Historical drama

[Banananew]

Genuine question
Why do production companies use people of colour in dramas set in historically times? We were watching a program earlier set in the 1960's and there were a number of characters of colour. It was set in a very rural part of the country that my parents were from. This really would have been unusual/unlikely. So why does this happen?
I am not bothered as it doesn't particularly matter, but why?

Well, if I was in charge of how an Austen adaptation was made, I would prefer no actors with Botox or plastic surgery, no artificially white teeth, and no visible makeup. In most cases, whether they shave their armpits or not is irrelevant as you wouldn't see that in Regency dress anyway. Lighting is obviously not going to be the same as you need particular lighting to film and to see properly, but it should resemble candlelight more than modern fluorescent lighting, yes.
Obviously, you can't get things exactly as they would be in the Regency era, but you can get a reasonable approximation. Although, if I was in charge, I would put a moratorium on new Austen adaptations as we have far too many as it is! Casting makes much more of a difference. In the new Pride and Prejudice coming out this year, biracial actors have been chosen to play Mr. Bingley and his sisters. But if you do that, you either ignore racism, which I presume is what they are going to do, or you significantly change the story. I don't think that sanitizing history and ignoring racism in the past (or the present, for that matter) is particularly progressive, but there you go.

It’s not ‘ignoring racism’ or ‘sanitising history’ though. It’s just casting people. It’s not a comment on the historical situation, or a difficult concept to grasp (I wouldn’t have thought, but I’ve had to say it a few times on this thread…).

I have no issues with colour blind casting usually, only time I don’t like it is when they’re playing an actual person of a different race.
The likes of Bridgerton, Harlots etc doesn’t bother me one bit.
Actors of colour deserve good acting roles

But in order to have non white actors cast as say the Bingleys in Pride and Prejudice (which is what the new adaptation has) you have to. Because in reality anyone who wasn't white in regency britain would have had their lives massively affected by racism. So you either ignore that, or you would have to rewrite the story. In the same way if you adapt something set in 19th century britain and change the male main character to a woman, but ignore the misogyny and incredibly restricted lives women faced then, it wouldn't make sense.

But lots of places didn’t. I can remember the first time a saw someone with black skin in the flesh and not on TV - I was mid teens in the 1970s. I also saw my first Asian person around the same time when a Chinese family opened a takeaway in our town.

You ignore that the actor isn’t white. You are blind to the colour. It makes no difference to anything. I don’t understand why you think it would. It’s not a difficult concept.

Never watch Balamory. The nursery children are unfeasibly diverse for a fictional Scottish island.

I understand what you are saying, I just disagree. I don't think ignoring that is as progressive as you seem to think it is. https://mazinsaleem.substack.com/p/colour-blind-casting-as-historical

i don’t think i said it was progressive. I said it wasn’t a comment on the historical period, was just casting and was a fairly easy concept to grasp.

the black guy in BBC's Arthur for example

not sure which character or version of 'Arthur' you're talking about but stories featuring a black knight of the round table go back to the 13th century....

No it's a "moor". Or Turkish/Arab potential member. Highly unlikely to be in 5th century Britain.

Well I went to school mor long after and definitely had black Chikdren in my school along with many other nationalities.

And yet there’s evidence there were Afro-Roman soldiers in Britain in the 3rd century BC.

I agree with this. I would actually have no issue if all the cast of Pride and Prejudice were all of colour. It’s when a person of colour is cast in a role when at the time it would be an issue and commented on. It really jars and probably only works if you’re uneducated and can’t see how a person of colour popping up in rural Tudor Britain would be strange and a matter for discussion.

A case in point was ‘Wicked Little Letters’ which is based on a true story and depicts real people. The main character was the first female Police Officer in West Sussex Police, Gladys Moss. The actress who played her was of obviously Asian descent. All the way through the film comments are made about never have seen a female officer before and was she a real officer etc etc but not one person commented on an Asian person in a rural Sussex village. It really jarred and I ended up googling ‘Gladys Moss’ on the off chance she did have some Asian heritage and of course she didn’t.

In Murder on The Orient Express I thought ‘oh here were go again’ when there was an actor of African descent playing a doctor but it was commented on and made part of the story of why he was so grateful to his benefactor for supporting and paying for him to go to medical school at a time when this was almost unheard of. That makes total sense and highlights the struggles people of colour have gone through in previous decades not airbrush it out which is what ‘colourblind’ casting ultimately does.

Also in answer to all the comments about people of colour not getting roles research has shown that in tge media people of couloir are actually over represented compared to the National population. That doesn’t bother me in the slightest but people going on about the fact colour blind casting gives people of colour more work is actually ridiculous.

Threads like these always make me wonder if people of colour have been edited out of some parts of British history.

I have a set of books with an very interesting inscription from the 1740's. It's to xxx from yyy for something rather. I've done extensive research on yyy and their connections as they were a very prominent figure of sorts in their time, but not quite - think wife of a politician. Now the interesting part: the only reference to xxx I could find is a woman of colour (again well connectied)! The books would have been quite valuable at the time and have an philosophical content. Xxx was very likely well educated and definetly accepted in society beyond being a sevant or some sort of curiosity. Xxx also appears to have been born in Britain, but it's a bit obscure and I don't have proof of this.
Obviously we will never know for certain, but I wanted to put this out there for a bit of food for thought.

There were quite a few Black people in Georgian England, some of them led really interesting lives. I haven't heard of the person you mention, but I read of one guy who escaped slavery and ended up leading an orchestra in cornwalll! A drama based on that would be fascinating, but someone would have to go to the effort of writing something new rather than endless remakes of the same things.

So now colourblind casting is bad because it unfairly advantages actors of colour?🙄

I have absolutely no idea how that was your take from what I said and is certainly not something I meant or said.

I think depends on the context

i would like to see more historical dramas where the lives of all people were explored as there as some fascinating stories to be told

Oh take no notice! It’s purposeful bad faith 🙄. So tiresome. You made perfect sense and were totally reasonable in your ideas around this discussion.

This is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

The violinist was Joseph Emidy who was enslaved by the Portuguese, after he was freed he eventually came to live in Cornwall and became a violinist, composer and the leader of Truro Philharmonia Orchestra. The Cornish writer Alan Kent wrote a play about his life

Thanks I didn't know that! I wish they'd adapt it for film or tv, that would be really interesting!

What? Moor was absolutely used to refer to black people. Othello is another example.

It's not like the rest of the Arthurian mythology is completely authentic and factual - I actually agree that in some productions realism is important, but at the point in which you're accepting magic and dragons, then the argument that it's the black knight that's inaccurate is a bit hard to swallow....

Not all black people are Moors. Moors are of Arabic/Muslim descent.