To ask for a CAO

[StitchHappens]

My DD is 14. Is it worth applying for a child arrangement order to get her dad to help with childcare over the school holidays? He believes it is my responsibility to ask him to have her and then to make other arrangements if he decides he can't do it. He won't give me any dates for the summer holidays, which I need to book if I want to get them off work. There are 50+ members of staff and pretty much everyone has kids or grandkids or wants to go away over the holidays, so if I dont book them soon the chances of it being refused are high. His contribution to the Easter holidays is to offer to have her on 2 of the 3 Saturdays in the holiday. He usually has her on a Sunday. I take all half terms.
However she is 14, and only has 2 years until she plans to go to college, so is it worth it? I don't know how long the process takes start to finish.

Yanbu to want him to do his part but yabu to waste your time and money on getting a CAO what probably won't be granted anyway. The court won't make him have her if he doesn't want to. Sorry OP but it's just not worth you doing it. At 14 could she potentially be left on her own whilst you work, with you checking in via phone regularly on breaks/lunch of course or with a neighbour/relative checking in.

Thanks, that's what I was thinking would probably be the case.
Unfortunately her being on her own at home isn't an option.

The court sadly can’t make an order for a NRP to do more if they don’t want to.

They will only order you to make a child available for contact.

With a 14 yo they probably won’t make any orders anyway, as it’s up to them where they go

Does she have SEN or a disability that means she can’t be alone? Could make a difference.

If she's thinking about going off to college in less than two years then surely she's responsible enough to be home alone for a few hours on a semi regular basis? Or if she invited a mate to keep her company?

She is 14 I assume by summer nearly 15, why cant she be left alone. she is very nearly an adult she needs to be trusted to be alone. Have summer camps and activities for her and annual leave but some days she should be ok on her own at that age,

What is stopping being at home be an option?

She doesn't, but her older brother does. They are liable to argue, and he can be unpredictable. He isn't violent to other people, but can be destructive and if he gets upset and it isn't managed well can tend towards hurting himself. I can leave him alone for an hour or so, but wouldn't want to put her in a position where she was having to deal with him having a meltdown. It would be unfair on them both.

Surely if you can’t leave your son alone for longer than an hour that means you’re at home for him anyways? If your daughter was able to go to her Dads you’d still have to make sure you’re home for your son so why can’t you just be there for your son and daughter?

Im not excusing his behaviour by the way and yes he should be offering to take paid leave to help with his daughter.

DS goes to college 3 days a week and I work across the road (can see the house from work). On days he isn't at college I come home and check on him in lieu of tea breaks. My partner passed away a couple of years ago, but his parents still care for him during the holidays, but wouldn't manage both of them.
In all honesty I am thinking of cutting my hours right back to 2 days a week and claiming carers allowance so I can be at home most of the time, I think it would be better for everyone, and would mean ex could do whatever he wanted (or not as may be the case) without me feeling like my life revolves around his whims!

Ex is self employed so says he can't take time off.

Sounds like one or the other can just be at his house on their own, as long as it’s not both of them.

Sorry, can be at who's house?
The ex? He won't have them. My DS doesn't see him anyway.
At mine? Yes.

I misunderstood, I didn’t realise he just wouldn’t let them be in his home, without having to take time off work. A CAO won’t change that, annoyingly.

Yeah, that's the problem. DS doesn't see him, and DD does, but when asking to make any arrangements I'm constantly told it's my responsibility to sort, never his. 🤷🏻‍♀️

CAO are hints the resident parent. You have to make the child available during the ordered time. They do not have to have the child and face no consequences. But they can take that CAO to child maintenance service to reduce the maintenance they pay even though they not having the child.

the system sucks

Do you really want to send them to stay with someone who doesn’t give a shit about them? He doesn’t want them. You can’t make him want them. It sucks for you, it’s bloody unfair for them, but I think for the sake of harm reduction I wouldn’t be trying to force them on him. What a total arsehole he is.

Could you look at going term time only at work? You have the right to make a flexible working request and then you'd be around in the holidays.

You're employer sounds fairly understanding as they're letting you pop over to check-in on DS in your breaks. Depending on the nature of the business would they be amiable to DD sitting in a quiet corner with a book/iPad/schoolwork?

Any youth groups or day camps in the holidays she could go to? Check museums and theatres as they often have youth programmes in the summer. Also art galleries often have day long art workshops for older children and teens.

Are you on friendly terms with any of her friends parents where you could arrange a bit of a supervision swap? They watch DD on this day, you watch their DC on that day.

No, but i don't have any option if I want to stay working 5 days a week. Why I'm seriously considering dropping hours and claiming carers allowance.

You can get all the orders in the world and none of them can force him to have contact that he doesn't want. If he's unreliable take him out of the equation and book the holiday club.

Sadly term time only isn't an option. I work in retail, and Christmas/Easter are non negotiable. Work have been brilliant thus far, and done everything they can to make it feasible for me to stay on there, but there is only so much they can do.
There isn't much in the village (small/rural) in the way of holiday clubs sadly. I already make arrangements for all half terms, 1 week of Easter, all of Christmas (he has them boxing day) and half of summer holidays. I'm at maximum stretch as it is!

I think there is a holiday club (£££s) for 1 week of the summer holidays, so as well as costing me twice what I earn, it doesn't come close to solving the problem.
Dropping my hours and claiming carers would make me around £50 a week worse off, and give me the freedom to change my days and if I kept working a Sunday, stretch my holiday allowance much further.

Yeah total waste of your time & energy getting one.

as you are just across the road, is them being home together totally unworkable?

I was going to suggest an older teen just to 'supervise & again, in dire need you're just across the road.

but if it's 'only' £50 pw you're worse off by reducing hours & claiming carers, that's going to be 'cheaper! Then even paying a teen to supervise.

im guessing you've exhausted contacts such as DD's friends parents?

we used to have a +1 for most if the holidays. She was no trouble.

Unfortunately, that's what you'll have to do. Your ex is a liability. You can't rely on him. It's a shame because it will reduce your earnings but there's nothing you can do.

Thanks, I've just been crunching the numbers, and it will probably actually be less than the £50/wk I thought, as i hadn't factored in that i wouldn't be paying tax/ni, and the reduced pension contributions. I will try and keep the pension contributions as similar to now as I can if possible, but all round it's looking like my best option. It would massively reduce my stress levels too, as I wouldn't need to rely on him at all