Husband dealing (or not dealing) with his parents finances

[Gl1ttrCr0n3]

Father in law died over a year ago, mother in law went into nursing home with dementia shortly before that. They have 2 rental properties. Husband has still not completed his father’s tax return, nor his mother’s, which he’ll need to do every year. His parents didn’t keep good records, so I sympathise that this is tricky and messy, and I have offered to help with it. Husband is not best at admin. Every time I ask about progress I get a defensive attitude. There were problems getting access to his parents accounts, issues over the tax return portal needing to be reopened. There is always something. Any time he does tackle this a dark cloud descends over him and by extension our family. His annoyance and frustration leak out everywhere. I’m losing patience. The task is looming and it’s affecting our family. I feel like I have to walk on eggshells to ask about this.

His mum has some savings, and the rent from the 2 properties covers some of her care home costs, but not sure for how long. Husband and his sister are not great at keeping on top of finances and tend to be reactive rather than proactive. I worry at some point that a care home bill won’t be able to be paid because they’ve not kept track. I’ve shared my concerns about this and tried to explain that it’s affecting me and our family. Husband says it’s not my concern as it’s about ‘his’ family and he doesn’t want to talk to me about it as I ‘don’t like his family’. I found them difficult, especially his dad. Husband found/finds them difficult too.

Context: his parents tried to pressure us into buying one of their rental properties from them so that they could buy a flat for husband’s sister when she separated from her husband. They tried to propose this as a great financial investment for us, with no regard or understanding of our financial situation, with a large mortgage on a house that desperately needed work, and young son. Thankfully my husband got advice from his financial advisor which was that it was not a sound investment. I had said the same, but feel like my views are less trusted than his parents. His parents have no pensions and lost lots of money investing in properties in Spain just before the crash happened. There seemed to be a pattern of making some very poor financial decisions.

It’s putting a massive strain on us. I don’t feel heard. He thinks I’m unreasonable and don’t trust him. I don’t trust him - after so many times of him saying he’s on it, and then seeing no work or focus on the tax returns until I bring it up again, then I’m not sure how I could be feeling trust. I think asking me to trust it will be done a bit unreasonable. A bit gas-lighty. Am I being unreasonable?

👆This. Get a professional to do it ☝️

Quiet word with his sister?

Accountant fees can come out of the rental income as a cost, and ultimately as you say if the money runs out the council will need to fund care. So it’s use it to make life easier vs ultimately saving the council money in the long run. Accountants generally cover their own costs on rental properties by maximising the deductibles.

Sisters idea might be smoother than yours.

I absolutely agree with all the PP who say get a professional to do the tax returns, eg an accountant.

However, the OP upthread said: "my husband got advice from his financial advisor..." so why not start by asking them? I'm useless at tax returns and one of the reasons I love my financial advisor is that every year we have a Zoom call, he logs into my HMRC account, I pass on the security numbers on my mobile, and he does it all. He's also trained me to get the necessary information in advance so it all runs smoothly.

Assuming the OP's husband already trusts his financial advisor, why not start there?

This is absolutely not how it works.
They can only be instructed by the person whose tax affairs the work relates to (or who has POA) and it doesn’t matter how nice you are to them, they won’t give you information you aren’t legally entitled to. Which is any information at all.

Yeah - I find it difficult to live with. I wish like others have said I could have an attitude of “his problem”. I am aware I have my own issues - we all do - financial risk averse and anxious and like to have clarity over financial stuff.

I swing between frustration and cutting slack. Or feel both at same time. He forgot anniversary of his father’s death. When both his parents were in and out of hospital the two years leading up to his dad’s death I encouraged him to go up and see them more regularly. He was avoiding the situation then too.

The biggest issue is his casual comment about him paying for top-ups on his mother's care home fees.
If he says anything like that again, come down on him like a ton of bricks. It is not for him to decide to spend your family money that way. His first duty is to his wife and children - especially his children's future.

How are your finances as a couple organised? Do you have everything in joint accounts (current and savings), or do you keep individual current accounts? Do you pay all income from both of you into a joint current account?
Do you pay for the household and children proportional to your incomes, or in a way that leaves you both with the same 'personal' money for spending?
Perhaps this is the first thing to get sorted, set up a system you are happy with, to make you feel more secure.

Then, you just have to bite your tongue about his mother's financial affairs. Just don't say anything. Don't get involved.
When he gets moody and snappy, tell him to stop. Tell him he is not fair to dump his moods on the family, and that you will be going out for the day (with or without children) until he can learn to control his emotions.

We don't know what your DH's feelings are or why he struggles with things, but I would suggest cutting him some slack. I can't actually explain what it is, but I found it very difficult to deal with matters relating to my parent's death. I found it overwhelming, confusing and incredibly stressful. Not sorting things compounded the stress, yet I still found myself unable to actually do the things I knew needed doing. I could sit on the sofa with a list and find myself in the same place a few hours later, having literally sat staring into space and accomplished nothing. I really don't know why this is, but it's over 2 years later and I can't say that things have got any easier. Perhaps he has an element of guilt, a feeling that he SHOULD be able to sort it out, because he's both an adult and their son? If he's aware you don't like his family, I can also understand his feeling that he can't share the burden with you.

Obviously if there are financial deadlines looming, things will have to be done (or they won't be, and fines will eventually be paid). Could you get quotes from a few accountants (or whomever is best to do the jobs required for DH), put three on the table in front of him and say, 'the deadline is 2 months away. I can see things are really stressful for you. I've already checked these three people out and all can do what's required for £x. Cut yourself some slack and pay one of them to help you.'?

I have just suggested an accountant. He told me that well yes,that was the idea… asked for clarification… apparently he has an accountant to do it. But he needs to gather the info for the accountant.

I’m both pleased he has an accountant, and wondering why (apart from it being none of my business) he didn’t tell me this previously. It’s just been defensive walls and bad moods and lack of communication with his marital family.

Also suggest selling the rentals. Unless they’re pulling in thousands a month, you’d be better off selling (if there’s equity in them) to fund the care home. You desperately need an accountant who can sort out accounts and take the pressure off your Dh/you. Get him on his mum’s HMRC account if he has access, he might need to go the POA route. Our accountant basically sorts out and sends us the annual bill plus we get on the HMRC account so we don’t get fined.

Whilst his DM has 2 rental properties the LA absolutely will not hover her career home fees,

I wondered this.

his sister about a year ago said they should put one of the rental properties in his name. To avoid this being used for care home fees. 😬
I spoke up and said that this sounded like it could potentially cause a lot of problems.

His sister also thought that they didn’t need to do his dad’s tax return as he was deceased and his mum in a care home with dementia. Again, I pointed out that the tax man won’t back off because of that.

Maybe those that have advised I just leave them to it can see how this option makes me nervous due to the mad / illegal suggestions being bandied about.

I’m so sorry. I will try to remember this more. I think it would help if he reflected and communicated how he is feeling about it. This is a struggle in our relationship always - he struggles to communicate his feelings, or possibly to connect to them. Barriers come up. And I recognise that I am very frustrated at this dynamic - it’s like I have to mother and coach the feelings out. Of course, I don’t have to, but I do. I don’t know why - some compulsion - maybe because moods are oozing off him I would rather the moods are aired a little and cleaned out. More cleaning up.

This would be deprivation of assets. Tell your SIL that it’s not up to the LA to pay the care fees of someone whose relatives want to deceive the LA so they can take the money for themselves once the person in care has died.

Deprivation of assets - yes that’s it. I did a lot of googling at the time and sent them information on this. I didn’t keep out of things then as it sounded so dodgy and like it may have repercussions on our family. To be told today that it’s none of my business, that it’s his family, after the dodgy suggestions that might have impacted our family, is galling.

AND that suggestion came from his SIL’s boyfriend. So he can get involved, but it’s not my family so I should keep out.

It’s confusing.