To be a very poor parent to two children

[snowyfoxes]

I have two children and when I have one I’d say I generally really enjoy them, being their mum, doing things tailored for them.

When I have both it’s a different story. They fight a lot and vie for my attention. Normal I’m sure but I don’t cope with it well. I get stressed and overwhelmed. I know my eldest bears the brunt of it as I somehow expect more from him (and he’s only five) he’s constantly being told off.

I didn’t realise how having two children would compromise the relationship with both and I am not sure I’d make the same decision if I could go back in time and never ‘know’ dc2, if that makes sense.

It is a source of regret. I can’t say otherwise. I know neither of them have me at my best.

I really struggled going from one to two, far more than I imagined I would. I think one slots into your life more easily whereas two take over etc. Mine used to bicker a lot & still have their moments but they play really nice together too. Life is much easier as they have gotten older & I can leave them to it rather than having to entertain.

It's difficult now because they are both so young OP. I remember when I had my second and the guilt I felt at not being able to spend as much time with my oldest (& yes expecting more from her as she was 'older'). They are 6 and 9 now and for the last couple of years they have been great. Sure they fight but they play together and have so much fun together too. It genuinely made life easier as they will play together and I will have time to get stuff done. The excitement they share together when we go on holiday, Christmas, Easter bunny, burthdays etc is very special. They see eachother in school and give eachother hugs (they don't do that at home 😂). They are also much better at keeping themselves entertained so I can have one to one time with either of them. I am one of six siblings which was difficult when growing up in a 3 bed council house but I am so grateful for them now. We are luckily all friends. It will get easier.

I can relate to what you're saying. My younger one is 5 and talks to me constantly and I can never hear or respond to my older daughter who is 8. I feel the little one absorbs much more of my time and energy, for example if the older one is getting attention the little one will (deliberately?) fall over and need comforting. If we watch TV the little one will sit on me and the older one will sit on her own. If I hug my older child the little one will feel jealous and try and hug me too. Its hard but they also have an amazing friendship and learn so much from each other. And I think its good for them to learn that they have to share things and negotiate, including you. I certainly dont handle things well lots of the time, but thats a normal part of parenting! Your youngest sounds young still- give it time and it'll get easier x

well it is easier parenting one at a time because you can just let them decide everything. But is that better parenting?

I think it is good that they learn to share and consider others and if you can help them develop those skills (NOT be the middle man in the relationship but help them interact well with each other) that is a good thing, that they won’t get if on their own.

Thanks. I don’t know. I can relate to a lot of what @Sunnyduvet is saying there and mine are younger which does make me feel it’s more of the same in a way.

don’t think I’m saying my younger one is a ‘bad’ child or anything. She’s lovely, alone. So is my older one. I love being with them then. Together I feel stressed and overwhelmed all the time. I hate it when the younger one is crying and screaming and my older one decides that moment to tell me some long convoluted story about something or other.

The fact is I made a mistake with two; I bit off more than I could chew and obviously I can’t send one back (which one would I send anyway??) but it is a source of sadness that parenting could have been so joyous and I’ve made it so hard.

Do you have family support? The reason we only have one is because we realised our limitations. I knew I could be a great mum to one but i think 2 would tip me over the edge. We have no family support so if one child was sick in nursery one day, then the other caught the bug a few days later and was also off school/nursery, that's 2 lots of work absence to deal with on the bounce and that would fall on me not my husband as someone in his work had to leave early due to childcare related dramas and was eventually sacked. My husband is 100% office based.

Maybe I'd feel differently if i had a grandparent who could slot in where needed or give us a break now and again. We don't so one and done is the way for us. Also she starts school next September so don't get me started on the school holiday stress I'm feeling right now.

I think with them being so young, this may improve in time. It can be testing when they’re small, dependent on their personalities. I have 5 DC, I had the older 3 in quick succession then a 6 year gap and the younger 2 in quick succession. They all get along really well but when the older 3 were small, I remember it feeling incredibly relentless.

Now they’re teenagers, I honestly think they’re great. Most people struggle with teens but I don’t have that, they’re all easygoing for the most part. The younger two are also not much trouble, even with the youngest having SEN.

My DD’s were tough when small, I found that stage the hardest. They were like yours and bickered a lot but also would have almighty tantrums, sometimes in public which I always found embarrassing. They’re lovely girls now. One DD can be resting occasionally, especially when on her period but for the most part they’re a good unit.

Im always amused at the notion that just because there are blood ties that people are expected to like each other. You can choose your friends not your family. This applies to children as well as adults. Adults can avoid those they don't like, go NC with family mn usually is keen to suggest it etc, children are stuck with it until grown up and everyone expects them to love each other. Weird. I know what Op means, unfortunately having DC is the one big life decision that you can't rectify when you make the wrong decision.

I could have written this post. It really resonated with me. My two are 8 and 10, both boys. They fight constantly, over everything and really fight now, getting very angry. I can't take them out together shopping or to a friends house because it's embarrassing and really stressful. I try to praise them when they are getting on together but it's quite rare. I feel like such a failure as a parent and don't want to be at home sometimes. I have to take myself off to my room sometimes to calm down, to stop me shouting at them.
A helper at after school club told me her boys were like this when they were young and they get on fine now so I'm hoping they grow out of it.
There is some good advice on here that i may try and use. My DH and I try and split them between us as often as possible so they have more one on one time.
Just want you to know you're not alone!

We don’t have any support, no. I am lucky with mine as they are very rarely unwell. Last time one was ill was last Easter and was very short lived and the other didn’t get it. So that’s something.

@Sartre I really hope it changes. They are honestly mostly lovely children when apart from one another but they have tendencies I guess, sort of inclined a certain way. Ds can be boisterous and manic, bordering on downright dangerous without really meaning to be. DD can be whingey and demanding (some of that’s an age thing I know) Apart these are easy to manage; together they almost seem to bring out the worst in one another to the point they are unmanageable.

Thanks for your reply, it's an interesting topic for sure.

I find when I say we're stopping at one people often assume it's because I don't enjoy being a parent... it's the opposite, I absolutely LOVE being a parent so much, I know I'm a decent one, and I want to continue to enjoy it and enjoy my child instead of stretching us all to the point of surviving not thriving. It's the most amazing thing I've ever been part of and I feel so lucky.

It's a bit like when you're drunk and your brain goes 'you feel great on five drinks, you'll feel even better on six!' when you're all hyped up as a teenager, and actually the extra drinks make you feel awful. Same with parenting for us I think. It's such a dream come true with one, it's nice to have that experience and really truly appreciate and enjoy it. And for my kid to get the best possible versions of us.

Its a nightmare trying to do anything calmly with 2 and your right in the depth of it but it is worth it for them.

The stress from the noise and bickering over toys, the overwhelm from them bombing around like nutters, the infury at them ignoring you because they are focused on each other is all them making a happy childhood.

Its YOU its effecting not them.

As much as my (younger) two wind each other up, play fight and bring out the 'naughtiest' in each other it comes from such a place of love... while it feels like its going to push ME to breaking point sometimes listening to them bicker or scream or feeling like I'm herding chickens trying to find a family activity to entertain a 4 year old and 7 year old I actually feel sorry for my oldest who grew up as an only child (infertility issue) without that.

I grew up like my oldest (decade age gap) as basically an only child most my childhood and my DH grew up like my younger two (small gap) and he is so close to his brother just as my young two are. Where as I left home and moved away when my brother was still in nursery, might as well have been strangers as we never had anything in common until he was in his late teens.

We both got to get the 'only child' experience of growing up and honestly it wasn't great, not because our mam wasn't great (she was fucking exceptional, we wanted for nothing except a sibling) but it was just really fucking lonely (especially if like me you are disabled and don't fit in/can't keep up/never get invited along with other kids at school etc... not every kid has the ability to be a social butterfly that can be accepted by strangers and make friends everywhere. I had surgeries and was covered in scars some time children would just scream and run away like I was a monster if I approached them).

My kids will naturally argue about everything but they also search each other out always and are the first to include each other or charge in and protect each other. Genuinely spent my whole life wishing I had had that. Even if they fall out as adults this relationship in the formative years is shaping them in real time.

And yes I know children can grow up to not get along, me and my sibling did and ended up NC in adulthood but its that EARLY life innocent shared development that was precious and missed out on not the relationship we would have at 25 and 37 etc...

How old is the younger one? Any chance either of them could be ND? I wonder because of the way you say that other people don't seem to have the same issues, the advice in SWR didn't help, and both of them are fine individually. (Which can be the case with ND kids if you are tuned into them and can accommodate their needs, which is easier when you're 1:1).

My younger two are three years apart, DS2 has ADHD and a lot of autistic traits, and managing his relationship with DS3 is a constant thing, at least it very much was when they were 5 and 2 (and younger). Now they are 4 and 7 and it's not so full on all the time. We moved just over a year ago and one of the big things we prioritised when choosing a new house was that they could each have their own space when playing during the day - this is a non negotiable. They share a bedroom, but there are periods of the day where they absolutely need to be separate. Teaching them to recognise when they need space from each other, as a neutral thing, not a punishment to be separated when they are doing something wrong, has been incredibly helpful.

When they were younger, probably the age yours are now, there was a lot of sitting in between them when they played and sort of translating their intentions to the other one. For example DS2 would panic that toddler DS3 was going to break his tower/train track/etc as soon as he came anywhere close. So I'd narrate DS3's body language and what I could see that he wanted to do back to DS2. I would also remind DS2 that we could rebuild any parts of the track. When it came to an intricate part that would be harder to rebuild, I would stop DS3 nicely and redirect him to a part he could build himself. When DS2 did not like this, I would remind him that DS3 would get bored soon and we could rebuild it how he wanted.

It also helped a lot to actively target some of the behaviours that I found especially difficult to deal with when they are together. The two you mention - boisterousness and whingeing - am I right in thinking that part of these things being easier to deal with 1:1 is because you can essentially avoid them? With boisterousness it's easy to bundle one child outside if you don't need to rug up a reluctant other child, and the boisterousness might not build up so much if they do not have to wait around for the other's needs. With whingeing you can get them what they want almost before they have to whine or demand. So in a way it may be that 1:1 you're avoiding these things, rather than managing them, and it might make life more harmonious in general if you can actively target and address behaviours in each child which are causing difficulty when you're all together. I found this video course good - the tone is a bit annoying but the advice in it is more directive than the How To Talk type books and it does tend to work, I have found anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLh9mgdi4rNeyEGNxBvNdOVlianDYgWuc9

As a final thought, I have an older child as well who is 10 years older than DS2, so I did have the "only child" experience too. For me, personally, I prefer having two. Although there is a lot of management, I just like the experience more. I don't know what it is - I think it is the novelty (having three totally different children) and the dynamics between them (DS2/3 more so than DS1, who barely ever interacts with them). If I can have a preference for having two+, I think it's clear that having a preference for one must exist too. I know that's less socially acceptable (though one-and-done is definitely more of a thing these days) and there must be a taboo around feeling you would prefer a one child family if you already have two. But if you can embrace the fact that actually you are more suited to dealing with one child at a time and try to drop the guilt about it, it might be easier to look at arrangements where you can use childcare/playdates/divide and conquer with DH etc in order to have more time spent 1:1 with each child. I don't think this is necessarily a rejection as long as it is roughly equal. I also do things sometimes like each child has an allocation of individual screen time, and I let them have it at opposite times so I can do things with the other child.

Honestly I think this is part of the point of having more than one. It stops you over-parenting them. As long as they are all fed, clothed and loved, you’re not only doing fine, you’re also giving them a chance to learn that they don’t need your attention and input all the time.

Let’s be real, kids can be very irritating. You plan something lovely and it goes awry because they bicker, one has tummy ache, one thinks they other child had a bigger icecream or whatever.

So you stay home and chill and they bicker because they can’t share, hate losing, want screen time/sweets/to go out. Constantly competing for your by time and attention and a bigger share of the sibling pie.

I had a big age gap of 8 years and mine still bicker a lot! And then five minutes later they’ll be hugging and saying they love each other and playing. I can’t keep up!

Just ride out this phase it definitely improves.

Mine are 13 and almost 10 and still fight like mad, every day. It's infuriating and complex in our case. We've genuinely considered separate houses. But they can also be each others' best friends and really make each other laugh.

Parenting is tough, challenging and often a thankless task.
I have 3dc; a 10 year old, 7 and a 4 year old. There are days where if I were to cry, I don't think I would be able to stop..... but, these days are few and far between.
Like you we have no support and my dh works a very demanding job so quite often I am managing all 3 by myself.
Please do not torment yourself with thoughts of not being a good enough parent to two dc.
The way that I see it (and apply to myself) is that you made the decision at the time that felt right, you made that decision with all the information you had at the time. Life changes, it sometimes gets easier or harder. Nobody knows what life is going to be like in 6 months/a year/longer that is what makes it interesting! You need to move on from those feelings of inadequacy or regret. Work out what are the things you are absolutely brilliant at when you are a mum (could be anything, baking with the kids, planning days out, making sure everyone has what they need etc) and focus on that and then develop your confidence from that point.
I found I was stretching myself so thin trying to be everything for my kids (mum, grandma, cool friend, dad etc) because of the fact that it is mainly down to me (no extended family due to bereavement) I became so miserable and grouchy and this impacted my kids. I am absolutely crap at imaginative play and things like Lego, but I am really great at baking/cooking with the kids, reading or listening to stories, teaching them new things and am always up for an adventure. I am messy, unorganised and often feel overwhelmed but I am really good at planning things and helping with homework.

Work.out what you absolutely ace as a mum, trust me you will feel a lot better and can build on it.

You have my sympathies OP - when eldest DC was nearly four, DC2 came along - except it was twins. I have an idea of myself as the kind of parent I was with DC1 - and I expect most people still see me as calm, engaged etc - but my day to day experience is of never getting 1:1 time with any of the kids and all of them speaking over each other every waking moment. I also can't do the educational stuff I want to do with them, which I loved with DC1 - it shouldn't matter, but it does to me.

This is easier said than done maybe, but here goes:

You don't have to fix everything for them.

Let them squabble, let them whinge. During their life they will constantly find people who challenge them and push their buttons and learning how to deal with those people is the only way to live a happy life. Resilience is one of the most important things we can teach our children.

My kids are a little older now than yours (9 and 6) but ultimately I mostly only interject if it seems like someone will be getting seriously hurt. Usually I just ask questions and let them figure it out: "Is this behaviour making things better or making it worse for everyone?" I don't stress about their relationship with each other, because that's their decision to make. I'm lucky that they are honestly best friends now (even though they still squabble constantly) and I think they are happier and healthier together than either of them would have been as an only child.

Work on yourself right now and your reactions and the kids will benefit. Our first instinct as parents is always to give a little more and try a little harder when we see our kids hurting, but what they need right now is for you to take a step back and get your head and heart in the right place, then you can be the parent you want to be. Maybe you need to see a councillor or a doctor for some extra help? I know I did at one point, but I got through it. It's OK not to be OK.

I don’t have any advice sorry but it’s nice to see someone being honest about this.

I see so many negative comments directed towards mums of one on here but I was one of three and really missed out on one-to-one time with my mum because she was always busy with my younger siblings, and I was the sensible oldest child who could be left to get on with it. I’m not close to my siblings or my mum now.

I would have loved to have been an only child and had the same relationship with her that I have now with my child.

I was an only child and wouldn't recommend it, I was parentified and bored!

My three may get a bit less of me or a more tired/ stressed version but I can't imagine them without each other. Their bond is unmatched and they are obsessed with each other - they'll have each other for the rest of their lives once me and DH are long gone.

Take a deep breath and think of the long game

I have 2 children but with 5 years between them and it's a good age difference. It makes everything easier.