To be confused about whether hormones change trans people's behaviour or not?

[PrincessSophieFrederike]

This. As plenty of people here probably know, TW are overrepresented, for whatever reason, among sex offenders,,and retain male-typical levels of violent criminal offending. Law abiding ones still often act pushy & boundary-breaking in way more common in males.

One would think the female hormone doses they're on would blunt this behaviour at least somewhat.

So why not? Do the hormones have less effect if taken in adulthood? Or are many not actually taking hormones much, or even not at all (esp violent criminals)?

TM similarly seem to retain female patterns of offending. They don't seem to push their way into male spaces as much (though it's not unheard of), even though men would probably feel less threatened by that (though I suspect most wouldn't be very happy about it).

Would be interested to hear people's thoughts.

Can’t answer about hormones but would assume most didn’t take hormones until older so behaviour is more likely down to social conditioning. Boys are raised more aggressively, girls to be more submissive.

I don’t think oestrogen is the reason women are less violent. Most of men’s violent behavior is due to the fact that we live in a patriarchy where men are taught that that is what men do. TW don’t escape that by imagining they’ve become women (which is a highly misogynistic and objectifying attitude itself).

A lot of TW grow their hair, wear makeup, shave their legs and put on a bra and a dress. That’s it. That’s all it takes to call themselves a woman, apparently.

Therefore, there is no change to their testosterone production or the effect it has.

Women who take testosterone do have changes in behaviour - they don’t retain normal female offending patterns. It makes women more aggressive.

As for male sex offending, for most trans identified men it is a paraphilia and paraphilias generally occur in groups.

Not trans specific, but sex offenders who are castrated (as has been trialled in some countries, mostly chemically) do not show reduced offending but do show increased levels of violence in their offending.

Angry and controlling men are angry and controlling men. Always have been, always will be.
Try telling them they cannot have or be something and they will fight for it.
Plus many have sick kinks.

Everything depends on the person but I wouldn’t doubt it. They’re changing the biological chemistry of their bodies with fake hormones. I don’t doubt that it would change them somehow just like drug do.

That's what I'm thinking: loads of them, esp with the rise of self ID, aren't taking hormones & definitely haven't had surgery.

Aha, that makes sense re women. Do you have any articles or stats?

Re men : I know trans identity is often a paraphilia & thus occurs with other paraphilias. But surely being dosed with female hormones would reduce violent urges & libido to some degree? I can't see how it wouldn't.

But they still look like men with long hair and shaved legs

And I forgot the 5 o’clock shadow

Blocking testosterone can alter some aspects of male behaviour, and is fairly common when men are given hormone blockers for prostate canecr for example. Reduced libido, tiredness, reduced muscle strength, anxiety can all be attributed to blocking testosterone.

I suspect its this testosterone suppresion, rather than oestrogen that has the biggest effect on male behaviour during medical gender transition. But the changes are usually pretty subtle.

Nice guys will stay nice. Socialised aggression/ entitlement aren't going to vanish, no hormone will turn an asshole into a nice person!

You really need to do some research.

Start with Genevieve Gluck. She has trawled the depths of male depravity to tell the world what men will do.
https://reduxx.info/trans-health-authority-cites-castration-fetish-site-in-guidelines/

and Mia Hughes
https://environmentalprogress.org/big-news/wpath-files

The horror is out there. I’m reminded of a programme about 20 years ago where the police dealing with paedophiles were shadowed. One comment stuck with me “there is NOTHING a paedophile won’t do to get his hands on children”

And then there is the power trip of making women unsafe in their spaces. Blokes wank to that thought.

You only have to look at the way they behave when women want to speak about our rights to se that they retain male patten behaviours.

Many of these men don't take any hormone medication at all. They're just transvestites who get off on it.

Most don't take any hormones. Clearly hormones do change behaviour- anabolic steroids cause increased aggression. Testosterone suppression causes reduced libido.
But clearly a lot of these men are either lying to get a reduced prison sentence or trying to get into a female prison. Rapid onset prison dysphoria - with the Supreme Court ruling I predict that the number of male sex offenders claiming to be trans will fall very quickly.

Your faux naivety isn't convincing. This debate has been had here endlessly, all you've done is create a thread to confirm your bias in a place where transphobia is rampant. There are already plenty of nasty posts.

Hormones do change behaviour. We know that. Women who take testosterone become more aggressive. The effect of blocking testosterone in males on well known.

The "fact" you quote of trans women retaining male pattern criminality is not entirely true, the Swedish study is often misrepresented to assert this mistruth. Transwomen who transitioned after 1993 were found to retain male pattern of offending but before that point trans women showed a reduction in criminality that was considerably lower than the average male. What changed in the 90s I have no idea, but transitioning DID reduce male violence in the olden days. And you have to remember that it done on averages, not all trans women are committed violent crimes just like not all men are.

Most don’t take any hormones at all and their behaviour remains exactly the same.

One of my favourite examples was the trans woman who was being interviewed on TV alongside someone else - when that guest made a comment the trans woman took exception to, they grabbed the guest by the back of the neck, said they should take the discussion to the parking lot and that the guest would be leaving the location in an ambulance.

Not a very typical female response! 😀

Found the clip, it was this absolute unit of a man Robert "Zoey" Tur threatening Ben Shapiro live on air after he made a reference to Tur's male genetics.