To think management is one of the biggest factors that will make or break you?

[MyAmusedOpalCrab]

I know people say “it’s just a job” but honestly, I think management can completely change your life, for better or worse. A good manager can open doors, build your confidence, back you when things get hard and help you grow. A bad one can undermine you, stall your development and leave you dreading Mondays. I’ve seen both and the difference is huge.

I genuinely believe management is one of the most underrated influences on mental health, career progression and even how long people stay in a role. It’s not just about skills, it’s about communication, consistency, emotional maturity and accountability.

AIBU to think that management, not money, not title, not flexibility, is the real make or break factor for most people?

Agree - I've been a people manager and took it seriously for that reason. I was lucky enough to not have a bad manager until my current one and its turned a job I love into a job I dread doing. I still love the work and the people, and my manager isnt a bad person, just not the right person for a managerial role at all, which is causing them stress which makes them even worse at it. Not sure what im going to do.

Currently working under an awful manager after previously being under the best one I ever had. The difference is shocking tbh.

Our team is now enduring a toxic environment to the detriment of the organisation. Manager thinks he is amazing.

Absolutely true, and also true in my own personal experience is that the more senior a manager is the less likely they are to be focused on people skills. I’m in social work and I’ve been very lucky to have had excellent direct managers throughout the many years I’ve been qualified, however I’ve yet to encounter a good senior manager in all that time. Some shocking ones including current batch (Worst of the lot and it’s a low bar). I’m considering leaving as a result but I know wherever I go it’ll probably be the same old story!

I managed small teams for 20 years and now don't. I always had amazing staff, but am also enjoying the difference. Not sure whether I'm likely to manage people again. Certainly not with current employer.

It’s a cliche but it’s true that people don’t leave bad jobs, they leave bad managers.

Another that agrees- life is made ten times more difficult with either a manager thst isn’t on the ball or that is unpleasant (not sure which is worse either!!)

I love my job. However, the management are weak and allow a toxic and abusive manager to stay in role, accepting high staff turn over rather than challenge and manage one individual.

I am looking for a new job...

I agree, OP. I realise after years of managing I am coming to the end of enjoying it. I am now looking to step into a role that allows me to come in and not mentor or manage anyone. With so many changes in recent years, Covid, work from home, more social awareness of mental health (which is good!), I am not able to function as a social worker and manager with too many staff expecting therapy-type discussions. It’s time for me to bow out of this type of role. I think anyone that can handle all that or enjoys it and motivates their staff is excellent. It’s just not the path for me anymore.

I’d love to stop managing!

Yes. I moved job this year mostly because of weak and toxic management. I heard from someone in my old place who tells me it’s got worse and the whole original team have now left. I once said a polite no thank you to that manager when she demanded everyone do an unreasonable extra-curricular (that made her look good for arranging). She gave me the adult equivalent of writing lines. She also harassed a few who had weaker boundaries with phone calls at all hours and treated a new, young member of staff like her personal maid. It was bullshit.

For the most part I have worked for good - good natured but okay managers. Once I worked for someone truly brilliant and once for someone truly toxic. Happily, I got out quickly from the toxic one before she could do any damage to my confidence. Unfortunately, from afar I think she is doing harm to my old team and that is sad.

I think you are so right in this.
Did I work at the same school as the poster above?!! (Joke but school toxicity is rife).

Yes - I nearly left my job in 2019 due to manager. Thankfully manager himself left days before I handed in my notice.

I had a good manager 2019-2025 so largely happy.

Then got a new manager this year and they are not great so I’m looking around at other options again.

Everything else has stayed the same. Managers have such an impact.

I worked in retail and had 6 managers in 16 years. They like to rotate them. We had 2 who were really bad. The first was a thief who a few of us reported and he was investigated and walked away before he was pushed.
Then we got another one who just would not work the way it was supposed to be done, no processes done properly. Manipulating stock figures, not to defraud but to make it look like we doing better than we were. Even changed the way the shelves were stacked. Staff morale ended up so low that eventually 4 team leaders got together and reported him higher up. They moved him and he lasted about 2 months and they sacked him because he was doing the same thing again.
It was a good place to work because higher management actually listened.

yeo. I used to work in another location but left because of management, I know several others have since left too and they are struggling to recruit for that location now - even offered someone more money to stay but they still left.
inlive where I’m at right now :)

I think it’s a particular issue in social work. First line managers tend to be pretty good but internal politics take over as you climb the ladder and generally speaking people are promoted for their ability to tie whatever the party line is rather than their ability to manage people. I also see good people leaving for non-practice jobs, because of the levels of risk they’re expected to carry. So you’re left with those who can play politics, or can’t get a job elsewhere. Because of recruitment and retention issues you’ve also got relatively inexperienced social workers becoming team leaders and then progressing up the chain while not having the depth of experience they need to balance the demands of the job.

I agree with this. If managers only had to deal with staff who had good intentions to attend work and do the job they were getting paid to do, most could be fairly effective.
As a manager, so much of my time is wasted over those who play the system with sickness, expect a counselling session at every 121, get combative when I address the fact they haven't completed very basic aspects of their role and put a plan in place to make this happen, treat attendance at work like it's an optional drop-in and leave others to cope with the additional work this creates...etc, etc. I know this is all part of a manager's role but it requires a skill set that you don't get training for and can take some experience to figure out.

People don't leave jobs, they leave managers

Yep I agree. I interpret “it’s just a job” as making it easy to walk away if it’s not working out, especially where it is not your fault.

Also what’s good/bad management to one can be perfect for another, and I think it depends on whether it’s your direct manager or the leadership of the organisation that’s the problem.

For instance I am relatively new to my role, team is not in great shape for legitimate reasons and a lot of change needed. All but one of the team will give glowing feedback about the way I’m leading the team through it. The other one dry vocally thinks I’m the worst manager in the world for changing anything at all and encouraging them to work independently as from day 1 - they would prefer that I literally tell them what to do with everything they touch in great detail to the point I may as well do it myself and/or they can blame me if it goes wrong (this is someone in a senior role by the way). But in my last org the senior leadership was terrible but I could get on with my work and succeed despite that.

Nothing worse than a shit manager. I had one for years - terrible woman.

Bully, incompetent, unpleasant to be around, aggressive and a liar.

I do not hate many people - but that bastard is top of my list.

She’s still in post.

This is the truth but it’s ruining the profession, sadly.

@saltandvinegarchipsticksit totally is ruining the profession, and running excellent people out of practice facing roles if not the profession entirely.

YANBU. My manager is a narcissistic cunt. Most of the team is planning to leave, myself included.

Definitely agree. The last time I had a good ward manager/lead nurse in the NHS was 2003. They were amazing, but since then I’ve had weak, easily influenced inexperienced nurses, or toxic bullies. Sadly, atm, I’ve got a lead who’s the former, and a matron who’s the latter. I kind of wanted to stay in this role until I retire, since I commissioned the service we run, and have 17years experience in it, but it’s tough. I worry about it. But I’m also bloody-minded, and don’t feel like I want them to see me off, I want to leave on top! I shouldn’t have to feel that about work, but IME the NHS is a hotbed of problems with managers.