Would you associate Urban with black?

[braceforcorrection]

We are making a group at work, can't say what the group is but it's for men living in the city/built up areas

One white woman said "can't call it urban as than it will look like it's for black men".

Aibu I thinking that's quite weird

Well, it may not have occurred to you, but it is genuinely a widespread usage, spreading out of the US via music. (Also a Londoner, not an expression I would use myself, but I think that, depending on what the group is for, putting urban in the title might suggest it was a group for Black men.)

Again, depends on context.

I am wracked with curiosity about what service you could be providing that requires the exclusion of suburban and rural men though, op?

Yes, these days (unless used in a very specific way, as a PP said something like "urban planning") is a shorthand for black, in culture.

https://www.urbanmusicawards.co/

And women, no matter whether they’re city dwellers or not…?

the opposite is country music.

It's like saying Beyonce can't sing the Texas song wearing cowboy boots because she's black.....

No, I can think of a few reasons why men might need a single sex provision, that bit makes sense.

You are still scrapping between life how it is and how you'd like it to be. If it's your job to clearly signpost your service to all men in high density living areas then the latter isn't a luxury which is available to you.

One of the main challenges I have in marketing/comms is stakeholders understanding that not everyone will have the same frame of reference as themselves, and how this might affect the message that is being put out

Ignoring feedback is is how you get those marketing/advertising howlers that frequently crop up

Well, that’s why Beyoncé did it

That’s not what the poster said at all! No-one mentioned education, class, criminality, lumping people together or anything like that.

You asked if the word urban in a group name might connote black, and people said yes in some contexts.

If you think language usage can be weird I don’t think anyone is going to argue on that though.

That’s a total non-sequitur.

”Can ‘Westminster’ mean ‘parliament’?”

”Yes it can”.

”What?? You think that only politicians should be allowed into in SW1?”

What? No it isn't. Country is not "opposite" to Urban. It's there alongside it. Just ask L'il Nas X, who had a huge hit with Billy Ray Cyrus (Old Town Road). Or, as you note, Beyonce.

You asked a question, many of us have given you answers. Just because you don't like those answers, or don't agree, doesn't mean you can change how some people perceive a word, even if you don't. Your collleague was right.

I don't associate it with being black. To me it just says city (as oppose to suburban or rural). If we were playing word association with it, I'd say "outfitters", and I don't associate that store with POC either.

IKR? 😆

I think of urban as being the core of a built up town, distinct from the suburbs and countryside/rural areas.

Every day's a school day and I have eluded and worked in London for most of my life. The urban jungle denotes skyscrapers and tube lines for me rather than being associated with any specific race.

It’s a euphemism, I think originally used by American racists twenty years ago who didn’t want to say they were scared of black people, so made disparaging comments about “urban youth” instead. Obviously now American racists are more emboldened and will happily come out and say “black people”.

Also used to refer to “black music” like grime, hiphop etc. It doesn’t quite have the same racist overtones as “urban youth”, but it isn’t a phrase I would ever use personally as a fan. The grime scene and the r&b scene don’t have much in common to merit lumping them all together.

It's been used in fashion as well

https://www.elle.com/uk/fashion/trends/a34220034/problematic-use-of-term-urban-in-fashion/

It's frown on now, but it's been around for decades:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jemimamcevoy/2020/06/10/heres-how-urban-a-term-plagued-by-racial-stereotypes-came-to-be-used-to-describe-black-musicians/

I agree that it’s the context. Urban to me could mean inner city, high rise, or could mean youth in the JD sports advert with a staffy wearing north face, it could mean listening to urban music which I class as music played on radio one extra (if that still exists) grime, drill, rap etc

There is a section of male society that always has their hands down their pants. You must have seen it.

If it was someone in the US saying it, yes I would make that association. In reference to the UK I just think of it as the opposite of rural.

@braceforcorrectionAs nearly half the posters on here make the association then even if you disagree it’s probably best to use a different word.

No, nobody is saying can't! But if someone says country music, some people will automatically think of white singers. Just like if you say Urban, some will think of black people. There's no rules, or guardianship here, just some words have associations. Just because you haven't heard of a link between the word Urban and black people, doesn't mean it doesn't exist for others.

Personally (as a Londoner), I wouldn't, but the meaning of words (especially among so-called "progressives") changes so fast now, I would not be surprised if some people do see "urban" = "black".

“Progressives” in inverted commas.🤣🤣🤣My mother used to use the expression “a speaking silence” Those are definitely “speaking punctuation marks”!!