Is it me or is the council massively overreacting here?

[Thepeopleversuswork]

So I have just had a bizarre run-in with my council waste services department which has made me wonder if I'm going mad or they are. I organised a local litter pick a few weeks ago. I contacted the council in advance to ask if I could borrow some litter pickers and they agreed, so I picked up a huge bag of them (far more than I needed, as it turned out), in a big bin bag. Possibly my mistake was not to have counted them, but they were pre-wrapped and I didn't know it was going to turn into such a big drama, so I didn't.

It turned out I only used one of the litter pickers in the pack from the council (I have two of my own and other people brought theirs) so I stuck it back into the pack and a few days later I brought the bag back to the council as requested. But I'm certain I only took one, which I put back and returned.

A few days later I had an email from a woman in waste management services ordering me "urgently" to return the missing litter pickers. There weren't any missing litter pickers, as far as I was concerned: there was the one I used, which went back into the bag and was returned. The woman said there were five missing. I reiterated that I certainly hadn't taken five as I hadn't needed them. I checked around my house to make sure some hadn't been mislaid but there were definitely none other than mine (which look different). So if there were any missing, they were definitely not in my house.

I thought that might be the end of it but she emailed again the next day telling me to come to the council offices "immediately" with the litter pickers (I said I was working in an office so that wasn't possible at the moment). I reiterated that I didn't have the litter pickers. She insisted that I did and asked me "what was I going to do about it?"

I replied that as a gesture of goodwill I was happy to pay for some replacement litter pickers and the council should feel free to invoice me for them (you can get a bag of 8 for £20 from Amazon so they're not hugely expensive). Radio silence then ensued.

Three or four weeks later she has just emailed me again today to insist that I "urgently" go to the council offices with the missing litter pickers. I reiterated again that I don't have them, that I'm happy to reimburse the council for the cost of the litter pickers but I can't leave my job in the middle of the working day to be summoned by the council waste services department. She's just sent a follow-up saying "Please come to XXX today with the missing litter pickers or there will be serious consequences."

Am I being naive or is this completely over the top? The drama and the borderline harassment over something so trivial in the scheme of things councils have to deal with, and the suggestion that I'm a thief just feels really aggressive. I know councils are very cash-strapped and people do take the mick so maybe I'm naive, it just seems a wildly disproportionate response.

@Thepeopleversuswork I wonder if the bags set aside for different people got mixed up somehow at ‘her’ end. Still not your problem. I’d be prepared to bullet point the saga (as in ‘collected, used X, put X back, none missing AFAIK so not sure why I need to come there or what the consequences would be for an innocent party, whose only mistake is offering to pay for some as a gesture of goodwill’.

flipping nightmare 😱

I'd reply with, all of the borrowed litter pickers have been returned. I counted them out and in again. Is it possible someone else borrowed them? Please stop contacting me about this matter.

Write to her and copy in the COO of the council. Outline everything as you have here.

Tell them definitively again that you don’t have the litter pickers and they’re bordering on harassment.

I’d put a parting shot in about the value of volunteers in holding up the council in this current climate and that if this is how they are treated, that goodwill will quickly disappear, placing more pressure on an already pressured council.

I imagine that the COO will have a word about the litter pickers and you’ll never hear from them again.

This sounds like an email exchange from hell. I'm so sorry you've been caught up in this silliness OP and I don't think you've been unreasonable at all. If you can speak to them on the phone, that might help because it sounds like the email trail isn't getting you anywhere, but I think it's fair enough for you not to tolerate being summoned to their offices. That's madness. Also "serious consequences" is a bit menacing! It's five litter pickers for goodness sake! Good luck, OP!

Gosh I am invested now, I think I might email back to accept their ‘serious consequences’ just to see what this could possibly be.

You offered to replace them!

Email your local councillor; cc this person's superior; explain the issue briefly; ask your councillor to stop this council officer being so silly; say you wish to hear nothing more about it than that it has been sorted in a sensible way.

Be polite but insist.

It’s very strange that they didn’t ask you to sign a receipt on collection. This should have had the number of litter pickers issued.

Also the email threatening ‘serious consequences’ is ridiculous. I work for a council, and never in a million years would staff use such wording.

My first thought wasusthis definitely a person and not an Ai robot? If it is a person i would phone and speak to her. I would love to know how this is resolved.

Please ask for a manager to contact - I am shocked that someone would threaten you with ‘serious consequences’ and that in itself needs to be taken further! Nobody can use language like that in a professional capacity, especially not for something as trivial as missing litter pickers. You seem fairly put together, but imagine if that was sent to somebody who went into a tailspin… I know plenty of people who, if they received that, would be overcome with unnecessary worry!
Please report it, and do keep us updated!

It’s deeply inappropriate and unprofessional
not only has she not answered your questions and not listened to you, she has made quite scary threats. You’re obviously confident and educated, but imagine if you were a more vulnerable resident eg very young or very old or leaning difficulties and you really thought you were in big trouble with the authorities you might be losing sleep over this - make that point if you complain. Your council will also have some core values - quote them when you complain!

that said, I work for a council and I know that there is a huge drive to take on interns and apprentices who have learning difficulties or SEN of some sort - lots of schemes to help this community into work - it might be that she is young and vulnerable hence the lack of social skills so he careful with how you correspond with that individual directly!

I’m not going to poke the bear here!

@Unexpectedlysinglemum

imagine if you were a more vulnerable resident eg very young or very old or leaning difficulties and you really thought you were in big trouble with the authorities you might be losing sleep over this - make that point if you complain

Yes. I bump into quite a few elderly people when I do litter picking including one lady who is a widow, English isn’t her first language and she is in her 80s. If she was “summoned” by the council to explain herself after allegedly losing five litter pickers it would be quite upsetting. It’s massively inappropriate, whoever you qre dealing with, to issue threats like this.

@EternalSunshine19

You offered to replace them!

I feel like I have explained this two or three times already but I am happy to pay to replace them to help this woman (even though its not my responsibility).

I am not going to actually purchase them and take them inro the council offices. I have a busy full time job and a teenager doing GCSEs. Why on earth should I give up my time for this when this is literally her job!

If offering to pay for replacements is seen as an ‘admission of guilt’ why didn’t she just accept that offer instead of emailing demands for you to attend her office with said grabbers? That’s still not a reasonable response. Does she think you particularly covet these grabbers and are trying to get one over on the council by keeping them and replacing them with, other grabbers?

If it was so important to have each one accounted for then they would get you to sign something and count them out to you when loaning. I bet they miscounted or the bags got mixed up. I certainly wouldn’t be doing any favours for them in future!

Exactly. I can live with replacing the things. What I won’t tolerate is being accused of stealing, being threatened and the ludicrous demands for me to drop everything to “present myself” at her offices like I am an army deserter.

Bloody councils. Can’t stand them. I would not have offered to reimburse. They take and waste enough of other peoples money as it is.

I would rescind the offer to pay for them, however if they do purchase new ones then they will probably pay way over the price on Amazon. They probably have a preferred supplier which will be expensive.

In fact tell her to FO, stupid cow.

Do you know who she is in the department? ie. the manager or someone in the food chain? In your shoes I would find out who the waste boss is, make an appointment and go there and explain the situation, mentioning that you found the approach made to you unnecessarily aggressive and very upsetting. That should clear it up hopefully. You're just a faceless consumer at present, so dealing with the real you in person (but the boss) should help.

Even if you had mislaid some of their litter pickers, the response is absolutely out of proportion, and offering to pay would have settled it at once. I think I would make an urgent report about this to the highest person in the Council you can get hold of. This woman's behaviour is almost literally mad, and she might be having a mental health crisis. You could say that you are worried about what else she might be doing in the Council's name.

Op just email her back, cc the relevant director. Short and sweet - I was given one litter picker, which was returned. You have since harassed me with x emails. The matter is closed. If you contact me again I will make a formal complaint. Needless to say, you have lost one volunteer litter picker.

I would contact your councillor. Mine was brilliant when the council was being a pain in the arse about their cock up over a parking permit.

I actually don’t agree with the posters who say offering to replace them was a mistake. Councils make ‘offers of goodwill’ all the time, and they are always clear it explicitly is not an admission of liability, it’s a practical way of resolving a situation. I think it clearly shows you are acting honestly. If you had pinched them, why on earth would you offer to replace them? This is clearly a ‘them’ problem. I’d escalate to their manager and if it still remains unresolved follow their complaint process. You have acted reasonably and they are being obstinate and difficult. It’s unacceptable behaviour on their part.

edited for appalling spelling!