just didn’t complete the application and withdrew my interest.

To me it’s a company trying to offer you the lowest amount possible.

It’s totally offputting, and none of their business.

Here is where being in the EU would help.

The new EU Pay Transparency Directive comes into being this year which makes it mandatory to specify salary or salary range.

Yes, and the hours, I've applied for part time jobs that don't list the hours. So frustrating.

I would go further. Advertise salary and % pension contribution from e’er.

@han6729
I agree, I’m in a similar industry where salary can be a huge bracket.
Im always sceptical if there is no salary shown; assume it’ll be low and they know they’d get no applicants if it was in the ad.
Also, I think so many recruiters are deluded, my student DD was looking for a pt job(has one now), saw a pt retail job within a visitor attraction; minimum wage, they wanted your CV plus an 800 word essay on why you should get the job; to work in a shop at a castle! The ad was reams of waffle too.

It’s definitely just companies trying to pay the lowest amount possible rather than actually pay out their budget for the role.
It’s ver frustrating and such a time waste though.

Surely that's the whole idea of an interview, though? You're not going to give them the £80K just because they ask for it, without them justifying it. It's supposed to be a balance of power, leading to an agreement being made if both sides are happy with the terms available; not one side calling all of the shots.

YANBU

I never apply to any job advertised with “competitive salary”.

I don’t apply for things that don’t list the salary range, my industry does not have well defined boundaries for titles so it’s impossible to tell from the job title what the range will be.
I also never tell people what I’m currently on, I tell them what I’m willing to accept to change roles and work for them - this has blown a few minds previously!
If I’m approached by a recruiter I’ll always have the money conversation before agreeing to speak to the company, so many low ball salaries out there, particularly at the minute!

I think everyone can see why a lack of transparency is good for employers. But not for employees. If it mandatory then no one business looks odds. They’re doing it in the EU.

Yes. That’s the point, lack of transparency is good for employers and hiring managers. But not employees. If it’s mandatory then they would have to comply like gender pay gap reporting. If it’s a range and the prospective candidate isn’t worth the top end of the range then that’s for the hiring manager to negotiate - but with at least some transparency.

Sounds like you don’t really know what experience level this job requires, you’d be much better off getting a definite view on what seniority you need this person to work at, and therefore what an appropriate salary is.

This just sounds like if you can get someone who’s ok with £50k you’ll save budget, rather than actually defining what the role is.

Edit: location shouldn’t really matter, yes some areas are more expensive but the role should be paid appropriately, it’s unfair to pay someone less just because you decide they live in a cheaper area.

Why would you look odd for seeking to increase transparency in your industry? Maybe you could up the ante across the whole industry, and then the ones that don't follow suit and embrace 'the new normal' will suffer from their determination to cling on to opacity.

Lots of industries and sectors are stuck in a rut with 'what we've always done', but that doesn't necessarily make it right, nor that change isn't long overdue.

Depending on the age of your industry, there was probably a time when people 'understood' that women would be paid much less than men, and that having a disability or not being white, or being gay were 'understood' as making you much less desirable as an employee. Thankfully, the country has moved on a long way since those times; it puts the companies that have to be forced by law before they do the obviously right thing in a very shocking light indeed. How much of an industry leader and a shining example could you proudly be if none of the new equality or fair wage legislation ever made a difference to you, as you were already acting with honour and integrity long before?!

Yes. Agree. I think prohibiting requesting details of current/previous pay is part of the new EU directive coming in too.

Most job ads aren't real. They're just bait to get your data.

So give applicants an idea of the salary range. My current job advertised with a £20k range, it’s a role that could be a developing role for someone moving into a new area of work, or one that would attract someone with expert level knowledge in the area. I applied and negotiated the top end of the scale because of my specialist knowledge. I wouldn’t have applied without knowing the salary scale, I would have missed a fantastic opportunity and they wouldn’t have got a really good employee.