Moving problem schoolchildren to another school?

[Netcurtainnelly]

Why are problem teens like the killer of Harvey Willgoose and Brianna Ghey just moved to another school.

What happened to bring expelled. All your doing is moving the problem around.

Both these pupils had problems and incidents at their previous schools!

Surely if you get expelled that's on the pupils and the parents.

Parents problem. Teach them at home or whatever. If you can't control your child and they are out of hand because of you why should others suffer?

Everything starts at home. There's a real lack of parental accountability here.
Teenagers got expelled for a reason that's it.

Theirs and their parents problem.
Absolutely no discipline at home no doubt and no respect for anyone even their parents.

In alot of countries people value an education and wouldn't do anything to warrant being expelled.
It's a disgrace really.
School wasn't easy but I can't imagine being expelled. Shameful.

That's very short-sighted. So we just give up on children and leave them to their parents. What do you think will happen then? Will they suddenly become upstanding citizens? I think what is much more likely is that they will become much worse, become involved in a life of crime because they have no other prospects and have been shunned by those who could give them purpose, support and protection.

Well as long as those who behave and want to learn are able to?

I’m a teacher and my DH worked in a PRU for many years. OP, I understand your sentiment regarding making parents take responsibility for the behaviour of their children. However, I think you’re underestimating the home lives of a lot of these students. Being at home and educated by their parents would not be better for them or society than being at school.

My personal view is that PRU and similar alternative provisions should be expanded, and include any students who are consistently disrupting the learning of others. My experience tells me this would be 3-4 students out of every 30 per class. That’s a lot.

The alternative provisions would need to be individualised enough to find pathways for success (a job, apprenticeship, further education) for each student. Some students wouldn’t make it and would still end up committing crimes and be imprisoned. However, there are enough students on the periphery who would be helped by this kind of provision.

Considering how astronomically expensive this would be to run, there is no way the state could fund a provision like this without help from the private sector. I think that some investment from companies and local businesses could help. E.g. offering work experience hours, charitable donations, volunteers, sponsoring certain provisions etc.

Anyway, just my 2 cents.

There are no easy answers here. The boy who killed Harvey Willgoose should not have been in school. He was obviously dangerous, this was known from many previous incidents. It is a failure of the system that that risk wasn't taken seriously.

But expelling children doesn't solve the problem, in fact it just puts dangerous young people on the streets and the risk is still there. I have worked in a pupil referral unit and trying to keep these young people in education and treat emotional and behavioural issues is extremely difficult and is massively underfunded. A lot of people think these kids don't deserve help and support - most of them have undiagnosed learning difficulties, mental health problems, are in care or already in the youth offending system. They need intensive help on multiple fronts.

We can't just write them off and say it's the parents problem. Most of the parents of the kids I worked with had substance abuse issues or severe mental health conditions or were in prison. A lot of the kids were in local authority care. If we don't do something to address their problems, what then? They end up as antisocial adults, they use drugs, they end up in prison or they have multiple kids that they can't look after, and the cycle perpetuates. They could end up living next door to you. If we don't try and address the problems while they're still children, the problems don't go away - they get worse.

Please share your powers of being able to mind read anyone, even those you don't know - if you know that no child who doesn't behave impeccably wants to learn.

Also how are you aiming to fund the care bills for all the adults who stayed home with their parents, learnt nothing and suffered trauma and neglect and so are now unable to work or look after themselves. Or do you really believe that if you can't operate as an independent, self sufficient being by 4 or 5 or even 12 or 13 dying on the streets is what you deserve?

All of this.

Of course it’s somebody’s fault - mostly his. But there were opportunities to stop him. There were opportunities to prevent this crime. If you honestly think some babies are born destined to become murderers then I can’t even argue with you - our viewpoints are way too far apart.

That hyperbole just doesn’t do the guilt
pull any more. Why have you inferred I believe “some babies are born murderers”?
It is the decisions made by individuals to live such a life, other wise why hasn’t every young person with his schooling and life experience murdered someone?

It's extremely complex and it isn't all down to failures of parents or failures of systems.

In many countries, fuelled by social media, there are increasing levels of anger, aggression and violence where solutions to disagreements, disputes or feeling wronged or marginalised are to exert aggression or violence on others.

Just thinking of some of the DC I know involved in serious violent offending, they include those with parents who are teachers, youth workers, medics and even solicitors. And no that doesn't automatically mean stellar parenting but it certainly isn't the impoverished, uneducated, drug-using, child neglect or abuse backgrounds that many people assume the DC must come from.

Sometimes schools matter int heir approach. A boy in my son’s year had been expelled from two secondary schools. He excelled at my son’s school (still had Benchley problems but they managed them differently I’m assuming) he ended up securing an apprenticeship at Mercedes when he left !