To ask about Chinese takeover of UK independent schools

[namezchangez]

Name changed for the obvious reasons. This seems racially prejudiced as a question, but that isn’t my intention. I have no preference about the ethnic origin of the children my children go to school with other than some desire for diversity. I respect Chinese culture immensely and am impressed by its focus on self-development as well as education. But I don’t want my children to go to school with a large number of people who all speak the same non-English language at home, and I am genuinely puzzled about why so many mainland Chinese families choose to come to the UK for schooling.

My son’s prep school is about 50% Chinese. (About half of these are from Hong Kong, and I understand that story better.) I am one of the few non-Chinese mums at the school gate every day and I am fed up of standing alone in the playground while they ignore me and chat among themselves. He has been doing 11+ exams recently at a few different schools. I had hoped that secondary school would be more diverse (while recognising that I won’t be around as much). But, if anything, the schools I’ve visited seem more monoculturally Chinese. On Saturday he did the exam at Magdalen College School in Oxford. We had liked the school a lot at open day and it would be commutable from where we live by school bus. But his impression from the 180 children at the test (and mine from the queue) was that about 70% of the families were Chinese. Maube this isn’t a bad thing. But when and why did it happen, and why don’t people talk about it more?

££££ is why.

You mean that only Chinese families can afford the fees? Why? Why aren’t more wealthy Americans etc moving here for schools if our schools are so great? If they’re not so great, why don’t the Chinese families go elsewhere?

I am chinese and my dh (white British) & i are planning to send our only child to prep school. He is 6 months old but we have registered him for the assessment. I speak English as a first language, thank you very much (i am not from China or HK, my own father can barely string 2 sentences together in Chinese). In fact I worry that he wouldnt pick up chinese as we speak English to each other so we are going for mummy and me mandarin classes even at this young age. I try to speak to him in chinese and sing him songs but its hard when DH doesnt speak at all..

My take is that the UK is famous for its private schools and higher education. There are many other countries where you could earn more money, pay lower taxes, enjoy better weather, live in more comfortable housing (living in a house or flat once occupied by a victorian factory worker or 1930s telephonist isn't that amazing even if it is in a lovely leafy London suburb or bougie postcode).

I came to the UK for university. I stayed as my husband is British. However I chose to settle and raise a family here as I felt the schools were more nurturing and my dh felt strongly that private schools were worth exploring..the reason why I often hesitate is because we aren't rich at all , the reason why its an option is because we still live in the flat we bought as 20 somethings and plan on one child..however many people from mainland China have become wealthy due to the country's exponential economic growth and unless they are married to Brits or have some other reasons, the majority of Chinese who come here as PhD students or are on work visas are from rich families and so are more likely to afford things they value like private education..

in my experience, many white British families who can afford it often choose to move to a grammar school area or good comprehensive catchment rather than pay the fees.
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Without wanting to sound discriminatory as we value diversity but have witnessed a huge lack of diversity at one child’s grammar school. It’s been difficult for my child to fit in and their experience of secondary school is very different to my own. Parents very traditional and strict. Not always a bad thing.. but simple things like going to the cinema, shops, a sleepover.. if we had known then we would have chosen somewhere else to be honest.
Other child is at a selective independent and again, our family is very much a minority with the Chinese.
It’s a wonderful influence on our children but we would have liked some diversity.

Do you not realise that Chinese and Indians have the money now? Americans can find good private schools in their own country. Unis are also dominated by Chinese and Indian students because they are smart, value education and have money.

So my DD is at indie all through school that has been bought by a Chinese investment company, however you wouldn't know it, there a few Chinese boarders, but not 50% and I don't think there are any day pupils.

I once went to a flat viewing in nw London where the daughter of the family went to a certain top London private school. It was a 2 bed so her 4 year old brother was sharing a room with her parents. Parents owned the flat and it was a nice quiet street and they paid the fees so they weren't in dire poverty but not exactly rich. Parents are indian. They said she got in so she should go..

I dunno any white brits who would make such a sacrifice, it was quite inspiring. I think Indians are used to paying for private education in their own country. The money is obviously very different but if you have the mentality you should pay for education then it makes the difference. I guess in China people do pay a lot for enrichment classes as well. When I was growing up my parents spent 4 figure sums every month on my tuition, I had around 10 classes per week.

I think you have to remember the gov also just put extra tax on private education, which no other country does, so we do not compete any more on a global stage. Plenty of private schools in India, Japan, Singapore and America get similar or better grades than ours. Many older schools are opening abroad to combat the tax as UK is no longer profitable and there is no need to send kids across the planet and will be less moving forward, so if a parent wants to save money and have their kid in their own or any other country they are unlikely to pick a UK school unless it has a particular affinity to them or they know a lot of people who go or went there. I suspect many Chinese, being the only ones who can still afford and value our private education system are sending kids to be with family friends and such. In my experience they are usually a good influence on other kids and work hard. If you aren't keen you can ask for a breakdown of % of nationalities when you look around schools.

I like my kids going to a local state school where we’re part of the community and make local friends that represent the population. The thought of paying for an education where kids and parents don’t mix with the local community is odd. I can’t imagine it’s easy to make other parent friends in that scenario.

I’m ethically HK. Private schools are businesses. They admit whoever can pay the fees. If there is more demand than supply, they can charge more for more Chinese (or Russian or Arab) students. They have no obligation to admit local students.

You don’t have to pay for independent schools. Why pay and complain?. My kids are in a comprehensive and it’s very white.

HKers are fleeing HK because of the communists. Look up Jimmy Lai and you would know why. Rich mainlanders have always send their kids overseas for education. The UK has a good reputation for private education. Hope that helps.

The Chinese children are not allowed cinema trips or sleepovers?

Indians in India usually value education very, very highly. And you are right. In India, people are used to paying for education. In India most kids, especially in urban areas go to private school even though state schools are available. Even people on the equivalent of minimum wage in India will take out loans and sell off assets, or all their jewellery, take several jobs, etc to be able to send their kids to private school. Education is everything. Books (and teachers) are considered to be sacred / holy.

I don't know about the Chinese but from what I know they too value education highly.

(I didn't grow up in India but my family is of Indian origin. Private schools weren't really a thing where I grew up but I went to the equivalent of a grammar school in the country I grew up in and neither me nor my parents ever considered me and my sibling not going to grammar school or not going to university. It wasn't even up for debate. Not even in my own mind. It was the same for all the Indians I knew in the town I grew up in. )

My own kids go to private school now in the uk. I don't know about other people but for me racism or rather the threat of it was a big factor. I heard there is quite a bit of racist bullying in the secondary schools in my area and if I can protect my kids from that I will. I didn't really want them to go to private school in Primary (as I said I didn't grow up with private schooling being a thing so I was pretty against it) but dc1 was bullied in their state school so we moved them. There are a few kids in their school that I know joined the school after facing racism in their old state school. Even in primary shockingly.

Finally, another factor is that there are some very, very wealthy Indians and Chinese in the UK. In my kids' school there isn't really anyone super rich I know of but definitely quite wealthy. I think about 50% is Indian and maybe another 10% is of other Asian origin. A few Africans. The rest is white mostly white British. A crazy number of parents are consultant doctors or GPs.

Is your school a boarding school op? If not then I guess these are mostly kids that grew up in the UK and quite a few of the parents would have grown up here as well. So culturally they shouldn't be too alien to you. In my kids' school everyone mingles irrespective of ethnicity but it's not a boarding school. Give them a shot. I think you'll find that you have more in common with them then not. And I would be very surprised if they didn't know English or didn't switch to English if you initiated a conversation with them.

You resurrected a zombie to ask this?

Oh that's a silly question.

There are already many many excellent American prep schools. But very few schools of the sort you're looking at in mainland China. It's different in HK, where there are still a lot of excellent international schools, but HK is changing rapidly in terms of losing the Hong Kongese culture and the mainland culture/politics being imposed.

I assume the schools you have looked at are in London or Oxford.

I chose a small independent for my ds, in a market town. The parents were a healthy mix of professional, armed forces, a few American forces on secondment, one or two Russians, Ukrainians, Dutch, Greek and two HK Chinese. Some boarding, some with family locally.

Try schools that are less "headline" and you should find what you are looking for.

I worked at a 'top', just outside London boys' public school for several years. At the beginning of the school year during the training days there was a talk for staff which looked at the future and the implications for these schools. The speaker implied that such schools were moving out of the reach of their traditional intake: children of doctors, solicitors (not 'City' lawyers, just local professionals), dentists, farmers etc etc. They would be priced out and only the international super-rich would be able to afford this type of education -oh, and a hedge fund managers, obvs.

Really sad. There was a time when professional people - or people who'd just worked hard to build a small business, or those who sacrificed posh holidays and new cars, could afford to send their children to private schools, but not for much longer, if things continue the way they are.