AIBU to limit contact with a friend’s child who keeps hitting my DD?

[10thlittlemonkey]

We’re friendly with a couple of mums from antenatal classes. our kids are all around 3.5 now. One of the boys is speech delayed and nursery have suggested he may benefit from delaying starting school in September as he’s summer born and likely has some additional needs.
My issue is that on the last few occasions we’ve met up, he has randomly hit or pushed my DD without any warning. For example, last week I asked DD to say goodbye and ask if he’d like a hug. He smacked her in the face. His mum told him to say sorry and he then slapped her again. DD didn’t cry but just looked really shocked. Similar things happen most times we see them.
I do appreciate he may struggle with communication and that could be a factor. I also think it might be exacerbated because his parents sometimes say things like “look how nicely DD is sitting/behaving,” which I imagine could make him feel jealous or singled out.
Their parenting style is very different to ours and I wouldn’t feel comfortable telling them how to handle it. I try to interact positively with him and give praise too to rebuff some of the parents comments

I’ve found myself excusing his behaviour to DD (“he struggles with his words,” “he has rough hands,” etc) while also saying it’s not ok and she doesn’t have to play with him.
However, DD has mentioned it a couple of times before we’ve met up, so it clearly plays on her mind. I’m starting to worry about the emotional impact on her if this keeps happening.
AIBU to start limiting contact? Or is this just normal 3-year-old behaviour I should ride out?

YANBU. Your job is to protect your DD. Unfortunately some children do go through a rough phase, but your DD comes first. I wouldn’t hesitate to do the same under these circumstances.

I don’t really care what another child’s issue is, I don’t agree with children (ESPECIALLY) little girls being told they have to be understanding of being hit. It’s not your daughter’s job to help socialise another child. Even if he’s ND, it shouldn’t be acceptable for her to be hit irrespective of age.

I also wouldn’t force hugs or even ask.

It’s not that my child doesn’t have the confidence to say no. It’s that he doesn’t have the ability. So he would reject the request of a hug by hitting.

Other children are safe with him because he attends a wonderful nursery who know him and his class mates well, have an IEP for him, manage situations appropriately, encourage EVERYONE to communicate gently/safely, and step in to prevent any escalations in behaviour before they occur, just as myself and his dad do when he’s at home. Most importantly, he masks at nursery, so the intensity of the behaviour is not the same at nursery as it is at home.
How do you think any children are kept safe around each other? Lots of kids display unwanted behaviours, particularly kids with additional needs such as mine, when it’s commonly difficult to predict.

I would definitely limit contact for the moment, it doesn’t have to be forever and kids grow and change. I’ve had a similar issue with two different kids in different situations and just reduced contact, both kids grew out of it and turned into polite, lovely teens. Still friends with their mums. But at this stage you need to show your daughter that she should not be “forced” to accept situations where someone hits her and she should not accept it as normal. You are right to put her first.

Absolutely understandable to retreat from spending time together. Separately I would not even suggest hugs to your daughter in general, i'm not sure a child of that age will differentiate between a suggestion and insistence.

This is such a tricky one and I’m actually in the same situation with a friend. Her youngest child (same age as my child) is a bit of a bully to my child. I’ve personally taken a step back because my first thought/concern is my child.
it is very awkward as I really like the mum but as you said, we have different parenting techniques that clearly don’t work.
I would step back from the friendship as much as you can and as commenters have suggested, meet up without the kids.

My dc are adults now but when other dc were rough/violent towards them I told the other dc that their behaviour was not acceptable even if their dm was right there. A simple ‘don’t smack dd It’s not nice.’
If someone slaps your dc on the face you have to call it our immediately not hope the dm will deal with it appropriately ( although that should happen as well).
Ime dc are more likely to listen if another adult tells them off.

I’ve been on both sides of the coin, so fully empathise with both parents. But it’s never just been with one child, this will be a pattern all through school age too - with some roughhousing, some with additional needs who hit, some without but hit anyway. You could limit contact but I’d suggest not entirely, and when you do meet up use this as an opportunity for your child to learn how to manage this behaviour so they’re equipped later, eg as another said ‘stop that, I don’t like it’. In general, segregating or alienating young children can make their behaviour worse as they’re just not old enough to understand and so act out more. They’re all still learning how to socialise and handle/regulate their emotions.

I’d protect dd. Years ago (over 20), I’d meet my antenatal group every week at someone’s house (we’d take it in turns).

one lady had a boy who was a biter. Not a nip, a full on bruise and blood drawn biter, he’d break the skin. Mum would laugh it off as him being a twin. My dd was his main target. She never said, we don’t do that to him, or we don’t bite or anything to let him know it was wrong. She’d never check dd was ok, she’d just laugh it off! I’ve never seen that group again. I stayed friends with one of them for a while and due to Mr Jaws the group gradually broke down as whoever he bit next left too.

Ok it’s not easy being the parent of a hitter/biter and being ostracised is horrid but equally you need to protect your child from injury. There’s no easy solution I’m afraid

Personally I think you should not ask your child to hug anyone. A child of that age finds it difficult to differentiate between a suggestion and a request. Also the child at the recieving end might find it difficult to say no. The child who hit your daughter may have done it as an preventative reaction to being potentially hugged. He doesn't have the social skills as yet to say no.

Why would you be suggesting your dd hug everyone she says good bye to? School won't want children hugging everyone so I'd stop that right now. There's absolutely no need to be asking her if she wants to hug everyone just because you find it cute.

The boy sounds like he's probably autistic and no doubt as a result of that hates touch or hugs just like my ds. So you suggesting she hug him is probably what led to her being hit then.

Of course you can take a break from seeing him if you think it is the best interest of your dd.

Forcing hugs is a normal social interaction is it?
Not for me. I’d probably punch you in the face too.

Dd naturally a very affectionate and socially enthuaiastic child with friends and cousins and historically would persist even if other child not interested or says no. we obviously recognise this is overwhelming for some children.
Because of that, we’ve actively worked on teaching her about boundaries, body automny and accepting no. We encourage her to ask first as a way to stop her diving in first to develop her social awareness and emotional resilience.
I don't think it's fair to suggest it is related to child's inability to say no to a hug- this weeks at our weekly activity involved him chasing her and trying to put his hands around her throat unprovoked in the middle of the activity...

This is quite a leap to what ive actually wrote. I haven’t suggested she hug everyone, and haven't referred to it as “cute.” We’ve deliberately taught her to ask before hugging and to respect a refusal because she is a naturally affectionate child (which we are fully.aware can be overbearing at times for some children)
I don't think being autistic or disliking touch is a free pass to hit other child who is standing at a distance asking if they would like a hug (or trying to put his hands around her throat unprompted which is what he did this week)

I would have zero time or accommodation for this

The parents need to, well, parent?

Of course not, your daughter shouldn’t need to navigate that. But also you shouldn’t have her offering to hug him as you know he doesn’t want that.

I think a break would be good for everyone. Maybe it will improve or maybe it’s just a bad combination but it’s definitely not working now.

YANBU. I would already have told him not to hit my daughter, and made it clear to my daughter that it’s not acceptable. I would definitely distance myself- your own child always comes first.

I think a break is a good idea, but remember children do grow up and it won't always be like this.

My youngest was a biter and would whack his sister but he has a rep at his specialist college for being empathetic to a fault. He's incredibly tuned into the idea of upsetting anyone to the point of it causing massive anxiety and "freezing" him. I would really encourage that you shut down this narrative of DD is so affectionate, this little boy is so violent, had rough hands etc. There is so much value judgement in there. They are both still tiny, they are both still learning and being socialised and neither of them have the understanding or communication skills they will have in future. It's not OK that he whacks her, of course it's not, but there are reasons why just telling him not to doesn't work. A profound character flaw/nasty nature or whatever is not particularly likely to be the reason.

One of the reasons my son had to leave his secondary school was an unsupervised autistic student who repeatedly intruded into his personal space. Now he needs an "escape pod" he can retreat to at his new school to help him feel safe. I hope you do manage to keep seeing your friend eventually and find ways to manage both of the children together while keeping them both more regulated. The right venue might help. This is individual to the child but I would guess at places where he can do "heavy" work like playgrounds, or walks, or maybe something like a petting farm where there are textures to explore. Sitting getting a bit bored in a coffee shop probably won't play to his strengths. It sounds weird but him wearing a rucksack with some weight in might help him feel more comfortable and grounded.

We had the same thing with a family we shared our childminder with from the age of eight months to just over two years. (Also from antenatal classes).

My daughter was coming home every day covered in bruises/scratches/bite marks. In the end, we decided to cut contact with them.

Their parenting style was also very different (they practised only gentle parenting and refused to tell him off). I did feel quite sorry for the poor little boy, but ultimately, my main concern was for my daughter. And to be honest, whilst they had every right to parent how they chose, but that right stopped at my daughter’s face !

It’s a shame, and very awkward, but your responsibility is to your daughter, and she doesn’t have to put up with that.

We had a similar situation and it was tough because I'm really good friends with the other mum.

In the end she came down hard on the behaviour and it stopped. The whole gentle hands, we don't hit stuff had no impact and nearly led me to stop seeing them - I hated seeing my daughter get smacked in the face and then hearing oh gentle hands in the sing song voice!

The mum switched to time outs at home or just immediately removing the girl from the playdate or soft play or whatever. She would throw a tantrum but she eventually learnt that hitting didn't get her what she wanted.

Speech delay and behavior like this is very common with kids with autism and they need managing very differently - surely the doctors have told the mum that they suspect he has autism? She should be getting down to his level and saying sternly “no!” “We do not hit!” And taking him out of the situation. Making him say sorry is pointless. Short precise sentences are what kids with ASD need to understand