12pts in a week - driving ban

[Jarofgoodness]

I can't believe that this is happening.

I am normally such a careful driver. I hate speeding, always use the speed limiter on my car and have never had even 3pts on my licence in almost 30 years of driving.

Last month I worked away from home for a week, and on the way to my temporary workplace there was a road which I thought was a 30mph road but which was actually a 20. I got caught speeding (high 20s) every single day, and yesterday received four speeding fines in the post at once. £400 in fines but also 12pts which means a mandatory six month driving ban!

I simply cannot believe that this is happening. I know that it is my responsibility to know the speed limit, and that I shouldn't break it. But this punishment seems wildly excessive and unfair to me. I have 30 years of spotless driving, and have not suddenly become dangerous in a week. Surely someone can see the pattern here and note that it was multiple times making the same simple mistake in exactly the same place? I didn't even have time to reflect on one speeding ticket and change my driving behaviour because they all arrived at once, after I had left the area!

What can i do? I am not expecting sympathy as I know I am only receiving the punishment due to me. But I may well lose my job. The form says that I can plead 'exceptional hardship' in court but that losing employment doesn't count.

I see boy racers all the time and yet I am getting banned! It just seems such an unfairness.

If this is available I would recommend undertaking it.
I did a speed awareness course last year and most of the attendees had been caught out by new reductions in speed limits from 30mph to 20mph.

I’d also recommend always driving on sat nav and having it set to beep

Oh, every sympathy. Not Plymouth, by any chance? That's where I got two on the same journey, so course for the first, poipnts for the second. I was there for two days and I was absolutely bricking it that I might have done the same on day two (after I got the letters in the post for day one). Thankfully I didn't. But if I had done the same again (24 and 25 in a 20 - in other words carefully complying with a 30 limit) I'd have also gone from 40 year clean licence to ban in two days.

Like you I never knowingly speed, aways use the speed limiter, but in this case I didn't see (or register) the 20mph speed limit two days running. Nothing I could do but pay up and look big, but when I subsequently read about the number of people who had been fined at the same point I did wonder about the way the signs are laid out. But in the end I had to tell myself to concentrate harder and not make the same mistake again (and never to go to Plymouth).

This

It surely all depends on the signage - if it genuinely isn't there I'd have thought you have a case, but if it is then "not noticing it" again and again suggests an unaware driver who we could do with fewer of

Where was this @Jarofgoodness

If any of us live close we can go and check out the signage for you.

Usually first speeding ticket you are offered to do a speed awareness course instead of receiving 3pts (prob depends on speed though) but perhaps you then end up with 9pts and no ban?

It's outrageous that you can get fined 4 times whilst in these circumstances being unaware of the first incident.

Pre cameras if you were stopped for speeding you could take responsibility for you actions and then choose how you continue to react.

Not having instant knowledge of your intended prosecution is huge backward step

Definitely worth appealing. You only have 21 days so you need to do it ASAP. Appeal the notices on the grounds of poor signage, and also appeal the ban on the grounds of “exceptional hardship” due to loss of work or undue impact on family. Given the circumstances I think you’d have a fair shot at the latter.

i’d go back and check the signage. (asap before any wrongs are righted by the council)
there should be a large sign at the start of the area and smaller speed signs repeaters can be used after that.
if there is no big speed sign at the start it’s wrongly signed.

if the signage is correct you cannot challenge in those grounds. but i’d still try and go to court to see if i could do a course. it cannot get much worse than youve already got ie lost your license.

hiring a lawyer such as nick freeman to fight for you in court will cost multiple thousands.
he would check with the council to see what the speed limit is supposed to be and check the signage is correct. you can do those yourself.

if you represent yourself and lose your license it would probably be cheaper using taxis than paying for his fees until you can regain your license. but check out his costs by all means.

you can argue hardship in court ie carer for kids or parents, need car for work, live rurally etc.

Be careful as others have said...driving in an unfamiliar area and not making sure you understood speed limit is the opposite of mitigation! Suggests high level of carelessness.

Given the impact it's had, I would absolutely go back there to check the signage, and get legal advice on whether the repeated error in short period of time can be argued.

It might be that nothing can be done, but it's worth checking.

It's outrageous that you can get fined 4 times whilst in these circumstances being unaware of the first incident.

Why is it outrageous?

Aren't you basically arguing that OP should have been warned about the fact that she was speeding so she doesn't do it again? Surely the counter argument is that if you can speed four times in the same area, you're not paying enough attention...

I remember this happened to a work colleague of mine who got clocked 4 times in one day on same road. It was a 40 limit they had cut and signage wasn’t clear. I’m sure they kept their licence due to circumstances but had to go to court and got a large fine.

The self righteousness is strong on here today.
We all know speeding is illegal and very dangerous, the OP knows she did wrong and is contrite but nonetheless posters are still queuing up to berate her.
What's the point? There but for the grace of god etc.

I would try and go back to the place where you got the fines and check the signage. Because if you are as careful a driver as you say, its hard to see how you got caught out so many times. How precise is the location of the fine? Presumably a specific camera. Is it possible you joined the road at a point where there was no signage between that and the camera?

I think your argument for why you shouldn't have the fines is a bit ludicrous though. Having zero points of fines previously doesnt automatically mean you have never been speeding or driven badly. It just means you have never been caught!

This is the thing @Jarofgoodness . You didn't get just one, so you could realise your error, you got 4 all at once, for 4 different speeding offences. Yes you should have known, and surely not ALL signs could be obscured/hidden, but this seems ridiculous and unfair.

It really does need challenging, but I'm not sure how you'd do it. May be worth getting legal advice. An automatic 6 month ban is odd. I have never even heard of a 6-month ban. Also, like a pp said, I don't understand why you were not offered a speed awareness course for the first one. This sounds like a glitch in the system.

I'm sorry this is happening to you, and I hope you can get it sorted.

Very few people have berated her from what I can see.

What they are saying is be careful about arguing about "lack of signage" as it could come back and smack you in the arse as "careless driving".

OP drove for 30 years without a problem. This is obviously just a mistake and you sound like a nasty person putting the boot in.

Why do that?

If the first one offers you a speed awareness course then take it. Therefore “only” 2x fines and 6 points total for the other two. I don’t think the system is clever enough to realise you have been ticketed 3 times. Each letter should be dealt with separately

Wow, that seems insanely slow for a default speed. It must catch loads of people out.

She got 4 fines, so it would be 1 x course (plus fine), 3 x fines and 9 x points.

Get a lawyer specialising in motoring offences. I used to work with one.

@MissJoGrant because I meant exactly what I wrote. Previous driving history doesn’t mean that the OP or anyone else will continue to drive safely. Not being aware of the speed limit repeatedly is definitely a mistake and one that has had legal consequences. It is important that the OP does not try to mitigate the offences in court by making statements that aren’t helpful to her. It is not a mitigation to say that you were unfamiliar with the road.

Watching with interest.