To put him back in nappies?

[christmasmayhem12]

Ive been a lurker for a while but first post and I'll start this by saying myself and his dad are young parents. I'm 21, his dad is 20 and hes 4. For this reason I think we get slot of judgement that our sons behaviour is down to our ages and it's been a struggle to get taken seriously. Even by family.

He was due to start reception in September but we didn't get a place at the chosen school, he's now starting in Jan at said school and I'm worried, he's one of the youngest anyway but I really do suspect ASD, no diagnosis but he is behind. Nursery used to say he’d catch up but I don't think so. HV has always been judgmental of us.

He's now non verbal. He said a few words but he doesn't say them anymore, he's never been potty trained and maybe we did give up too easily but he does get really distressed with the nappy off. And it has to be a nappy, pull ups aren't right even though they're the same brand as the nappies.

My partners mum has been putting pressure on us to get rid of nappies, her other son is autistic but she keeps making comments about how he was potty trained by 3 and he was also 2 months premature, she's always been judgmental and things his issues are because of our ages and us giving in.

She said “just get rid of the nappies, he’ll have to use the toilet then”, except we did yesterday and only put one on at night and he got really upset and cried for about 2 hours. We managed to distract him but he's just had accident after accident. He’s even being pulling his pants down and weeing where he is because he hates being wet. He's only been successful on the potty once but that's because we managed to catch it.

Today he's been really unhappy, he hasn't eaten anything and barely had a drink. He barely eats as it is and is very still for his age and still has to have a bottle of formula as he won't drink other milk. Partners mum also finds this an issue and hence we don't see much of her.

We're going to have a quiet Christmas just us as he doesn't understand it anyway but WiBu to put a nappy on him tomorrow? I am worrying about school though. Finally he was referred a few months ago when we were finally listened to but that's years away. Previously we were told he would catch up and to watch and wait etc. I feel like I've failed him for not pushing more

I disagree. You’d be surprised at the number of parents who don’t talk to their child and rely heavily on screens. It’s a question to try and find out more to offer advice.

Please ignore this unhelpful post, OP. Taking about 'giving in' to communication via pointing shows a complete lack of understanding of speech and language development for a start.

I know how hard it is. My DS is 5 , he's autistic, non verbal and in nappies. His school (normal, mainstream) have been absolutely brilliant, helped us get referral for speech and language and occupational therapy.
However we did have to visit three schools to find one that could accommodate him so if the school in January isn't right you can consider moving him.If the school is good they will help you with referrals and maybe getting a space in a SEN school if that's something he needs (the process is quite complicated but they basically did the paperwork for us).
In regards to potty training you can't force him just because MIL says so. He obviously isn't ready if he's having constant accidents and becoming so distressed.
All children are different. My DD2 is autistic and was potty trained at 2 but obviously I've not managed it with my son. Put him back in nappies, until he's ready., don't cause yourself and him more stress.
It's hard when your child has additional needs and you need to pick your battles. Or tell MIL she can have your son for a week and return him to you fully toilet trained if she thinks it's that easy. I'd just ignore her. Your his mum, you know him best regardless of your age.

OP mentions suspected ASC and that he’d had a speech regression. It is monumentally fucking patronising to SEN parents whose children are non-verbal. Wow, really? We’d never thought of just talking to them to see if they talk back. 🙄

Exactly. It is SUCH an ignorant, moronic comment.

I was also a Jan intake (1991) as my birthday is in August but at least in our part of England there is no Jan intake anymore. I would have preferred this for DD1 who just started reception this past Sept but it is no longer an option. You either start in Sept or if date of birth is in the summer then you defer the whole year and start the following September. I assumed it was like this everywhere now tbh.

Edit to add - OP, this sounds such a tough situation for you 💐 I echo others about getting back in touch with the HV to see if they can help with some referrals for more support. YADNBU to pop a nappy back on tomorrow. Even without any SEN, DD1 had several false starts before finally cracking toilet training.

OP please get him qualified if he is on the ASD. My brother went through hell growing up (born in 1970), and was shamed throughout his childhood by in the family and school mates because he just "hadn't caught up" but was always struggling. After our mother passed away, I began looking after him and he finally got a diagnosis (along with a host of other mental issues) at age 46 by a specialized therapist who only worked with ASD adults. Seek out all available resources, especially being nonverbal, because he needs to be able to communicate with you in some form or fashion to make sure he has the ability to relay if something is ever wrong that needs to be addressed.

Heya… not a huge amount to add as lots of good advice already but my child took five months of concerted (exhaustive!!) effort to potty train. Tried a few times from the age of 2.5 onwards but had to keep stopping and then they finally had it cracked just after they turned 4 but it took a LONG time. No suspected ND but they had a very very rough start to life which affects them, just wanted a show of solidarity that I know how hard it can be x

If he has ASD then he probably has poor interoception and just isn’t aware that he is wet!

OP, never post in AIBU, especially for parenting. It’s asking for judgement when what you need is support.

Don’t potty train over Christmas. It’s too stressful for everyone and won’t work.

Advocating for your SEND child is hard work and exhausting. I’m used to professional meetings in education but advocating for your own child can be a nightmare.

You need to ask school to do a request for ECHNA, this is to decide if they will assess for ECHP. He will need an ECHP. If they don’t or won’t you can do it yourself. Your local SENDIAS can help or post in SEND parenting on Mumsnet for advice.

Make a double appointment at the GP’s. Take a list of all your concerns about your child (developmental delays, not speaking now, was he speaking and it stopped?, eatisng issue - is this only certain foods, textures or amount or both, any sleep issues, sensory issues) Ask for a referals for a hearing test, SALT, developmental peadatrian for ASD assessment, community peadatrian for concerns around weight and peadatric deititian for support with poor weight gain.

Make a parental request for an EHCP. Speak to HV about speech and language referral. Join your local SEND FB group and ask for the SALT videos your trust uses because initially they will make you wait months then send you advice videos then make you proove that’s not working and you are in fact talking to your child before they will help. If you turn up to the appointment with clear understanding of the advice in the videos and insist on more support you will have more success.

take advice/judgement from parents/professionals of non autistic children with a thick skin. One of my autistic kids had a speech regression and I was being dismissed, told he would catch up, implied my parenting was at fault. I ended up being incredibly rude asking what their qualifications were and SEN experience pointing out I work in early years and SEND and have more experience and qualifications than them in this area, autism has genetic links and my other children are autistic, I insist they put in their notes I’ve pointed all this out and they are still insisting on a watch and wait approach against my wishes. At this point they will make the referral.

parenting a SEN child is a fight for limited resources and a lifetime of gaslighting that it’s your fault.

that said I do think it sounds like he’s ready for potty training if he’s peeing on the floor to avoid doing in his pants. Assuming he’s ASD and/or GDD it will need a different approach and will take longer. I’ve personally always found the washable training pants best, they feel wet but stop the flood. They can’t cope with overnight but very helpful in the day. And switch to washable nappies if you do decide to go back to nappies- keep potty everywhere, let him see you using toilet etc keep all the steps just washable nappies not disposable. He likely will meltdown over it as they feel wet when soiled also bulky and uncomfortable. My autistic boy (with regular accidents still/soiling) has been in pants with me from age 2 because I always used washable. Nursery school and his father would put him back in nappies (disposable) because that’s easier. Even now his dad has forced him into disposable nappies because he doesn’t want the accidents. Disposable nappies don’t feel wet and are a hinderance to toilet training particularly for children with sensory differences

Well she can paticularly if he has disabilities

If only I had thought to talk to my non verbal severely autistic 15 year-old 🙄🙄

It’s my favourite of the absolute dickhead comments, along with “in my day they were just naughty and we’d beat it out of them” and “well he doesn’t look disabled”. The sheer stupidity is mind numbing.

Hi
I wanted to say I think you are both amazing. Few very young parents stay together for as long as you two have done and that goes double given that it seems possible that your obviously loved son may have special needs.
My children are adults now and while not diagnosed it seems likely that they are both ND.
My DS was very upset about being taken out of nappies. You have got lots of helpful advice about how to help him.
My DD talked and just stopped. It was two months before she spoke again but not as she had done before. I tried hard to get her help but no one would listen until the SEN at secondary school. She pointed me to speech therapy accessed via the GP. I would recommend that you seek a referral via your GP. Good luck

He’s also non-verbal with speech regression. It is not fair to blame op when her child absolutely seems to have autistic traits.

Fuck potty training right now. He's not ready and it's too distressing for him. In the new year, focus on getting him involved with the services that will support, via the GP, HV and nursery.

Parent of autistic kids. (Bloody old one) Professionals can be judgemental twats. (Unless you are male, white, middle class married professional. ) I've seen it as a teacher in the staffroom and as a parent. Family can be too. (And other posters)

Autism runs in the family. You are expert in your kid. It's highly likely that he has sensory difficulties with interoception and can't feel when he is ready.

Speech regression is really common with children who have autism. Sounds to me like you don't have a clue about autism.
I guess I just ignored my DS and that's why he's non verbal. Oh no that's just what you think.

To be honest, potty training sounds like the least of your worries. Leave it until the summer when you can try without any bottoms on at all and our a parking pool in the garden. You might get there eventually.

You need an urgent referral for speech and language. A 4 year old should understand Christmas and feel anticipation and excitement about it.

Ours were both late toilet training. DS was very difficult to get going. Tried and gave up several times. What worked for us was putting pants on under his pull-ups. The sensation of wet/soiled pants was unpleasant and was the jolt he needed to start being cognisant of his toilet needs and start using the potty.

Oh, and absolutely there was an awful lot of bribery with both of them.

My son doesn't have the same level of challenges as yours, but I don't think anyone can understand the issues with potty training when they haven't faced them with their child.

My son was so traumatised by our first attempt at removing nappies at 2.7 that he slept in our bed that night for the first time since he was 3 months old... He was absolutely terrified of being wet.
We have successfully trained him for wees, but he still ask for a nappy for poos at 4. If we try to force it, he just holds it and ends up constipated (even with daily laxido).

I think a slow approach is best, you do need to talk to the school asap.
Fabric training pants worked for us, it helped him get used to "feeling wet" without panicking and understand when it needs to go.
Also, at 4 he should be tall enough to stand at the toilet rather than sit down/use a potty, our son definitely prefers that.
Another option could be that he wears pants but ask for a nappy when he needs it. That's what we do for poos but obviously you have a lot more time than for wees so not sure it would work for you.

For potty training, loads and loads of bribes is what worked for us. We bought a massive box of little toys, and every time he was trying he could pick one. Then it was every time he was successful, then every day, then every week etc until he got all the toys.

Op ignore your mother in law you may be young parents but that doesn't mean that you aren't great parents and being honest there is nothing wrong with your instincts you know something is up and are trying to find strategies to help your son and even on here asking for help I think that sounds like a pretty awesome mum to me. Let him wear the nappies for now.Potty training can look a lot different with neurodivergent children it's not so simple as leaving them with no pants til they get it. It took a long time for it to click with our ds (now 8) who has asd but it did eventually click. Also important to bear in mind that with a non speaking child it's going to be more tricky to toilet train. My advice would be to go back to your gp and push for a referral to early intervention particularly speech and language. Be open with nursery about your sons challenges and see how they can support you both going forward. Some things we did with toilet training for ds was create a visual for him around toileting it was called Ted goes to the toilet with pics of the diff steps, there are fun videos about it too one that finally helped it click with ds was poo goes to poo land. But tbh I wouldn't be rushing into the potty training if you feel he isn't getting it and you know your child better then anyone else. Trust yourself. I hope you get the support you need and deserve and don't let peoples judgement break you. You are your sons biggest advocate and his safe place, anyone who judges a mum doing her best is a class a twat. Sending love and strength x

I’d try 2 weeks with pants over his nappy (so he gets used to the pants), taking him to the toilet often.

Then 2 weeks with nappy over pants (so he can feel the wetness) and taking him to the toilet often.

And then have another go with just pants….

Honestly, your post was designed to shame the OP. Everything the OP has posted about the dad’s brother being autistic together with her DS’s difficulties points to him being autistic as well. The important thing is for the OP to ignore ignorant comments like yours and focus on getting her little boy the support he needs.

OP - I hope you had a lovely Christmas and echoing others that have said to put a hold on potty training for now.