Long term issues when someone with MH issues doesn’t get help and is sheltered at home.

[Namechange12345432]

Apologies to sound harsh and uncaring, but if anything I am significantly understating the severity of the situation and at this point my primary concern has to be protecting DC.

We have this situation with SIL. Diagnosed MH issues, but has never got help or left home. She does work in a limited way (via a Gov route - not UK - that makes it practically impossible to curtail, despite conflict), but struggles with most people and is also extremely difficult to be around. If she doesn’t like a situation (not necessarily a predictable reason why) she will manipulate it at any cost. Rages out of nowhere. DC are terrified. I have drawn a boundary to protect DC. DH is pathetic and has not been able to find and hold reasonable boundaries, that would actually enable us to provide support. I would divorce him but don’t want shared custody with the potential for unsupervised exposure to the aunt a big factor (I have a lot of sympathy, but the rages and manipulation can only be described as terrifying - apologies to sound so harsh, but it is the reality).

PIL seem trapped by it. SIL basically controls any access to GC, so PIL don’t really have a relationship despite living nearby - we absolutely do not want childcare help, as DC could not be exposed to this). SIL also blocked home help from the house when PIL needed it. I did intervene/get DH to intervene at this point.

What were PiL thinking about the future. How could this ever end well? They are now reaching the end. There isn’t really a plan for what will happen. A decade or so ago I thought they were kind and protective. Now they are reaching the end it is clear the situation is dire. I worry they may just expect her to move in with us, but it would be decimation of family life and a legitimate concern (based on things that have happened) would be danger to DC.

It horrifies me to think this is not an isolated case. I guess provision of care is majorly lacking for people with significant MH issues who do have some independence. In this case when the family protects (shields) them and do not encourage independence it is at a huge detriment to the future of the person kept at home. Maybe this level of shielding is because of decisions made decades ago when concerns/stigma was different. Siblings and their partners will often have to step in when they have children at home.

YANBU. Independence has to be encouraged and plans made for a secure future. People cannot be shielded until parents reach the end, as the situation is likely to get worse.

YABU. PIL did the right thing.

Just read your update, I think separating from DH maybe for the best, but do undersyand your concerns re custody Im so sorry.
Your DC and your own peace of mind has to come first.
I do think SIL needs an urgent referral /reassessment.
It maybe possible to restrict her access to DCs if you were to separate by court order?? Not sure youd need legal advice.

This has to stop. You have admitted your letting your DH emotionally abused your kids! Wtaf! There's obviously much more going on with her OCD by itself doesn't necessarily make her manipulative, abusive etc she is too used to ruling thevriist and controlling others

Could you sit down with PIL's and DH and ask what their thoughts are for SILs future?
Don't give your thoughts until last, if they have vague notions her moving in with you, you could give your opinion that SIL would never move in with you due to concerns about child safety. As a compromise you could suggest DH moves in with SIL - and see how that goes down with him! Everyone is kicking the can down the road, nobody wants to make a decision. I don't doubt for a moment PIL's will want you to house her - don't drift into that situation. You"ve got to make it clear it won't be happening.

If you want to leave DH is there anyway you could get legal advice to see if this is possible with some kind of legal protection that he could have access but kids can’t have contact with the Aunt? Also how old are kids. This is a nightmare situation OP I really feel for you.

They will likely leave her their house as "she needs it" ... or your husband will just let her stay there

Thanks @Tretweet It is a complete nightmare. I am sure for PIL and SIL too, it ultimately children need protection. I am taking some advice and making sure incidents have been documented to move towards protection for DC.

Legally full custody should go to me, but and it is a huge but - any visitation or partial shared custody would keep me trapped abroad with a very emotionally abusive husband/ex. At best it would be a drawn out process with DH, who is frighteningly controlling.

Hopefully, but I don’t know how she would manage or react to help. However, there is a big push for us to be involved. But with the behavior around DC it is really not a risk I am willing to take/something they should be put through.

Unfortunately no chance now. A decade ago this is what should have happened.

Now there is a level of dementia or similar (unsurprisingly age and health wise), combined with possibly fear, and PIL will completely go along with SIL. Worse still they have joined in the raging on occasion. The situation just is not approachable. I guess when there is a crisis and others are involved I will flag it to social services. DH is not reliable.

You can’t control her but you can control your actions. I wouldn’t go to their house or allow dc there.
I wouldn’t invite her to your house.
I’d be clear to DH and pil she won’t be living with you in the future.
It’s their choice not to have engaged with services.

I am not familiar with the social care landscape in Germany.

however I can tell you that trying to get help for a mentally ill older teen/young adult is a fucking nightmare in the U.K. and trying to make the said older teen/young adult actually go to the help and do the therapy etc is a massive physical and mental strain.

going back to your situation, clearly protecting your children is the highest priority. Realistically the situation is likely to fall apart long, long before both PIL have died and there is any prospect of SIL living with you.

PIL will become frail and ill at some point. They will no longer be able to meet sils needs. There will be a crisis and the equivalent of social care will get involved. SIL presumably has no assets and relatively low income but is entitled to state benefits?

in which case I would imagine that once the first PIL gets ill - cancer or dementia or whatever - and her rules are no longer stuck to there will be a crisis, police may be called, someone will possibly be injured if she gets violent and state intervention will happen.

i think that chance of her making it through the illness and death of both pils without being forced into interacting with state support is low to nil.

so I’d stop worrying about her moving in with you because it isn’t going to happen.

in general you have more control over the situation if you stay married so this is the route I would choose (and did choose). How old are your kids?

How old are your DC?
You have to do a calculation:
How many more years until you are happy that DC will be able to look after themselves in this situation - perhaps their mid-teens?
vs
How many more years until one or both parents die and the crisis hits?

It may be that your DC age-out of the danger, and get to an age when they have the final say in how much they see their father and aunt, in which case you sit tight, carry on as you are, and keep your fingers crossed. As soon as the DC are safe you can think about divorce.

If the parents are likely to die sooner, your situation is much harder with no easy answers. When the DC get to about 9 or 10 years old they should be able to keep themselves physically safe (re. food, stairs, hazards, etc), but the emotional damage may not be preventable. It may be you have to divorce and have a court order about no contact with the aunt.

In my opinion and from some experience of toxic families, your bigger issue is your DH. He is controlling the level of involvement his family gets to you, the access they get to your children. All you can do in these situations is manage yourself and protect your children whatever the best way that looks.

Just my opinion, you have much better clarity on all of the dynamics but leaving your DH is probably for the best.

You can have far more control of the situation if he only has the typical interactions divorced Dads get with their children particularly in Germany which comes across, at least, as a very traditional country.