12pts in a week - driving ban

[Jarofgoodness]

I can't believe that this is happening.

I am normally such a careful driver. I hate speeding, always use the speed limiter on my car and have never had even 3pts on my licence in almost 30 years of driving.

Last month I worked away from home for a week, and on the way to my temporary workplace there was a road which I thought was a 30mph road but which was actually a 20. I got caught speeding (high 20s) every single day, and yesterday received four speeding fines in the post at once. £400 in fines but also 12pts which means a mandatory six month driving ban!

I simply cannot believe that this is happening. I know that it is my responsibility to know the speed limit, and that I shouldn't break it. But this punishment seems wildly excessive and unfair to me. I have 30 years of spotless driving, and have not suddenly become dangerous in a week. Surely someone can see the pattern here and note that it was multiple times making the same simple mistake in exactly the same place? I didn't even have time to reflect on one speeding ticket and change my driving behaviour because they all arrived at once, after I had left the area!

What can i do? I am not expecting sympathy as I know I am only receiving the punishment due to me. But I may well lose my job. The form says that I can plead 'exceptional hardship' in court but that losing employment doesn't count.

I see boy racers all the time and yet I am getting banned! It just seems such an unfairness.

Absolutely go to court, be contrite but offer your explanation. Yes, losing your job would be taken into consideration. I know of a few people who’ve reached 12 points and not received a ban. You would however retain the points on your licence and have to keep it clean till they come off.

You could ask for it all to be heard in court as you could potentially plead exceptional hardship if that is the case. You can only use it once and any fine will be potentially higher if you aren’t disqualified. Seek some professional advice.

All the 20 limits in our town have great big 20s painted on the road, great big yellow speed cameras and 20 signs. You may think it's unfair, but I very much doubt it wasn't well signed.

Yes - I'd be reluctant to rely on any information like this other than my own eyes. (Acknowledging that OP didn't see!)

My in-car satnav doesn't update without a cost and even then it's not always correct.
Biggest discrepancy I've seen so far is a 20mph zone that it still thinks is 60!!

@lindyloo57 -

Last year I was visiting my mother who lives in Coventry. I grew up there but left in 1987. The city centre has changed so much in the past few years, now with high rise student flats everywhere.

My elderly mother has no internet or smart phone and was very upset when her local bank branch closed and the only one left is in the city centre. I offered to give her a lift and was shocked at how the road layout has changed….no entry signs, a right turn into a multi -storey car park replaced by concrete blocks…and a few hundred yards further along there were signs for a ‘bus gate’.

I’d never heard of a bus gate before and indeed was looking for something resembling a gate, like one sees at railway level crossings. There was nothing at all apart from a sign. I didn’t have a clue what to do but I saw lots of cameras on poles and didn’t want to risk a fine. I was very fortunate to be in a right hand lane and was able to do a loop. Unfortunately for the city centre traders I’ve decided to never drive in the vicinity again, and talking to my siblings they tell me they never go there either and just go to retail parks or shop online instead.

That's really luck op. Not sure if anyone has mentioned Nick Freeman also known as Mr Loophole?

I’m insured on my parents and my DH vehicles. If any of them asked me to take the rap for their speeding they’d be told in no uncertain terms that I wasn’t prepared to do it. Perverting the course of justice has no limitation of proceedings so it could come back to bite those involved at any time.

Barrister here OP. Losing your job (if you can provide evidence of it) would likely count as EH (whatever the form says), and the magistrates would likely be very sympathetic to your situation. You would also need to evidence the impact that the job loss would have on your domestic situation etc, which shouldn't be too hard to do, particularly in the current economic climate.

I would suggest instructing a local direct access barrister directly - generally cheaper and easier. They will be able to help you on whether you have a defence to the substantive charges. Good luck.

Oh fair enough. Sorry.

In 2013 I got caught going about 35 in a 30 twice on the same day on same road and thought it was 40.

Two speeding fines letter arrived I emailed and I asked them to treat it as one offense and this would therefore enable me to do the speed awareness course which would be beneficial considering I clearly needed to brush up on the rules and regulations and how to tell it’s 30 when not clearly signposted.

This was upheld, I had a letter back basically telling me off and I didn’t have to do anything else like go to court. I then went on the speed awareness course and didn’t get any points at all.
I had never been caught speeding before and haven’t since either.

Like you I am usually careful,
Hope this helps and you’re able to do similar.

I think most of its automated so I doubt anyone would notice that you had sped so many times.

No help to you now OP but at the entrance to each new road /leaving or joining a roundabout there’ll be a large speed sign and on 40mph and 20mph roads always repeaters. Also most 20mph roads have it painted on the road.

@Jarofgoodness - I live in Dorset but went to my niece’s wedding near Skipton in North Yorkshire, a place I’d never been to before.

After arriving home I soon received a speeding ticket for doing 35mph in a 30 limit.

I was very careful to follow Waze on my SatNav but I do remember there was a spot where the signal ‘dropped’ and I think this was probably where there was a camera shortly after the speed reduced from 40mph to 30mph. I also recall that as it was the Summertime a lot of roadsigns were obscured by tree foliage.

Dorset doesn’t have speed awareness courses of its own but I was able to do one online with a guy holding a course (from his bedroom in Birmingham….with his unmade bed in the background!) Most of the other participants seemed to be middle aged women for some reason.

Just a mile from our house there is a road off the bypass which is a main route to a holiday park; it was always 40mph for the first mile and just after a small retail park it dropped down to 30mph.

However, a new housing estate is going up opposite the retail park and the whole length of the road changed to 30mph….there were police parked in a side road pulling over drivers who were unaware of the new changes. It was still stating 40mph on Waze and Google Maps for the first 3 to 4 weeks after the changes and on my car SatNav, but I don’t know if anyone was able to make a successful challenge? (The new 30mph signs are quite small too).

It might be worth trying to find out if the speed limit had been reduced shortly before you were issued with all of your speeding fines?

Did this not used to be called driving without due care and attention, or am I too old and not au fait with modern language.
Have had my licence for 50 years this year.
OH got done last year for speeding in a really stupid place that he certainly should have known about. If I were to defend him, which I am not, he is usually "driving/flying" Airbusses that go considerably faster, but no excuse for speeding on the road!
Sorry OP, but you were not paying attention.

She's hardly 'persistant' if she has never had a speeding ticket in 30 years of driving, until this past week! 🙄

Sorry, what is EH?

So know someone whose 80 year old grandma has to go on a speed course for doing 23 in a 20. I think there has to be some proportionality. There are crazy boy racers doing 60 in 30s who seem to evade getting caught. I sympathise OP and it must be very stressful.

I read a newspaper article some years back where a man drove on an unfamiliar motorway several times in a week to find he’d racked up 12 points. It went to court and it was decided that he hadn’t had the chance to essentially learn his lesson and so he didnt lose his license. Sounds like you may need a solicitor. Good luck I hope they’re able to cut you some slack

Exactly. Surely there has to be some flexibility and rational thinking. Each case should be judged individually.

As the parent of a child who was hit on her way home from school, by a driver doing just over 30 in a 20 (who claimed he thought it was still 30 in that part), I do not sympathise at all. Anywhere you drive, you need to be aware of the speed limit. It is your responsibility as the driver. My daughter, by some miracle, did not die, but has life long physical and mental effects from her injuries
Take the fine, suck up the ban, and perhaps be a more aware and cautious driver in future?

Exceptional Hardship. A person who is a "totter" (i.e. have twelve points on their licence, as the OP does) must be disqualified from driving for six months, unless they can demonstrate that to disqualify them would cause them "exceptional hardship". It is a high hurdle (any driving disqualification is likely to result in hardship) but loss of employment is a strong argument, in my view.

This does not apply to offences such as drink driving, which involve a mandatory disqualification of at least 12 months.

Ah ha, thank you @Lilyfreedom

Check Google street view

I know someone who talked their way out of a ban and my god he should have been banned for life! Definitely had a few offences previously (and at one time tried to get his wife to declare she was driving) but he said he had to be able to drive (arguable). No idea what reasons he gave.

Years ago my mother in in law exceeded the speed limit - she did over 100 on a motorway! A camera got her. Completely out of character for her but this was before I knew her!

She was 250 miles away from home . She was summoned to court but she worked as a carer and needed to drive for her job. The judge was sympathetic and didn’t ban her- but gave her points.

She also had the inconvenience of going to court where it happened- 250 miles away. So an expensive mistake aswell as very time consuming.

I even think her employer were sympathetic and actually wrote a letter to the court- I’ve no idea if that swayed their decision though.

As for the OP’s case, because these offences happened so close together, the court will hopefully treat this as one speeding offence and offer a speed awareness course.

But I would certainly seek legal advice on this case. Yes it will cost money , but could save you a lot of hassle and a potential ban.

I used to drive buses for a job.We all make mistakes sometimes. It’s easy to mis read a sign on unfamiliar roads.

20 mph is a ridiculous low speed unless it’s outside a school. There used to be hardly any 20 speed zones, but the government has probably caught on that there’s money to be made. Amazing how the police don’t have the resources to visit a house which as been burgled (arrived 3 days later), but they seem to have enough of them to park in a car at the side of the road for 8 hours catching motorists driving at 25mph in a 20 mile zone on a quiet road. This is what happened in our local area recently. I’m all for stopping people speeding around at stupid speeds, but think the 20mph speed limit is just a money making exercise and nothing to do with trying to reduce accidents.