To think the UK is basically ungovernable...

[Madarch]

It doesn't actually matter who is in power anymore, it's going to be a shitshow regardless.

I disagee. We just need much, much better candidates standing for election.

Where are these candidates?!

The GOOD people in the world generally don't want that kind of power

I don’t even understand what you mean by that

do you mean we can’t review amend and pass laws?

hold together the work of governement?

what are you actually saying? It seems like you might be referring to a relatively niche event that has little impact on the day to day workings of government?

Exactly! Who on earth would want to stand? Remember the stunt Greenpeace pulled on Rishi Sunak's private residence? Totally unacceptable. We need better candidates but equally the people we need to stand would be crazy to do so!

Even when good things are done, people aren't happy. Most of the population just like moaning.

In what way do you think we are ungovernable?

We keep voting for people who tell us want we want to hear. If a politician was honest about the hard choices we need to make as a country no one would vote for them.

Apols! I'll try and clarify. I'm feeling pretty nihilistic about stuff generally today.

We obvd have the infrastructure to pass laws etc.

I'm not sure that any party's government will be able to govern without constant media and public outrage. There are tsunamis of disinformation from all angles. Sleaze, smears and scandal are worse than they've ever been.

Politics is a mess.

@Nickyknackered

Even when good things are done, people aren't happy. Most of the population just like moaning

I think that’s the truth. Also, most of the MPs themselves.

I was talking to my H about this today and he said “What we need is a strong leader” and I thought, “What, like Putin?”

I have no answers.

To be fair, I think people have a right to moan. If good things are being done, they don't get a look in with all the land mines Labour seem intent on standing on.

A benevolent dictator!

Could there ever be such a thing or does power always corrupt?!

Agree

I think this is true. The current government inherited a real mess. You can blame Brexit, COVID and years of austerity. They are now working in a context of increased dissatisfaction, hate and mis- and dis-information.
The government need to make hard and unpopular choices. To reduce poverty, for example, they could increase benefits (deeply unpopular to many) or bring in legislation to force companies to get rid of zero hours contracts (at a cost to wider society, as retail costs will rise - also deeply unpopular). They could provide proper early years support for struggling families to help them get out of the poverty trap. That costs £££.
These are simplified examples but the underlying point is that we as individuals don't want to cough up what is needed to remedy the problems facing the nation.
And I for one wouldn't want to be PM.
On the plus side I don't think Reform would last five minutes.

Ultimately, this is a country where if you earn average incomes you cannot afford things that you assume ought to be normal and taken for granted. Minimum wage (which is becoming maximum wage in some industries in some parts of the country) - you cannot afford to buy your own home. Median household income - sure, you can take delivery of a new BMW 3-series every three years but the cost not actually owning it will be a millstone around your neck for decades. Think you should be able to afford steak or salmon five nights a week - nope, there's the equivalent of the entire population of the UK joining the Indian and Chinese middle classes every year and they can comfortably outbid us on the salmon and steak we produce. Crap local schools or shit NHS dentistry? Tough, you can't afford to go private.

This is now a really, really poor country and nobody is willing to admit it. They (politicians) just promise jam tomorrow because they'll tax the (non-existent) 'rich' to pay for it. We (the public) wait patiently for what we think we're entitled to.

Tomorrow is now here. This is why the UK is ungovernable.

That about covers it.

Throw AI and mass redundancies into the mix and the future looks darker still.

I think the UK wants to be like the USA but geographically is European and rejects that.

Also it’s tiny compared to the USA but doesn’t realise it. It would be so much better to realign with Europe but the majority (with most of the wealth) regard Europe with suspicion.

Therefore you end up with a population who want to move right even though it would be better to move towards the more social progress of Europe, ie, cheaper housing, more equality and less distance between rich and poor.

Im probably not explaining this very well🤷‍♀️ but we are a tiny country that punches above its weight historically, but is caught between two worlds and we want to be friends with everyone! Therefore ungovernable…

not just the UK, many Western countries

A lot of the population are completely deluded about what we can afford. Grifters like Polanski or Gary from Economics tell everyone the money is there, it’s just a problem of redistribution. That’s not factually true.

Politicians in office have to face reality. It’s hard choices, billionaires aren’t coming to save us. Long term, patient investment is required. The state is probably doing too much. George Osborn tried to balance the books by salami slicing. Didn’t work. Instead of cutting every budget a touch, we might be better off to pull out completely on certain areas.

We have too many civil servants going through meaningless process that senior civil servants use to cover their backsides, rather than being directly accountable for their judgments. We are over regulated due to single issue pressure groups.

In so far we are weak, lazy and entitled, we get what we deserve.

@Madarch there are many issues. I think the main one is the electorate. Collectively we are very good at criticising, in enabling the politicians to focus on sound bites, not substance, and not holding them to account for the correct things.

As a society, we seem to assume that everything posted on social media is true, and nobody looks at the facts anymore it seems.

Look at Brexshit as an example. I would have expected the remain side to say "these are the positives of staying, these are the positives of leaving, these are the negatives of staying, these are the negatives of leaving, and on balance we think remaining is better for these reasons" and vice versa for leave. What we actually got was slogans on buses and a whole heap of rubbish, and the electorate seemingly didn't research the facts. Even now there is all this focus on small boat crossings, which wile it is a problem, is nowhere near as impactful to the economy as people appear to believe.

The current government are useless communicators. This is disappointing. They have also made some pretty bad decisions. Also disappointing. They have also done some really good things, but have not publicised them anywhere near effectively enough. This too is disappointing, as is the electorate's inability to recognise the good things.

And the electorate appear to want champagne service for lemonade money, and have it delivered yesterday. This is unrealistic whoever gets in.

So, the answer actually lies with us, the electorate, as well as the politicians.

The thing that worries me most is that there are so few, if any, proper politicians anymore. So, if Starmer goes, who then? There is nobody in the wings. Ditto if Labour go, who then? Reform and Conservatives are no better, and arguably considerably worse.

It is never a good place to be where the electorate are choosing the least worst. I don't envy anyone getting into politics these days. I am glad I am at this end of my life and not starting out. That's fairly depressing too.

Go live somewhere else then then we won't need to listen to you whining.

The UK is statistically one of the best countries in the world to live in due to a combination of wealth, sophistication, relatively low levels of corruption or discrimination, education systems, climate, economy, human rights etc etc. There are countries out there where the grass is greener but they are very, very few and far between. But good luck, off you fuck and leave us who recognise how lucky we are to live in the UK with our relatively very peaceful, healthy and trouble free lives. Bye.