Drs' payrise should be funded by cutting 23.7% govt pension contribution

[eyeses]

The Telegraph today suggests that the Government could fund a significant payrise to Resident Doctors by reducing our surprisingly high payments into their pensions.

"Yet what is often forgotten is that these doctors enjoy bumper pensions worth close to 75pc of their salaries in retirement – and which are guaranteed to rise with inflation each year.
Doctors enjoy index-linked, taxpayer-funded “defined benefit” schemes, many of which pay a proportion of the recipient’s final salary from the day they retire.
Under the NHS scheme, staff contribute between 5.2pc and 12.5pc of their salaries while the state contributes a vast 23.7pc each year.
By comparison, private sector workers, who are almost all enrolled in “defined contribution” pensions where the value of the final pot depends on investment performance, receive a contribution of just 3pc from their employer.
The NHS is paying out nearly £1bn a month in staff pensions, with almost 2,000 staff receiving pensions of more than £100,000 annually – a figure that has more than doubled in a year."

AIBU - No, junior Drs deserve that we fund a big pay rise and huge pension
IANBU - We pay far too much into Dr's pensions and they want the money now

What Resident Doctors don't want you to know about their pay

I agree. DH worked in insurance and he had a great employer pension of around 8-10%, I think they were known for being generous with it. But now he’s only been offered the 3% in his last few jobs. I haven’t seen any jobs lately offering over 3%.

Staff in the private sector rarely go on strike. If doctors don’t like the pay and conditions, at least they get a gold plated pension with no market risk like the rest of us. They should be grateful and stop whinging, entitled fools.

Not really. I’m a lawyer on a similar salary to your husband. When can he draw his pension? As if I leave mine in to state retirement age my pot will be similar despite never contributing more than 20% (and for the vast majority of my career only 5%) with an employer contribution of 5%. I will probably retire earlier though. Does your husband get to take the full tax free lump sum too? Also if he takes his full pension half of it will be reverting straight to the treasury in tax so it’s not quite the amazing benefit it’s made out to be. It’s generally thought better for higher earners to keep your total pension at basic rate tax only and invest the excess outside of the pension wrapper for flexibility. What is your own pension looking like? - as a spouse if he dies you won’t get access to that full pot - depending on scheme only about 50% whereas I can pass in my full pot tax free to my husband.

Exactly, they just don’t get it.

When i read posts like this, i just wish the Doctors and all other HCP would just walk out, permanent strike or do as you and others suggest and get jobs in the private sector.

See how long it would be before you begged them to return.....

They are holding us to ransom with a long strike at Christmas during a flu outbreak and you feel sorry for them?

Don’t be naive

Private sector employees often have other benefits that state employees don't, like private medical care which would be worth a huge amount.

We should all have private medical care as party of the terms of our employment. The NHS should be binned. It’s not working. And then perhaps doctors will earn what they think they’re worth.

And those who can't work, or who don't get medical cover? Fuck em? Let them die?

If private sector workers are offered private medical care they have to pay for it out of their net salary. Also, private sector works have far less job security. It is almost impossible to be fired in the NHS, there are endless appeal options, not the case in private. They sick leave is incredibly generous in the NHS, very limited in private.

And when that happens the doctors will earn what they’re worth which is about triple what the UK doctors are paid and guess who’s gonna be covering that
You with your private medical care that may or may not be paid by your employer - Plenty of them currently go bust owing tax what happens if they go bust owing your insurance and you’re not covered?
but companies don’t just suddenly decide. Oh we’ll get that Insurance for you and we’ll pay out the extra couple of hundred pounds.
They deduct that off the Salary they’re offering.

Then private companies would leave the UK.

What all of them? Exaggerating much?

No, they wouldn’t. They would just pass the cost of everything onto you and create more companies potentially more jobs, but you wouldn’t be any better off
The US can be summed up nicely by busy doing nothing.
I speak to people on $250,000 a year that genuinely can’t afford very much in their lives. Certainly no travel. Or any kind of luxuries

Where did she say she felt sorry for them? It’s a five day strike at a point in the year where the service carries out very little elective work anyway. You apparently place very little value on their work anyway.

They have Medicare in America I believe. But seriously, the NHS model is not working for anyone. It’s shite. The CAMHS waiting list is about 5 years here. That’s a disgraceful waste of to treat an ill child and will make their illness much worse. We need to stop thinking it can be fixed. It can’t. Bin the entire model and start again. Now, please. People are suffering.

With that attitude, it’s no wonder the waiting lists get longer, it’s the selfish staff.

Child’s mental health wouldn’t be covered by most private insurance premiums by the way so you could be better off

Not working for anyone?

Well that's just completely exaggerated and makes you look a bit silly

I completely agree with you OP and have thought that public sector pensions need reform for a long time

. Back in the day the very generous public sector pensions were viewed as some sort of compensation for lower wages compared to private sector. That hasn’t been the case for some years now, with private sector wages struggling to keep up.

This is the solution I think - fine, have your eye watering pay rises now but the money has to come from the ludicrous pension provision for public sector.

Can’t edit my post apologies.
Childs mental health services aren’t covered by most families private health insurance. It would be considered an extra that you would have to pay almost another 20% on top of your premium for.
And then the minute you make a claim that would Escalate to the point where you wouldn’t be able to get insurance for it any more, wouldn’t you made a couple of Claims
So you’ve been no better off you’d be better off going private now if your child is so ill

Why can’t we have a healthcare system that works properly like in the rest of Europe? Why aren’t we uk citizens worth that? I have private medical cover, I’m alright. Everyone should have the right to timely medical care.

I'm a paramedic. Not many graduates take on the level of responsibility, un social hours and risk to there physical and mental health that we do (likewise junior doctors).

Our pay on the surface isn't great, but with the pension contribution (compulsory saving) it's okay (depending where in the UK you are), but this doesn't mean we shouldn't have a fair pay rise every year, and that should have been happening for the last 20 years, and hasn't, which is why we are now in this mess.

Nonsense. My private healthcare is supplied by my employer and the amount their pay is per workforce so remains at a set amount whatever I claim. And yes it covers my child’s private mental healthcare.