High ability child who underperforms

[Pamelajackson]

Sorry, posting here for traffic.

I have an 8 yo DD who has a high ability. She's in an academic prep school (due to some undiagnosed SEN) and is very able. They work 1 year ahead in maths and she learns everything very quickly. However, her school work is not reflecting her ability and in the half year report the teachers have written something along the lines of: 'with hard work she will be able to consistently produce work that reflects her true ability'.

This is something we hear every year but looking at her maths book, she does very little in the class now in Y3. Even less than before. Teachers are saying she gets distracted easily, she is slow to start and loves a good chat too.

She can be fast (for instance she is a 'Rock legend' in TTRS (times tables), if that makes sense 😆, so can get the answers in less than 2 secs.

If you can relate to this, I'd love to know how do your children do when it comes to exams.

She won't cope with a big comprehensive, she'll need to go to a smaller and nurturing school that most probably will have entrance exams. I'm getting a bit worried though as we don't know what's she going to be like in a couple of years time and we want her to achieve her potential. In Y1 we just let her be, but she's half way through Y3 and we see no improvement.

It comes down to work ethic and motivation (which comes from interest and enthusiasm for what she’s doing).

I think if she has the ability, great. I wouldn’t push it. Get her out doing other fun things besides rote learning - playing with friends, learning an instrument, doing a sport, art or drama.

You can’t teach motivation. They come into it on their own and you can support it. My dd was very average in primary school. She got a lot of ‘if she just paid attention more’. We got her involved in a sport she enjoys. She’s in secondary school in top sets and motivated to do well. It just took gentle support from us and helping her when she asked for help. The rest she’s done on her own because she cares about doing well.

Also, DS was of very erratic ability. Very bright, very quick to understand things, very articulate. No ability to read or write. Or do maths. We didn’t think he’d get the gateway GCSEs.

Eventually the stars aligned and the cogs went clunk and he’s now an excellent letter/document writer, who reads for pleasure and has a good job where no one would question his ability at all.
His handwriting is still appalling. He’d struggle to address an envelope.

Please avoid using the word mild ASD. Some people may find this offensive. ‘We think she has ASD which presents in x y and z’ is better

My daughter was not achieving very much at all at school and we had her assessed by Ed psych, OT and SALT, as we genuinely had no idea what was going on.

It turned out she had several separate issues:

Extreme dyslexia

Speech and language problems to do with understanding what was being said to her - she was only picking up bits here and there and so often didn't know what she should be doing

Visual Processing problems - not her eyesight but her brain's ability to interpret what she saw on the whiteboard, on the work sheets etc. Tables and rows would swim in front of her.

PDA (this is a type of asd where you avoid demands, so if given work to do, she managed to do as little as possible)

Adhd

So many things that school were not aware of. They thought she was "lazy" but in fact she was working super hard to mask the difficulties.

Get her assessed!

My dd was like this at 8. At 17 she crashed into undiagnosed ADHD burnout and couldn’t complete her A levels. It only gets worse as they get older.

Thank you. I'm sure we will be getting a diagnosis at some point. I need to speak to the school again re this. They think she has ASD traits but we do think there is a lot of ADHD. She's very hyper outside school.

Some children have really good memories so learning times tables it’s easy for them. That’s knowledge facts but then you say teacher says she’s slow in doing work. That’s the application of knowledge that’s something different. I would be asking the teachers for specifics why they consider she has high ability if she is not producing Work that shows that ability whether it’s orally all written.

Urgh.

That was me. Turns out I actually couldn't do better, the assumption I could and the disappointment and dissatisfaction of parents and teachers lead to life long mental health issues.

Thank you for your advice, I appreciate it but I think people get offended very easily these days. I'm only saying mild ASD and ADHD as she's not meeting the criteria for diagnosis for either of them at the moment and is coping with life/school. I'm sure she'll get a diagnosis at some point in the future.

We know both ASD and ADHD kids and adults who can't really cope and are severely impacted, hence I'm using the word mild. I'm not trying to offend anyone in the slightest.

We have one like this.

I'd echo the recommendation to have her assessed by an ed psych. We've had various assessments over the past few years (as recommended by school, not because we just go fishing). Our DD2 has ADHD, autism, dysgraphia and processing speeds out of whack with her other abilities. She's also really bright, but that can get a bit lost in the noise of her SEN.

We were concerned about her having to get through entrance tests to selective secondary schools. In part because there's no way that she'd do the tutoring our eldest did to get a place. But also because DD1 would say that she'd met various pupils with the same SEN at her secondary school, but it turned out that they'd all been to the attached junior school. This made me question whether they actually took in more children with SEN at 11.

We chose to move DD2 at year 5 to an all through independent school, so that we could avoid the entrance exams. They don't guarantee a secondary place, but DD2 has met whatever internal requirements they have to get into year 7.

I've just seen your additional comments - and ed psych assessment is generally useful, but you would also need ADHD and autism specific assessments. We went down the wrong path at one point, which was a little frustrating.

Thank you for sharing your experience, very helpful. I'm glad it all worked out for you 🤎

Honestly this was me too, but only as I got older. When learning was for the sake of learning I loved it and did really well. As soon as I felt like people were point scoring it took the fun out of it and put me off. I did very well at GCSEs but as soon as I came up against a subject I found difficult at A level I pretend it didn’t exist and got a C (I had always got As until this). If she is high ability she will likely be fine as the pressure of exams works well in things like ADHD. If she’s just average ability then you may need to help her as she gets older. My DSS also has ADHD and if it were up to him he would just do his homework in five minutes and get it done regardless as to whether it’s right or not. So I do it with him to make sure he actually learns what he’s doing. It’s not easy and takes a lot of effort but it’s made a big difference in his leaning. He has no issues with ability it’s all emotion management and staying focused for long enough to learn things he doesn’t get immediately.

My DD was like this in Yr3. Turned out the issue was lack of confidence/perfectionism. She was so worried about her work not being perfect that she would dither and hesitate and not start a task until very late on, then produce a rush job which while still well above average, did not reflect her ability.

The school did some work with her to boost her confidence and help her take the pressure off herself. Within a term she was a different child. This was in a normal state school.

My 3 (all autistic) children are able but underperform. Nothing so far has helped with this despite many interventions. Sorry 😔

Thinking about ADHD, DS who is 6 and has an EHCP in a mainstream school but is academically doing fine. He gets frequent movement breaks or brain breaks. He also has the TA sitting next to him and sometimes they will verbally rehearse a piece of writing before he writes it down. Other times she just keeps him on track. I believe he is allowed something to hold/fidget with if the teacher is talking for a long time. We may consider medication at some point but I'm not sure about that right now.

I'm surprised your daughter doesn't meet the criteria for assessment as it sounds like she would at least for the inattentive type. Have you been told that by someone?

Do the school use standard assessments to monitor progress? Her results will tell you everything you need to know, far more than her classwork. If she’s doing well in tests then you don’t really need to worry.

You absolutely do.

Mine did all tests well. But burnt out through no diagnosis when older.

A lot of children classed as high ability at Primary school when I had a child at school have done less in their adult lifes than the once not expected to do well Let your child be a child and make her own choices

We've spoken to a pediatrician who sees her for a physical condition (thyroid) and she absolutely refuses to put her even on a waiting list.

I believe they do but they don't share that with the parents. Apparently she did amazing in the last one, but I'm not sure what the test was and the teachers seem more concerned about her daily performance in the classroom than her tests.

Sounds a bit like my dd. She needed a lot of prompting to focus and didn’t really reach her potential until secondary school. She has ASD and ADHD traits although apparently does not meet the criteria.

That's teacher-speak for 'she's a chatty Cathy and not concentrating'. Teachers tell all parents of faffing children that they are very able and not living up to their potential. Your daughter sounds like she is doing just fine - nothing to worry about.

She's worked out that if she does enough she passes. That's a great system until she sits GCSE/a levels. She's 8 what is working harder actually going to achieve...if she gets to university early she won't be mature enough to cope. If she does a levels at 16 then she's sat around doing more a levels and not achieving much for a year or two.

Explain now that it's great that she is already beyond 99% of the population, but she could push on and study a wider range of things before doing GCSE (providing you or her schools can support that)

Personally I cruised through o levels and didn't know how to study for a levels (mum died half way through and uni was never an option for people with my background). But I wish I'd been able to study and know how to revise independently