To think we can start a glamping business

[Glampinggirl]

We have always dreamed of running a glamping experience but it seems to me that the market is a bit oversaturated. However my family seem to think it’s a wonderful idea. We would need some investment with a cash injection from ourselves also. Would live onsite with our son and his family. Separate annexe for us. Could this work (yabu) or am I right in thinking there are already too many (yanbu). This would be in North Wales

I run a self catering business- a few points.
What yearly return on your investment do you need to service any debt and pay yourself a wage?

How long (realistically) is your season going to be? Wales? In February?

How many hours a week will it take you to maintain the property? Cleaning? Landscaping? Change overs?

Have you read the regulations regarding hot tubs (and the costs of maintaining them!) Known as “the devils bidet” in the business btw.

Do you like cleaning toilets? Ironing bedding? Ect ect.

Days off and holidays- what happens when you want to go on holiday? How much will extra staff cost?

How saturated is the market in your chosen area and what are the planning requirements?

Factor all that in and if it still makes sense, then yes, you can make money.

I will only stay somewhere with an integrated bathroom. Can't leave the kids alone to go to the loo in the middle of the night, or have a shower. So bell tents glamping would be out for me, but pods/cabins/shepherd's hut with bathroom are all good.

I have stayed in a pod with wigwam holidays before. I presume they are a franchise, but you might want to have a look at how they do things. Also a converted double decker bus once, which was great as the weather was pissing it down and we had plenty of room under cover.

Imagine yourself waiting for whichever repair man, standing in a muddy field on a cold wet Wednesday in October, on an otherwise empty site, with some of the cabins/tents needing urgent repair. You also have some big bills to pay, are overdrawn, and need to find at least part time work in order to keep your head above water.
If you're ready for days like that, go for it!

Myself and partner have been exploring this but he has 35 years experience and we have been looking at options to include small weddings and a barn to hold a cookery school, onsite catering.

Also have friends who can host art classes etc to allow groups to book the whole place. Partner is an exec Chef and trainer.

We think an option for tents and a few hard standing pitches alongside glamping pods would allow multi income options.

We are cash investors I think a mortgage with one source of seasonal income is risky.

Lol sounds like everyone's kids just need to make way for your dog.

We can all add to the dream, our personal views on what we like and want out of a glamping holiday - but we can't answer your AIBU without your business plan.

Have your family members who think it is a great idea done the detailed business plan? Looked into all the legalities and liabilities?

Is there planning permission for a glamping site or would you need change of use? Is there already mains water and electricity? Getting connected is costly and takes time. Is there a septic tank / mains sewerage or would you be looking at soakaway and compost (the eco site model? I am guessing not if you intend hot tubs)

Capital costs of drainage if the land is wet, pitch levelling, building platforms, all the facilities . Overheads: Public liability insurance, buildings insurance, business rates, council GIRAMS or 'mitigation' payments, commercial waste licence, water bills and costs of tunning hot tubs, cleaning and maintenance costs - toilet unblocking, showers and toilets cleaned twice a day. Legionnaires monitoring and checks, etc. interest on loans.

Have they done an audit of all the sites in your vicinity and monitored Pitch Up etc to see how full / empty they are at different times of year? And what the charges are. Booking fees costs.

Have they looked at all the websites on 'how to set up a campsite' - including the government page on licensing?

Start with the business plan!

I camp a lot, tent camping, but smallish niche sites. All the owners I have chatted to do it as a sideline /diversification to their main income. Would this be your main income?

The ones that are run as a permanent sustainable full time business are much bigger

I am all in favour of camping and glamping sites, so good luck!

Would love any site recommendations!!

Let's start a thread on the Mn Camping Board!

(MNHQ tried to abolish it a couple of years ago, so I like to see it used for camping posts!)

Not at all. But nice that you’ve picked on that comment in a post trying to be helpful.

I specifically don’t take my dog to a place catering for families so it doesn’t cause any issues. My dog is great with kids but would bark and want to join in if a child was playing ball nearby.

Someone wanting others to make way for my dog would take them to a family site and then ask people not to play with balls. I’m being considerate of others holidays as well as mine.

Is that ok for you ‘lol’. 🙄

We go glamping all the time as a family with a dog, so we rotate between quiet family-oriented sites that are dog friendly. I follow a bunch of glamping places on Instagram and it's how I find out about most of them, so I would say a social media presence is very helpful!

Non-negotiables for me are a private bathroom (whether in the pod or separate is fine, but never shared with other guests), towels and bedding and kitchen utensils provided and beautiful quiet wild landscape all around.

The worst thing about glamping is that there is never any space to dry clothes and towels - put hooks and rails anywhere you can! I love staying in Wales, but it rains a lot so places to hang damp clothes to dry really helps.

I would say keep it small, make plenty of space for each cabin, if you have one or two dog friendly pods then fence them in. Also, have rules about quiet - no music allowed, lights off by 10pm to allow stargazing. We go for the peace and stillness and it's only ever other nice families there.

We started our holiday cottages by welcoming children and dogs. Over the years we have moved to adults only and no dogs as problems for other guests arose ( it’s a shame as 90% of people with children and dogs are fabulous). We also moved to 5 night minimum booking which cut out stag/hen parties, for the same reason we don’t do hot tubs. Now all the guests are like minded people who have come to enjoy the countryside, it’s a pleasure to welcome them and we have many people who come every year.

You'll have to pay commercial rates for utilities and council tax may be affected. My husband rented flats out in Perth. By the end he was almost paying people to stay the profit margin was so low.

As you’ve mentioned running the business with and living on site with your son and his family I think you also all have to think, properly, with your logical heads on, about the emotional logistics and relationship dynamics of that. Running a business with family is hard, even when you all get on. Running a business with family where you all also live on site in close quarters is harder. A business successful enough to generate an income for two families (especially when there’s high initial capital investment to pay off) is a tall order. What sort of relationship stresses are there going to be if it struggles to do that in its initial years? What happens when somebody doesn’t think somebody else is pulling their weight in the business? What if you disagree over decisions to make? What if a financial decision somebody makes turn out to be disastrous? If your son decides his loyalties are with his wife rather than you over a disagreement, how does that play out in working life?

DH and I stay in campsites (south of France though) for our main holiday. DCs are grown so it is now just DH and me.

My sixpence worth:

• hot tub would put me off. Not going to use it so it is just wasting pitch space.
• I'm not sociable so would prefer not to have to use communal bbq etc
• raised decking is a genius invention, somewhere to sit outside and much reduced tracking of the outside inside
• I dont want to do more than a quick sweep/wipe round at the end of my stay. Happy to pay an up front damage waiver/cleaning charge but dont want to be inspected before I can leave
• site shop with the doings for a first night meal is a great feature. Also good to be able to buy local produce to make the stay distinctive.
• rather than an honesty shop could you do a pre-ordered delivery? Personally, I have always found the 'welcome pack' a bit uninspiring. I would far rather be able to select, say, some local bread, cheese, jam, sausages etc and have that delivered for arrival.
• People on holiday are 'heavy duty' on accomodation. So factor in a lot of maintenance cost and time.
• Running holiday accomodation is hard work. If the shower stops working or the toilet wont flush your guests want it fixing now not later.
• Reviews will be very weather dependent. Bad weather will result in bad reviews

I think it could be a great idea but it all depends on your location and your target market. I actually think the opposite to you with regard to young families - I know lots of young families who are increasingly choosing UK holidays instead of the hassle/expense of going abroad. But you need to be very clear who you're catering towards, as PPs have said - child-friendly would put off some adults, whereas some adults (groups, loud parties etc) would put off families.

I am in the "young family" group and I do this type of holiday. I tend to look for:

• good, clean toilet and shower facilities close by (I also bring an enclosed potty for my youngest)
• playground (ideally near to any communal site areas like picnic area/covered space etc)
• walking distance to a pub, shop etc
• bike rack/shed
• fire pits with seating (I don't really like the hireable ones, I like sunken pits with log seating around or similar. Not a deal breaker, but a preference)

I don't like/want:

• sheets provided, if glamping (I bring my own sleeping bags usually)
• dogs roaming around. I'm fine with dog friendly sites as long as they must be on leads on main site and this is enforced
• meter showers. Absolute deal breaker and a pain in the arse. Just put the costs up to cover it 🤣
• very hilly sites

I've never been on a campsite that had fenced off pitches. We tether our dog and, if there are children about, sit outside with her. That's what most people do. Fenced off pitches for camper vans and motor homes would need wide gates, I think it would be unsightly.

I avoid sites that allow dogs. They all say 'dogs must be on a lead' but so many dog owners do not comply (only for a minute...don't worry he's friendly...he'll come back when I call...he is such an escape artist LOL...) , or have extended long leads - and I don't want a dog cocking its leg up on any of my stuff, especially my £1k cotton canvas Dutch pyramid tent!

Neither have I on a campsite but glamping pitches tend to be more self contained and have their own area around the tent/cabin.

Often very dog friendly sites advertise fenced off areas so you don’t need to tether your dog in the same way.

We tether our dog when camping too. I’m just saying what dog owners may look for in a premium experience and not just a campsite.

It’s annoying when this stuff isn’t enforced which is another reason why you want staff on site. There’s a great campsite near us next to a pub but there were so many dogs off lead. That’s the only place I’ve ever seen it though.

This is a disaster waiting to happen, OP.

• You're looking at a site that you are going to have to check planning for, so I assume it isn't a capsite yet. Bad news.

• You are going to have to set up every pitch. Even if you go for tents, each pitch will need to be hard cored and plumbed. Because if I'm paying for glamping, I don't want to share a loo. And you'll need landscaping.

• If you go for cabins, that is an enormous expense. Plumbing, electricity, sewerage, the cabin itself, fitting it out. Multiple times.

• Where is everyone going to park?

• As PPs have said, there are issues with hot tubs

• And it's North Wales - how long is your season going to be?

You'll basically be running a very expensive B&B with multiples problems you haven't even thought of.

Do not do this.

Also - why has it long been your dream? Is your son ready to be on call 24/7/365, in all weathers?

Will you get permission from the local authority to run the business from there?
they’re not always keen due to extra traffic etc.

i think you’ll find it very costly to set up so you need to really do your research on that.

hot tubs are a nightmare for being germ fests and people ignore the instructions on things like no fake tan not to mention all of the other health and safety aspects.

it will also be a near 24/7 job to run the business in terms of running the day to day aspects as well as the business side and marketing etc.

while you could make it work and many do, it sounds like a naive dream on the wider families part.
have any of you run any kind of business (hospitality) business?

Thank you for this. It is really just a dream at the moment but suitable land has become available. I have used Chat gpt to do figures etc but yet to do a business plan as we would want to approach the council to see if change of use would/might be granted. My son and husband both work full time so would have their incomes. Myself and my daughter in law would run the site.
We will be viewing in the next week or so so can have a proper look at the site then etc.

Thank you. It’s great to her both sides. Definitely food for thought

Myself and my daughter in law would run the site.

Dear god, OP. Do not do this.

Who's going to clear the blocked loo/septic tank in the middle of the night? When it's raining? And you're about to get a bad review on TripAdvisor?

Then you absolutely have the proper thorough conversation about the impact on relationships of running a business together as a priority. The idea of working with family can sound lovely, the reality is often very different. And your son and husband will be caught in the middle around who they give their loyalty to if you fall out. Do your son and DIL have / are they planning children? I think you need to consider how up for half the responsibilities and chores of running a glamping site she’s going to be with small children around, if so.