I think any human female under the age of 18 in the UK is a girl, not a woman.

[epstain]

Reading some of the Epstain files and Branson refers to a 17.5 year old woman.

I think he’s wrong, and minimising.

A 17.5 year old is a girl.

I agree. Absolutely trying to minimise what went on.

I think you're overthinking this although it's understandable.

I don't think a nearly 18 year old is really a girl. A girl to me implies someone who is quite young, probably under 13. Woman is probably more accurate but personally I'd say teenager or young adult.

You think a 14 yo is a woman?

“I think if Bill Gates was willing to say that you've been a brilliant advisor to him,” Branson wrote, “that you slipped up many years ago by sleeping with a 17 ½ year old woman and were punished for it, that you've more than learnt your lesson and have done nothing that's against the law since and, yes, as a single man you seem to have a penchant for women. But there's nothing wrong with that. Anyway something along those lines.”

You’re wrong.

In all honesty, I wouldn't even class an 18 year old as a woman. Maybe I'm just getting old, but they seem like kids to me.

Girl if under the age of consent
Woman if over the age of consent

Realise the age of consent varies around the world

Yes I specified the UK.

By the way, what is the AoC in the states?

What did I say that implies that? I think you need to work on your reading comprehension.

I said I would say "teenager or young adult".

It varies from state to state. 16, 17 or 18 mostly.
However some states have no minimum age for marriage or it's set at a low age like 13/14 and if a Judge agrees a child of 14 can get married and (I assume) have sex.
So in some states there's essentially no age of consent if you are in a legal marriage.

OK. Then 16

USA- 30 states have age of consent as 16

California 18 and New York state 17

Where's the legal definition then that proscribes how we use language?

Some people will use "girl" for actually adult women.

Yes I would refer to a 14 year old as a young women. Doesn't mean its ok for Epstein et al to groom/traffic etc her

I’m 33 and I still refer to myself as a girl so under 18 is definitely a girl, not a woman!

Woman implies adult. Adult implies 18. Or maybe 21 in US.

My daughter is 16. I do not care what the 'age of consent' is she is a girl. Not a woman. Ffs. I see those photos of poor Virginia Giuffre and I could cry, she was a GIRL and no legal age can change that.

That quote is indeed minimising, these men and women all enabled that wretched creep and all of them should be ashamed of themselves. Whether they actually did anything to these girls or not they were there, they saw, they knew what he was and because of wealth they looked the other way.

My nan refers to "going out with the girls" quite a bit and she's 82.

Maybe we never turn into women and we're girls all our lives....!

Teenage what? Teenage woman or teenage girl?

Interesting. I've noticed the press always refer to 18 year old males as men if they are in the wrong (arrested, suspect) and boys if they are victims (killed, in an accident).

I was wondering about this earlier. I can't work out what happened to the other victims. I know Virginia G was only 17, were the others under age?

"Teenager" on its own is fine. "She's a teenager".

OK, so what about when we are specifying a demographic that does not include teenage boys? Rangers, for example, is for teenage girls. Not all teenagers. Not teenage women, because there is no such thing. Teenage girls.

Age of consent in the U.K. is 16 so legally speaking assuming that there is no coercion then completely legal at 17. Whether it’s morally right is different, it’s definitely icky but legally speaking a 16 year old can consent to sex with a 70 year old and there’s nothing legally preventing that.

If he's 21 plus with a 17yo... then yes she's a victim of grooming. If he was 18yo, she would be his peer (although potentially still unable to consent dependent on circumstances).

If this particular email is grown, powerful men describe their conquests... then yes, she would be a girl.

Ok, then you can use that language - there's no rules.

I would call a 17.5 year old a teenager, a young adult, or an adolescent. I would say they are closer to being an adult than they are to a child but they're not quite there yet.

As I said in my first post - it's understandable but I think the OP is overthinking. We know these people are awful. Whether they use women, girl, or anything in between isn't going to change that.

A girl is a female child and a 17 year old is a child so yes .