To wonder how anyone can believe in a religion?

[Staringintothevoid616]

I can understand why some believe in a higher power, in many ways it’s logical and many might just feel there is one, some people might refute that, all fine and dandy.

But what on earth makes people follow a religion? There’s literally hundreds of them over the course of history, even a rudimentary bit of research/critical thinking highlights the fact they can only be man made, the rules designed to fulfil a particular mundane purpose.

What makes people pick one (beyond being born in a certain place to a certain family) over all others and go “ yep this is the one truth, these rules come from a specific god/gods/goddesses, these rules other religions are just made up”.

I mean for many it’s not just a hobby, they’re willing to shape their lives to whatever set of rules they pick, sometimes to kill and be killed. Why??? Even a second of thought must highlight their folly?

it’s not about whether a higher power exists, it’s about why people have to frame that belief on a set of clearly made up rules, which range from the bizarre (don’t eat meat on a Friday) to the downright dangerous )it’s justified to kill anyone who doesn’t believe the same set of made up rules as you do)

AIBU to wonder why people follow religions?

@Staringintothevoid616

Well, the reason I believe in my religion (polytheist Paganism) is because I believe that gods, goddesses, other kinds of spirits, fairies, etc, are real.

I believe they are real because of my own experiences and the experiences that other people report.

Many polytheist pagans are similar. Our view is based on our experiences and the anecdotal evidence given by others in our communities.

People in the pagan (as well as occult and witchcraft communities) are having experiences that we interpret as being with gods, goddesses, other entities.

That’s interesting. I know many occultists operate a more psychological model and believe entities are manifestations of their own consciousness (IME this is a bit of a sliding scale from total fiction to questions regarding the nature of reality. This is usually linked to views on the true nature of imagination. Where do you sit on this question? When you sat “pagan Polytheist” which system do you follow?

So what you’re saying is, the way Jesus lived his life is totally contrary to the way the organised religion(s) of Christianity has developed?

Wait, you're an occultist and you're crapping on about religious beliefs?

Bahahahahahahahahahaha!

Just get on with your life and don't worry so much about what other people do. Believe me, if anyone with different beliefs looked at your life they'd think you did and believed some very weird shit.

As the Bard of Scotland famously said "O wad some Pow’r the giftie gie us, to see oursels as ithers see us!" (Oh if only some power could gift us with the ability to see ourselves as others see us).

You're genuinely ridiculous 😘

With the greatest of respect, you don't know anything about my belief system. The term “occultism” covers a wide spectrum of beliefs and understandings and practices . It simply means “hidden”.

I find your response very interesting though. There is a lot of anger and aggression in tone, but very little content. Why have you chosen that tone of response. My question, is, and has been from the start, what makes people choose religion and then a specific religion. I think in a society, it is natural to be curious about the motivations of others, don’t you think?

@Staringintothevoid616

I don't operate on the psychological model myself - but that's not to say that it has no part to play at all in occultism.

I believe that a diverse array of spirits exist and that they are conscious entities that exist independently of us.

I am an animist, which I would say is a predominant view among pagans, polytheists and many occultist and witches as well - animism is the view that there is an underlying spiritual essence to absolutely everything.

I believe that everything potentially has some level of consciousness of its own, including material objects.

I even believe that so-called fictional universes and characters actually exist independently of those who are said to have created them. (Any fictional TV show, film book series, etc.) There is a branch of paganism and occultism that focuses on pop culture, which is predicated on this very idea of so-called fictional worlds and their characters being real and accessible. Occultist Taylor Ellwood refers to characters from "fictional" worlds as "pop culture spirits." I think it's possible that they either exist as spirits in the spirit world somewhere, OR, they could be physically real in an alternate dimension.

A sorcerer acquaintance of mine once mentioned that the Illuminates of Thanateros (a chaos magic organisation) once invoked Bugs Bunny against someone (in order to annoy/harass them) and from what he heard, it was quite successful.

I don't think "system" is quite the right word for for my pagan polytheism, but like I said, I often describe myself as aligned with Celtic Paganism , in order to highlight the specific gods, goddesses and cultural practices that I favour and am most interested in exploring and upholding. However, I am also more than happy to interact with gods and goddesses from other pagan religions and pantheons. As said, I recently prayed to the Goddess Aphrodite (of Hellenic Greek Paganism), gave her some offerings, asked her to join me and asked if she would communicate with me.

I don't believe in a religion. I believe in God. That outworks itself within the framework of the Christian faith, but it's not the religion per se that I believe in.

@Anyonecansee

I'm both religious and and occultist - the two don't necessarily crossover, in fact many times they don't. When it comes to religions like various Paganisms, though, which already believe in multiple gods, goddesses, spirits and the reality of magic, there can be quite a bit of crossover.

Something just clicked for me. Christianity is the framework within which I live my life.
I'm good at critical thinking (PhD) and I'm a member of a church which places a lot of emphasis on analytical sermons and study groups. The idea that I haven't given it a second of thought is laughable.
I can't think of any "bizarre" rules I follow.
The challenging bit isn't thoughts about "kill or be killed" it's about giving time and money to the community - food banks, homeless charities, refugees, etc. Having a mindset that doesn't stress about the small stuff is good. Trying to be a good neighbour. Being part of a church community.
The "Eternal Life" bit will be a huge bonus, but not why I'm a Christian.

But you can do all those things without religion. You can do all those things within the framework of many religions. Don’t doesn’t really answer why you chose to be religious or Christian.

Totally agree, it’s possible to be both. Many people in the Golden Dawn (and various other Quabbalistic systems) are Christian. In fact if you read many of the texts they make is clear they’re designed to sit along side not displace the persons religion. People very rarely understand occultism

Indoctrination from childhood (aka grooming) usually. Although a few others will seek them out for alternative reasons, for example criminals or alcoholics ‘finding the light’. Or simply seeking a welcoming community in some cases.

Thanks for the really interesting explanation. Would you say that the Gods and fictitious worlds are actually brought into being through the authors imagination or they already exist and the authors is turning into them. I think that’s really fascinating. Are humans actually the creators of gods (as in actually bringing them into being) I’ve thought about this before as something that explains the rise and fall of gods along with Empires, if we work on the basis they’re real, we bring them into being and destroy them. Brings a new dimension to “God is dead and we have killed him”

@Staringintothevoid616

I think either view can be reasonable, but in terms of the Gods, I believe that they existed prior. That doesn't mean that I think they necessarily created us, though - many pagan polytheists don't actively believe that the gods had any role in the creation of the universe. I'm open to the possibility that one or more deities could have played some kind of part, but I also know that it's equally possible - if not more so - that the gods and goddesses played no part whatsoever.

I also don't believe that the gods are destroyed by humans. The 'old gods' are still being honoured today, so the domination of Christianity on these Isles did not mean the old British and Irish Gods were destroyed. People might turn away from them, the majority might stop believing in them, but that doesn't mean the gods themselves are gone or destroyed, and there would always potentially be openings for them to make themselves known if they wanted to.

When it comes to fictional characters, I think it doesn't have to be an either/or situation. I admit I do like the idea that so-called fictional worlds and their characters already exist and that the creators are more "channelling" them or "tuning in", as you put it. And I do think that is possibly the case with a number of them, perhaps many. But it may not apply to all - it could be that some are indeed created by a human, but become real in the spirit world or an alternate dimension, and potentially become independent of the creator.

I should say that some writers have mentioned feeling themselves that their "fictional" worlds and characters are, on some level, real. A friend once told me of a story he'd heard about Thomas Hardy - in which Hardy, pale-faced, told a friend that he had "just seen Tess." (Tess of the D'urbervilles.)

That’s fascinating about Hardy. Thanks for sharing.

I find the imagination, endlessly fascinating, And here I’m talking about the peak of imagination as seen by many of the Romantic poets. To STC the poetic imagination was effectively the channeling of the divine, so a similar concept.

The channelling of alternate worlds is really interesting, it reminds me to some of the thoughts around seeing the future and the past, that actually everything is happening simultaneously so you’re just experiencing what is happening now.

As I said, everything just clicked into place. I had grown up in a nominally Christian family - I'd been baptised and we went to church occasionally, maybe 4 or 5 times a year, and then I just got interested when I was 16. It was intellectual curiosity to start with, and then it just clicked as a bigger picture.

It's never not made sense. When I met my husband, he was a Christian, so we fit together that way.

As academics, we know other academic Christians, and so I know a lot of Christians who have thought about it deeply. The idea that over many years we've just carried on without giving it a "second of thought" couldn't be further from the truth.

I've been slightly involved in interfaith connections, so I'm not committed to "this is the only truth, all other religions are rubbish" But Christianity makes sense to me.

It gives you a lovely sense of community when you are 'in', and much more so if you're in a fairly closed society (e.g. religions that believe in being 'separate' from the evil of the rest of the world, or those in communes). It probably gives you a sense of purpose in life, and some sort of explanation of what you are here on earth for. It gives you hope at times, whether that's just about things getting better if you pray on it, or that you'll see loved ones after death. It can provide structure, with a religious framework and teachings, and perhaps peace and fulfillment in knowing that you are trying to be more like Christ/the being that you are following the example of.

As for Catholics traditionally abstaining from eating meat on Fridays, it is in memory of Jesus. He (the Lamb of God, as He is sometimes described) was sacrificed on Good Friday, and therefore some Catholics abstain from eating meat on Fridays in His honour. Thus, it's fairly commonplace to eat fish/vegetarian on Fridays.

Sometimes, however, power goes to the heads of those 'in charge', which is where things start to go wrong.

I was brought up atheist, but find religions very interesting.

That's not true at all re cult/religion.

Cheers for that. No stereotyping here then 😂

For me the fact we all die and what is the meaning of life question led me to faith. Was a few years before I found Jesus as the spiritual Son of God and chose to believe in the words of the bible. I will probably always have questions but since I'm a created human I don't like to question the creator. If that makes sense. Life's been hard. Prayer is a comfort knowing we are never truly alone.

I never could believe the we came from monkeys thing...

Can’t speak for other religions but the reasons why I am a Christian and believe it is true include: strong historical evidence, very strong textual evidence, logical coherence, explanatory power with respect to my personal experience as well as observation of the world.

Also, I think it’s really important to remember that everyone believes something.

You either believe there is a god or you believe there isn’t. You believe there is life after death or you believe there isn’t. Both positions are based on weighing up the available evidence, but both (and plenty more alternatives) are faith positions.

Nope, not even remotely. It's actually kind of cult like for a person to mouth that sort of dogma tbh.

There are very specific behaviours that cults engage in, and though some religions do end up cults, most cannot at all be classified as a cult, except by someone who's arguing in bad faith.