Poor life planning..

[pocketpairs]

With the upcoming budget seen many "poor me" posts, particularly from high/middle earners. I find it frustrating that rather than blame themselves for thier life (& financial planning) choices, they blame some arbitrary government policy changes, such as upcoming introduction of new council tax bands.

Example: Sister & hubby earn £14k net p/m. But their choice to buy a nearly £x.xm house in SE & send DCs to private school means they have £3k (approx) to spend on everything else. They could have taken different choices...£1m houses &/or move to grammar school areas.

Clearly this is an extreme example, but I really don't understand why a family can't survive on £4-6k p/m, especially outside of London. Up until recently, I survived on much less and managed to put myself a firmer financial footing in 40s.

Sure this means some sacrifices, but it seems everyone wants to 'have their cake and eat it'.

Everyone does pay tax. If you eat/drink/travel/clothe yourself, you pay tax.

Honestly the biggest 'poor life planning' as OP puts it, is not high earners having an expectation of luxury - they have worked very hard to achieve positions which warrant them a high income and are entitled to a level of opulence that that income should grant. It is only natural for them to feel resentment towards those not paying taxes.

The biggest poor life planning is people who are not in a stable financial/living position thinking they are entitled to breed, and the expectation that everyone else foot the bill and suffer for their lifestyle.

For reference, I am NOT a high earner. I am however, fully aware of my financial standing, and therefore remain very painfully childless (NTC).

I have empathy for the high earners who's wages have not significantly increased, but who's previously affordable mortgages are now crippling. I have zero sympathy for the likes of the mirror's poster child for benefits who - despite being featured several years prior discussing how hard it is to support a family when you require a UC top up, has CHOSEN to continue to grow her family?!

Correct. We are a rapidly declining nation alongside much of the world at the moment! But squeezing those people that do get off their arses and work hard whilst giving handouts to those who couldn’t give a crap and are quite happy sat on their backsides watching daytime tv and keeping Temu afloat is galling. Yes, we can all make sacrifices and stop spending, but by stopping spending, the economy goes into recession, ergo bigger issues all round!!

it would be silly to wait until you are breaking point to complain. Of course you make a stand, complain and try to get a change from the start, not wait until it's too late.

Not sure I’d agree with you that grammar schools were “better” than private schools - or non-selective state schools for that matter, but we’d have to agree first what “better” means - not being goady, some grammars are excellent but some are meh

Not paying VAT on private schools was not a loophole….you didn’t pay VAT on education materials such as SEN provision, university courses and books.

And why the fuck should you pay a punitive tax to give your children a better education?

You already pay twice for education through general taxes and fees

What’s wrong with having cake and eating it?! As someone who earns mw and bypassed the treats section today because I literally cannot afford things like cake until payday next week I think people who are lucky/ fortunate enough and yes who worked their way up can be upset that their great wage doesn’t afford them what it should. And I’m a bit fed up of people who aren’t on good wages rolling their eyes at them or telling them they should forgo any extravagance they should be able to afford.

And honestly I’m fed up of all the perfect savers making people who find things like managing money tough (me!) feel like they are doing everything wrong. These threads that are a bashing board for anyone earning more than me are getting tedious

my husband is self employed and does none of these things. Perhaps it's just the people you know.

Why should you get a vote in how your sister allocates her monthly budget? Her financial priorities aren’t what yours are, and she’s allowed to make her own choices.

Agree with this.

without the people paying more and more tax - the country would be more and more screwed. I think they have a right to be annoyed at funding the country and getting nothing back.

I agree that those who are high earners should pay more so I have no time for the “woe is me”. However I think it’s unfair to say having a massive mortgage is poor life planning - if your mortgage doesn’t take up the majority of your income it’s likely because of your age. All millennials/gen z who are home owners and live in a big city will have a huge mortgage unless they were “gifted” a large deposit by their parents.

You mention moving to area with grammar schools but the grammar schools massively push up house prices in those areas. We live in a grammar school area - our modest 3 bed terrace cost £750,000 leaving us with a huge mortgage despite saving for years for a deposit.

We have twins who were conceived naturally - we’d only planned to have one baby. DH earns over £100k which means we’re not entitled to any free childcare hours or child benefit. Nursery fees at my local nursery for 2 children are more than my net pay. I’ve dropped down to 3 days per week for that reason - I’m literally paying to work. Fees for 3 days per week for both children are £2300 per month which is a massive hit to our income.

As a result we probably do have less disposable income than a lot of people who earn much less - we have to live very frugally to afford the mortgage and childcare. We both work long hours in the NHS so I really do feel we earn our pay - I know lots of people earn a lot less and work extremely hard too. I also know lots of people who work from home and have very relaxed jobs in the civil service who will have more disposable income than us because they get free childcare and people who earn a lot more because both partners earn just under £100k meaning they’re still entitled to free childcare.

Ultimately anyone who can pay their bills and feed their family should be grateful and willing to pay more to support those who can’t. But it doesn’t mean all those people will feel wealthy or be living extravagant lifestyles. There are a lot of outside influences and it’s natural to look at others and feel a sense of injustice when earning more means you’re worse off. Unfortunately there is a “cliff edge” at £100k which is why many people react like this.

This is factually wrong. They didn't claim any tax breaks because of charitable status.
Schools that were charities and those that were not were legally exempt from paying VAT. Legally exempt.. not claiming anything under any loophole.

If I were 47 rather than 69, you can bet that I would have been taking an opportunity overseas rather than funding the welfare budget.

Only on Mumsnet—the people with good careers, who have bought nice homes, who want to send their kids to good schools—these are the people who haven’t made good life choices. Mumsnet never ceases to amaze me.

No one wants to pay tax but everyone wants to complain about crime and safety issues which are hugely exacerbated by inequality. Losing hope for humanity

Op, im not a high earner like the people you are referring to, however I do earn 48k a year. My husband is on the minimum wage. To do this I work 13 hour shifts 4 days a week. I work bank holidays, weekends, xmas. I live in a morgaged terrace house that needs work doing to it. Between us my husband and I have enough to pay the bills, buy food and run 2 cars. We have teenage children. At the end of each month we have a bit to save (for a 49 yr old, I dont have much savings), and we have 1 holiday a year to Spain or Portugal. I dont go out much due to the cost of things. If I was to get a pay raise, I would be put into the higher tax bracket. I would then have a choice, save or have my 1 holiday a year. I know people who earn less than me, who have houses in a perfect condition, a few foreign holidays a year, brand new cars, and 1 of these people is a single mum of 3, with whose kids have diffetent fathers and hs never worked a day in her life. Yet I am expected to pay more out of my hard earned wages to support her lif style, and your wondering why people are getting angry ?

And yet who is their money going to be funding? Not moderately to severely disabled people and their full time carers, who are criminally 'underpaid' for the job they do, often into old age, and keeping their loved ones out of institutions (which would otherwise have to be funded by the government). Oh no, they're supporting other people who have planned poorly and made shit life decisions.

True, so much of life depends upon who we born to, where we were born and how we were parented and educated during our formative years. .

So no one in this country should ever have any goals? No one should say I want to achieve X, then work to get X?

What if someone dreamed of going to France and pulled 50 extra factory shifts so they could go to France, should they not be able to go to France?

A lot of peoples problems comes down to financial illiteracy. It usually follows that higher wages = higher spending but no thoughts towards generating passive income or building up a buffer for a rainy day.

100%

I mean if we are critical of people who make poor choices why not people who have kids when they clearly can’t afford it? People who didn’t finish school or imporve themselves in any way? People who use payday loans or spend stupid amounts at xmas, people who seem incapable of working full time hours ever they. Plenty of people make silly choices.

Earning lots of money through hard work and then being a bit miffed that you are getting shaken down even more to sub people who make really really bad choices doesn’t seem unreasonable to me tbh. Your sister didn’t make bad choices but she’s now hostage to other peoples bad choices.

Not really. I had an excellent career and I was equally good at being self-employed for 20-odd years. But if the then version of me had been in the same situation now, I would definitely just have gone offshore. I worked, I saved, bought a home, put money into a pension... Right now to little personal benefit because my taxes are being used to finance the incompetent and inadequate. I don't mind paying my due tax share for schools, hospitals, roads and justice at all.

North Korea will welcome you with open arms 🙄